if ridesharing leaves cali politicians will be skewered
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Uber CEO says its service will probably shut down temporarily in California
591–600 of 887 posts
Re: Uber CEO says its service will probably shut down temporarily in California
#592Earlier quoted context omitted.
But you could have refused the customer in the first place. Nobody forced you to make a contract with him. Of course, once you did, you are compelled to keep up your end of the bargain, and that probably included you doing those jira tasks (you could have probably refused to do entirely different work, like walking the dog of the manager, when you were originally contracted for doing IT development work). A true cont…
Alternatively, the contract is between the driver and the rideshare platform. The driver is a participant in the platform and is contractually expected to behave within the rules and bounds of the platform. This does not require defining the driver as an employee. When the driver activates uber driver mode, they are initiating a contract which states they will work within the bounds of the app. The driver is able to…
I am pretty sure that you cannot "activate" a work contract by opening an app. What is the notion of "activating" a contract anyway, I mean legally. Does something like that exist in US law?
I would doubt that, and I would also doubt that you can simply define opening an app as the beginning of a legally binding, entirely new contract with as many implications as Uber's driver contracts have. I am pretty sure that in reality, Uber signs a contract once with a new driver, after checking his background, driver license and everything, and that contract is active from that point in time until explicitly terminated by either party. Just closing the app does not terminate it, neither does opening the app create a new contract. Closing the app just amounts to the driver leaving his "workplace", opening it again amounts to the driver entering his "workplace", but the contract under which that work takes place is the same and active all the time, it just gives the driver a lot of leeway with regard to how many hours he wants to work.
That is a generous employment, but it is an employment nevertheless in nature.
Re: Uber CEO says its service will probably shut down temporarily in California
#593Earlier quoted context omitted.
So if Uber does shut down, how are drivers better off than if they simply chose not to drive for Uber? (or Lyft)
Either companies will fill the gap left by Uber in a way that gives drivers a better version than they had before, or drivers will find other work. This same faulty argument is made often to argue you shouldn’t reduce exploitative child or sex labor, especially in developing countries, but it’s not valid. If Uber employment option is exploitative, you cannot use drivers’ own willingness to accept work via that platfo…
As long as there's a safety net, I actually don't think sex labor should be outlawed as long as all parties truly consent and there's no drug addiction or shady trafficking going on. And no Uber driver has ever asked me for a bump or picked me up acting high, so I'm sorry but I don't buy that argument.
If better jobs existed, drivers could go there now. If any company can fulfill these regulations, I would expect it to be companies that already have market share like Lyft and Uber. If they choose to shut down because they can't meet these regulations and be viable businesses, then I'm not really optimistic about your other argument either. Personally, I'd be even less likely than ever to try and do (or invest in) an Uber-like startup after this decision.
Re: Uber CEO says its service will probably shut down temporarily in California
#594> "What worker doesn't want to have access to paid sick leave?" Becerra said. "What worker doesn't want to have unemployment insurance at a time of Covid-19 crisis? What worker doesn't want to know that they'll get paid for overtime if they work 60 hours in a week or 12 hours in a day?" Since when are we reasoning about workers starting from what they want? If we go by that reasoning, "What worker does not want to be…
Work only exists in a narrow space between a consumer and a service. And to be quite frank, not all services have a right to life. If some employer/business can't meet the bare minimum of workers right, well, sucks to be them. Hopefully a competent competitor will pop up. It's downright toxic that we live in a world where consumers get cheap products and services, on the backs of either rampant workers rights violati…
But in this case you are assuming a worker wants those things. They might not need various benefits (health, etc.) as they get them via another job or a spouse.
If you look at reddit.com/r/uberdrivers, Uber mandating everyone be employees is.. controversial.
Re: Uber CEO says its service will probably shut down temporarily in California
#595Them shutting down is a perfectly acceptable outcome. California has essentially told them "You're doing an illegal thing". They're response is essentially "Oh yeah? Well then, we'll stop doing the illegal thing!" Thank you? That's what you were asked to do in the first place? If they aren't interested in operating legally, then pivot or disband the company.
Yeah! Back to the taxi monopoly which was the epitome of employee fairness and top customer service!
Re: Uber CEO says its service will probably shut down temporarily in California
#596Re: Uber CEO says its service will probably shut down temporarily in California
#597Earlier quoted context omitted.
If the part of the city is unsafe (as some parts of some major cities are frequently nowdays) to the point the driver risks being assaulted by a mob, dragged out and beaten or shot, and their vehicle destroyed - I see no reason why they shouldn't be able to refuse such ride. No ride worth your life, and unless you're paying 1000x the Uber rates, no ride is worth your car ruined.
Amazing that you're downvoted. Are HN posters really so sheltered that they don't know that this is a reality in many major American cities? I'm sure it's in areas they never visit, for totally unspecified reasons, but it's real. There are areas (e.g. in Camden NJ) where the police will tell you to not stop your car for any reason, just get through and get out. Pretending this isn't a reality or that it doesn't have…
There's a major difference between 'unsafe because of high crime rates' (the actual case in some places) and 'unsafe because an entire mob of random people will manifest out of the ether, drag you from your car, and beat you up' (the nonsense part). The latter has been seeing increasing use lately as part of the endless barrage of 'all of (city name) is a flaming ruin constantly prowled by antifa supersoldiers' claims against the ongoing protests in several cities.
Re: Uber CEO says its service will probably shut down temporarily in California
#598Earlier quoted context omitted.
Ridiculous that it takes a legal battle for Uber to offer these customer and driver friendly features
I used to work at Uber. I'll focus on one particular point: allowing drivers to see where riders are going before they accept the trip. Uber, at least when I worked there, was heavily against this functionality as it allows drivers to discriminate against riders who are going to poor neighborhoods or from cities to suburbs where they may have difficulty in getting another rider. That feature is bad for the overall ec…
It does not strike me as a legitimate case to strip people of their human right to free agency and will by forcing people to do things they don't want to or may even be dangerous to their health and safety. It should be anyone's right to refuse going to dangerous neighborhoods, just like forcing drivers to drive out into nowhere where they have to spend their own money/resources to get back to the network, should be compensated by Uber if they want that feature.
It's rather abusive and tyrannical to force people to do things against their will or safety. But I am guessing you live in a dangerous neighborhood because you did not "discriminate" and are paying really low rents since you don't discriminate. Right? … exactly!
Re: Uber CEO says its service will probably shut down temporarily in California
#599Uber's model would work fine in a country where the government provides medical insurance, disability insurance and the protective net you need.
In the US, unfortunately, those protective nets are liabilities of the companies to their staff, not a service provided by the government.
One could argue a third solution where the driver would unionize and the protective net should be offered by the union.
Re: Uber CEO says its service will probably shut down temporarily in California
#600Earlier quoted context omitted.
Could allowing the driver to see the destination before accepting the trip be used as a way to discriminate?
That is quite an abusive mentality to have. You would force someone to expose themselves to danger and the risk of violence and even death just so you could feel virtuous about yourself, while surely not at all exposing yourself to the same dangers you prescribe and force on others? It's really a rather twisted mentality to have; like typical aristocratic supremacist types that demand the disposable peasants serve th…
You need to chill. The person posed a question, and you attacked their character and worldview. Learn to express your disagreement more neutrally.