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Can You Get Smarter?

nytimes.com

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Re: Can You Get Smarter?

#61

Post by moonchrome »

mikestew wrote: post #51
marincounty wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not saying you do, but I have found the general public vastly underestimates the intelligence of many auto mechanics--especially today's mechanics. I guess they have always been an easy target in movies, etc.? I have a feeling your dad could learn anything if given the right structure. Mechanics are underpaid, expected to continually learn on their time, provide $20,000-30,000 grand worth of tools; and the owner…

Once-upon-a-time-time auto mechanic, long time software dev here. It's not just the owner making a living, when I was active it was a decent middle-class living (25 years ago, could be different now). I'm talking professional, can diagnose your problem without throwing parts at it, owns a torque wrench and knows how to use it, not the vocational school students you find at Jiffy Lube. No one I knew was making BMW pay…

>You're not going to be doing any copy-pasta from StackOverflow when you're an auto mechanic.

That's an interesting comparison - why couldn't you use StackOverflow for mechanics. I don't know anything about cars other than they have generally have 4 wheels and use fuel but from the hardware work I've done on computers whenever I was troubleshooting stuff I would first look for symptoms then I would search and find random things to try on the internet. I don't see why this wouldn't apply to cars - people sharing their cases and being able find relevant ones could be a time saver.

Re: Can You Get Smarter?

#62

Post by auxym »

mbritton72 wrote: post #40
JoeAltmaier wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And Einstein worked in a patent office.

Kafka was an insurance something-or-other...

Boris Vian was an engineer working for the AFNOR (french normalization body), which he found boring out of his mind. The first draft of L'Écume des Jours was written of AFNOR engineering graph paper.

Re: Can You Get Smarter?

#63

Post by agumonkey »

mikestew wrote: post #51
marincounty wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not saying you do, but I have found the general public vastly underestimates the intelligence of many auto mechanics--especially today's mechanics. I guess they have always been an easy target in movies, etc.? I have a feeling your dad could learn anything if given the right structure. Mechanics are underpaid, expected to continually learn on their time, provide $20,000-30,000 grand worth of tools; and the owner…

Once-upon-a-time-time auto mechanic, long time software dev here. It's not just the owner making a living, when I was active it was a decent middle-class living (25 years ago, could be different now). I'm talking professional, can diagnose your problem without throwing parts at it, owns a torque wrench and knows how to use it, not the vocational school students you find at Jiffy Lube. No one I knew was making BMW pay…

Are there websites to discuss and teach mechanic repair informally like SO ? I mean with a few tutorials I could probably fix a lot of things in cars by imitating the video. One big difference though, initial cost. I can't download a wrench yet, and most auto equipment is costly.

Re: Can You Get Smarter?

#64

Post by lsc »

agumonkey wrote: post #63
mikestew wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Once-upon-a-time-time auto mechanic, long time software dev here. It's not just the owner making a living, when I was active it was a decent middle-class living (25 years ago, could be different now). I'm talking professional, can diagnose your problem without throwing parts at it, owns a torque wrench and knows how to use it, not the vocational school students you find at Jiffy Lube. No one I knew was making BMW pay…

Are there websites to discuss and teach mechanic repair informally like SO ? I mean with a few tutorials I could probably fix a lot of things in cars by imitating the video. One big difference though, initial cost. I can't download a wrench yet, and most auto equipment is costly.

so I don't know about on the professional level, but on the amateur level... just about anything you might want to do to your own car? you can find a youtube tutorial. Last time some asshole busted out my window to steal my laptop, I replaced it myself; took maybe an hour and a half and a $60 window from ebay. And a youtube tutorial. Same with replacing brakes/rotors, though those took considerably more time and effort. (have you ever replaced drum pads? Jesus. The video makes it look so easy, and I'm sure it is if you know what you are doing, but my god. Next time I'm letting the professionals handle that one.)

Even if I'm billing out at my full sysadmin rate, the cost to me of replacing the window was dramatically cheaper than the $400 my local repair shop quoted me for a new window. and considering that I pay for car repair out of post-tax money, the difference is even more dramatic. (now, this is silicon valley prices, but the window was for a decade-old toyota sienna, so it's not luxury car in silicon valley prices)

Especially if you are willing to go with 'craftsman' level brands rather than 'snap-on' level brands,[1] tools are pretty cheap compared to what you pay for auto repair, even if you want things like air tools and compressors.

All that said, while youtube is great for figuring out how to do a thing, it's less great for troubleshooting; but I think the reason why things like stackoverflow/serverfault is so great for debugging is that our error messages are printed out in text that we can search on.

And yeah, I've got an ODB2 reader, and for those errors, the internet is awesome. (I replaced my oxygen sensor at the request of my odb2 reader a while back, and that was also easy, facilitated by a youtube video again.) - but for "my car is making a funny noise" kind of errors, it's hard to search for the problem without knowing the jargon, you know?

[1]for auto tools, I really don't see much difference between the craftsman level brands and the better brands. I suspect this has to do with my skill level; I am very solidly in the shade tree school here, and I'm not ashamed to get the damn thing towed to someone who really knows what they are doing if I get in over my head, and that does sometimes happen.

For screwdrivers and other things that you use to rack up or take apart computers, I have strong opinions, and am significantly less happy if I have to do the job with my 'backup screwdriver' - also, I can tell you the difference between a phillips, pozi-drive, and JIS drivers and become agitated when someone assembles an object with fastener heads that are more than one of those.

Re: Can You Get Smarter?

#65

Post by copperx »

watchdogtimer wrote: post #52
kator wrote: post #13

My dad went from being an auto mechanic to learning to code when he was 63 and he's 77 now and argues with me about Drupal vs Joomla over dinner. It's only one sample but I'm convinced him switching careers extended his neural plasticity considerably.

The primary skill required to be a good auto mechanic is the same one required to be a good software developer: the ability to logically diagnose and solve a problem. The only difference is the tools you use to fix the problem.

What's the difference then, between a software developer, a mechanic, and a doctor? Only one of them has a white collar job.

Re: Can You Get Smarter?

#66

Post by meow_mix »

I wonder how necessity affects neuroplasticity? I think of foreigners who are forced to to learn a new language and culture at an older age. I can't help but think ones mind needs "jolt" to become smarter.

Re: Can You Get Smarter?

#67

Post by curiouslurker »

kator wrote: post #13

My dad went from being an auto mechanic to learning to code when he was 63 and he's 77 now and argues with me about Drupal vs Joomla over dinner. It's only one sample but I'm convinced him switching careers extended his neural plasticity considerably.

Btw, one of the most brilliant engineers/architects I met a Microsoft, now a distinguished engineer at Amazon, started his career as an auto mechanic (he attended trade school for this). He is also the principal architect of IBM's DB2. His name is James RH. See this: (Why Amazon Hired a Car Mechanic to Run Its Cloud) http://www.wired.com/2013/02/james-hamilton-amazon/

Re: Can You Get Smarter?

#68

Post by weinzierl »

copperx wrote: post #65
watchdogtimer wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The primary skill required to be a good auto mechanic is the same one required to be a good software developer: the ability to logically diagnose and solve a problem. The only difference is the tools you use to fix the problem.

What's the difference then, between a software developer, a mechanic, and a doctor? Only one of them has a white collar job.

Serious question: Is a doctor really considered a blue collar worker?
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