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A dad took photos of his toddler for a doctor – Google flagged him as a criminal

nytimes.com

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Re: A dad took photos of his toddler for a doctor – Google flagged him as a criminal

#591

Post by detaro »

ComputerGuru wrote: post #577
hedora wrote: post #454

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They cancelled the CSAM scanning project. In contrast, Google has been doing CSAM (and apparently AI porn detection) for years. Also, the bone-headed Apple plan had safeguards that would have prevented the victim in the article from losing their account. The two policies aren't remotely comparable.

You’re right, they’re not comparable: Apple was going to be scanning for CSAM on your device, without the photos even reaching their servers (by uploading a backup, texting a copy, etc). Google, so far as I can tell and as corroborated by the article, doesn’t do that. Apple and Google both already scan anything uploaded to your Photos account for CSAM and report to authorities.

No,Apple's proposal was for only scanning stuff that was being uploaded to their servers. And only matching hashes with known material, not general "nude child!" detection.

While there's problems with that too, it is a better design than what Google does.

Re: A dad took photos of his toddler for a doctor – Google flagged him as a criminal

#592

Post by riedel »

Nemo_bis wrote: post #418
elif wrote: post #276

From my travels, my impression has been that America in particular treats child nudity as completely, unexceptionally obscene, beyond even adult nudity. Compared to a beach in Europe, where nearly half of children under 2 run naked, there seems to be no grey area or minimum acceptability in the US. It makes me wonder if our hypersexualized treatment of child nudity /actively contributes/ to the sexualization of child…

Yet all these upload filters have been pushed by the European Commission... Otherwise Google may have never adopted them. Current chapter is "chat control". https://www.patrick-breyer.de/en/posts/messaging-and-chat-co...

It was the US industry lobbying at the EC (which seemed to be admittedly an easy target) [1]

[1] https://netzpolitik.org/2022/dude-wheres-my-privacy-how-a-ho...

Re: A dad took photos of his toddler for a doctor – Google flagged him as a criminal

#593

Post by SergeAx »

pas wrote: post #417
SergeAx wrote: post #139

> Mark spoke with a lawyer about suing Google and how much it might cost. > “I decided it was probably not worth $7,000,” he said. I believe it is one of the roots of the problem. How is it even possible that getting justice in court in such a trivial case costs about three months of median income?

Well, it's really not straightforward to know what would be the outcome of such a lawsuit. Google's ToS is one thing but the main point is that random user uploading family photos is not a protected group, so Google refusing service is very much their right. The state usually cannot force otherwise.

I get "How much suing is" doesn't imply winning the case, it is just a price of getting case to court.

Re: A dad took photos of his toddler for a doctor – Google flagged him as a criminal

#594

Post by [deleted] »

hulitu wrote: post #391
jongjong wrote: post #315

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Haha yeah, in Europe there are often naked children running around at the beach. In Germany, there are places (especially lakes) where everyone is walking around, swimming and sunbathing naked - Sometimes the whole family. For me it was quite a shock initially but now I think it's fine.

People naked: ok. Pictures: nok.

[deleted]

Re: A dad took photos of his toddler for a doctor – Google flagged him as a criminal

#595

Post by riedel »

hulitu wrote: post #391
jongjong wrote: post #315

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Haha yeah, in Europe there are often naked children running around at the beach. In Germany, there are places (especially lakes) where everyone is walking around, swimming and sunbathing naked - Sometimes the whole family. For me it was quite a shock initially but now I think it's fine.

People naked: ok. Pictures: nok.

50% of my childhood pictures ( all from beaches in the Netherlands) would be lost (actually my aunt already destroyed some living in the UK and felling pressured for some reason) .

I find it disturbing attributing particularly sexuality to children (actually I find a lot of adult looking clothes more disturbing than a nude child).

I know that there is people with sexual disorders (I would strongly argue that pedophilic arousal is one), that commit serious crimes. I also do not advocate publishing any nonconsensual pictures on the internet.

