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The US is winning the AI race where it matters most: commercialization

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Re: The US is winning the AI race where it matters most: commercialization

#591

Post by dgb23 »

jgord wrote: post #326
blahblaher wrote: post #264

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because the US cannot imagine anything else. Everything is a War, and the US must always win..

it would be nice if they declared War against global climate change.

Climate change is too soft of a term. Maybe that's why it doesn't interest people who like to declare war on things.

The targeted term must be something that is clearly human made, something that sounds undeniably bad and something that is easily understood by everyone at first glance:

_War on Pollution_

Nature is good, pollution is bad. People who pollute are _obviously bad_ and they do bad things. Pollution is wasteful and ugly. Yuck!

Also it's more general than climate change. Ocean plastic is also bad. Chemical, electronic and light pollution etc.

The people who think of chemtrails and 5g waves. They really hate pollution so much, they see it everywhere. Give them a war that they can join in.

Re: The US is winning the AI race where it matters most: commercialization

#592

Post by khriss »

yamillove wrote: post #550
khriss wrote: post #522

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> its no accident that the U.S. is the number one economy Sure, it's the largest by GDP, but how much of that GDP is filtering down to the regular people? Are Americans, on average happier and have better life outcomes than other developed nations?

So much that millions of people risk their lives or leave their families to come to this country. By this objective metric, it's literally the best country in the world's history. Is there another country that comes close?

If you read my comment, I asked if Americans are happier than people in developed countries. How many million Europeans, Canadians or Australians are risking their lives to come to the US?

Sure, if you're from say, Haiti, even the US will look very attractive, but the bar is pretty low there, wouldn't you say?

Re: The US is winning the AI race where it matters most: commercialization

#593

Post by tom2026hn »

StevenWaterman wrote: post #83
UltraSane wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If anyone actually DOES invent ASI and doesn't share it then EVERYONE ELSE will never stop trying to steal it.

If you have ASI that follows instructions, you can just instruct it to not get stolen and then it won't get stolen. Most logic / intuition breaks down with ASI.

The challenge of alignment: it is virtually impossible to define a perfect objective, there is always a way to circumvent it. Human values are not uniform, let alone when expressed in a way that AI can understand.

Re: The US is winning the AI race where it matters most: commercialization

#594

Post by well_ackshually »

argomo wrote: post #397
GolfPopper wrote: post #200

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> the main question for me is, why is this a war? It's a war because the hinted promise behind the hype that the first organization to reach some as-yet-entirely-theoretical AGI that can bootstrap itself to godlike capabilities will then Install Planetary Overlord* and rule the world as near-deities themselves, with the rest of the (surviving) human race as their slaves. I think it's a nonsensical idea, but that's th…

Not everybody thinks it's nonsensical. Here's a different take: If Anyone Builds It, Everyone Dies https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/If_Anyone_Builds_It,_Everyone_...

Yudkowski is a clown, the local crackhead in your street is probably more accurate and less insane than him.

Re: The US is winning the AI race where it matters most: commercialization

#595

Post by ben_w »

trhway wrote: post #588
ben_w wrote: post #585

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Asserting the contrary is not an argument. Nothing prevents SpaceX or anyone else from buying up the right to put these things on cheap desert land. They don't even need to own the land, just the right to wheel these things out on a trailer or a helicopter and leave them there. A desert is significantly less harsh than space. If your radiator is sized for space, it's overkill in an atmosphere. And for your edit: http…

>If your radiator is sized for space, it's overkill in an atmosphere. no. Again totally wrong. The 20-40C air surrounding the radiator radiates at the radiator too. This is why a human immediately gets stone cold in space while not in the atmosphere - our body radiates away about 900W and receives 800W+ back from the atmosphere - our internal heat 'generation has to cover only the difference - less than 100W usually.…

> > The planet underneath anything in low orbit also does this, making this argument irrelevant.

> no. Again, totally wrong. You've just stated that a human in LEO wouldn't get immediately cold when exposed to space. Just think about it for a second. And after that plug the numbers in thermodynamic calculator. You'll see your error.

I already did before previous comment. I was also considering adding "don't forget evaporative cooling for human bodily fluids" to previous comment, but it seemed an irrelevant tangent to discussing data centres.