However disallowing something just because it can be abused is rediculous. Banning this guy protects nobody from nothing. Yes they could have blocked the upload of the image to the cloud (I would be happy to locally install any nude detection AI that does not communicate with the cloud. Even something that ask me if I have consent feom all identifiable persons in an image is fine for me. I think the father would actually have been happy about this. No need for manual inspection.)

Re: A dad took photos of his toddler for a doctor – Google flagged him as a criminal

#596

Post by kortilla »

Valakas_ wrote: post #554
jongjong wrote: post #315

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Haha yeah, in Europe there are often naked children running around at the beach. In Germany, there are places (especially lakes) where everyone is walking around, swimming and sunbathing naked - Sometimes the whole family. For me it was quite a shock initially but now I think it's fine.

I find that a bit weird tbh. I mean, if we look at human tribes throughout the world/history, and even what is the most common nowadays in african tribes which maintain their dressing habits, they usually cover their genitals. It indicates to me it is human nature to do that. It seems to me, in some countries for several reasons, they are going against the grain, purely out of culture. But there's something weird abo…

You’re confusing people who are naked in public in some special occasions with nudists. The tribes you speak of are not covered 100% of the time in public either.

Re: A dad took photos of his toddler for a doctor – Google flagged him as a criminal

#597

Post by engineer_dude »

This is why I don't have a Dropbox account anymore.

I am extremely fortunate that the account that was deleted without recourse only contained data I had copies of on my hard drive, and to my knowledge law enforcement isn't involved.

The article fails to mention the stress and trauma of being accused of having CSAM. That remains to this day ... I'm posting from an alt because even the false accusation carries a potentially career and family destroying stigma.

Re: A dad took photos of his toddler for a doctor – Google flagged him as a criminal

#598

Post by sreevisakh »

MikePlacid wrote: post #545
sreevisakh wrote: post #475

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Honesty, I wish self hosting was easy enough for ordinary people to do. Then there would be no reason to recommend people to fragment their digital life among dozens of ad-funded SaaS platforms. There is no reason why it has to be so hard. But not enough effort has gone into developing such systems due to obvious reasons. Sandstorm project, for example pioneered a model where users could deploy web apps like they wou…

> Honesty, I wish self hosting was easy enough for ordinary people to do. Synology Diskstations are rather easy to setup and not very expensive.

Thank you for the pointer! Definitely something worth looking deeper into. However, I was talking more about the software side of things - so that we won't be locked into a hardware platform. That said, they do have an idea in the right direction.

Re: A dad took photos of his toddler for a doctor – Google flagged him as a criminal

#599

Post by sreevisakh »

nguyenkien wrote: post #558
sreevisakh wrote: post #469

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The biggest problem with Play store is that many apps are geographically restricted. That includes banking and public transport apps. Some apps are restricted without even the knowledge of the developer. Most of those apps have no good reason at all to be restricted like that. Such apps often cannot be accessed through Aurora. Sadly, there are no laws or provisions to challenge such unethical tactics. Using Google's…

Actually I use aurora to by pass geo fence like this all the time. You need search it int web browser and open in aurora, voila, you can install it

Interesting! I will try out that tip. Thank you!

Re: A dad took photos of his toddler for a doctor – Google flagged him as a criminal

#600

Post by tekknik »

kayghar wrote: post #574
tekknik wrote: post #565

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> puritan Christians I’ve lost track of how many people in this thread have blamed Christians. Why? Christian’s do not have a ban on alcohol. Where is this idea coming from, or are we just spreading hate?

The keyword is “puritan.” I don’t see how you can not blame a school of thought that labels most human activities as “vice.”

I’m a Christian and never have met such a “puritan” Christian. Where are these “puritans” that ban things in the name of Christianity? Have you met one or is this hearsay?

Also, in many of the comments in this thread, the word “puritan” is not used.

My comment remains, this comment existed to spread hate, nothing else.

Also what other vices? The word vice generally means bad things so you’re upset that this “group” is giving life guidance? Are you equally as intolerant of a doctor telling people not to drink?

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