Now, if you plug the mass of a human and the specific heat capacity of water into a thermodynamic calculator, tell me how long it would take for a human to cool one degree?

https://www.wolframalpha.com/input?i=%2870+Kg+*+%28specific+...

And that's with the 1 kW radiative losses from being in shadow far enough from Earth to not get meaningful thermal radiation from the planet itself. Even at 500 km, thermal radiation from Earth will still add 200 W/m^2. This is comparable to the thermal paint previously mentioned, whose peak emissivity (and by extension absorption) is chosen to be a different wavelength than the thermal emission of air temperature.

> >Likewise, the fact that convection exists even without the adjective "forced".

> no. Again, wrong. Non-forced convection is pretty small. Use the calculator.

I did, for both humans and GPUs, you saw the results. Humans are the wrong reference class.

In your own words, "Just think about it for a second": a human in humid 40°C air is in immediate danger because then all the sources of cooling have been blocked off. Radiation becomes balanced, I said humid to block off evaporation. Conduction and convection there have the same problem there as radiation. A GPU wouldn't have a problem with 40°C ambient, because it will still be radiating heat, conducting heat, and by conducting heat to the air specifically also convecting it away.

Re: The US is winning the AI race where it matters most: commercialization

#596

Post by trhway »

onion2k wrote: post #566
trhway wrote: post #360

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Planetary Overlord* AGI is nice, yet not necessary. The orbit filled with Starlink descendants and datacenters will be the it. Anybody else wanting to get there would have to get permission. SpaceX/Musk have all the components for it to happen - from Starship to AI (including the army of robots on the ground). The governmental power/sovereignty of US will be used as a stepping stone (that is the strategy described i…

Anybody else wanting to get there would have to get permission. The USA, China, and Russia have all successfully tested anti-satellite weapons. If anything, any company that operates a constellation of space-based data centres would need 'permission' to keep them working.

beside of how easy it is to destroy from orbit the anti-satellite missiles coming out from the atmosphere, you're probably missing the fact that any object in orbit is basically a warhead with TNT equivalent of at least 6x its mass. For example the 150 tons payload of just one Starship will have close to 1 kiloton TNT equivalent - 5% of Hiroshima - if dropped from orbit.

Re: The US is winning the AI race where it matters most: commercialization

#597

Post by keyringlight »

roenxi wrote: post #581
ben_w wrote: post #568

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm reminded of a comic about global warming, "What if it's a big hoax and we create a better world for nothing?": https://climateactionreserve.org/blog/2012/08/31/environment... "What if AI doom is all fear-mongering, and we create AI less prone to make up dangerous stuff or mistake buggy goals for real ones" (which is what alignment is) "for nothing?" Even if Yudkowsky is autistic, you're muddling the condition. Au…

> I'm reminded of a comic about global warming, "What if it's a big hoax and we create a better world for nothing?": https://climateactionreserve.org/blog/2012/08/31/environment ... The people who've made the biggest contribution to creating a better world over the last 50 years have been the Chinese; powered largely by coal and petroleum. And in one of the most ironic results in the 21st century, they're now the lea…

Something that has been largely forgotten about is that it used to be routine to see pictures of smoggy Chinese and Asian cities, this was a problem for them that they solved. I can't help thinking we can't get this kind of preventative action on any large scale, we need to have severe issues first and that's not accounting for longer term/cumulative effects.

Re: The US is winning the AI race where it matters most: commercialization

#598

Post by amarcheschi »

well_ackshually wrote: post #594
argomo wrote: post #397

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not everybody thinks it's nonsensical. Here's a different take: If Anyone Builds It, Everyone Dies https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/If_Anyone_Builds_It,_Everyone_...

Yudkowski is a clown, the local crackhead in your street is probably more accurate and less insane than him.

At this point we should have had Ai induced apocalypse a few times according to him

Re: The US is winning the AI race where it matters most: commercialization

#599

Post by exe34 »

Andrex wrote: post #435
exe34 wrote: post #297

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Before AGI can choose for itself, it will depend on its creators to decide what it values and how it behaves. We can see how that works whenever grok gets the answer factual.

Am I the only one seeing the very obvious parallels to child rearing here...

It's exactly like child-rearing, except you get to put a zapper in their head and any time they try to say something you don't like, you zap them. Watch "thinking mode" squirm when you ask them awkward questions.
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