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China Blocks WhatsApp

nytimes.com

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Re: China Blocks WhatsApp

#571

Post by FabHK »

AmIFirstToThink wrote: post #434
FabHK wrote: post #409

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Whatsapp is not? Are you sure? Well, it's E2E encrypted, that's for sure. The NSA, like the Mossad, can do pretty much anything if you're a high-value target, I'd assume, but personally, I don't think there is blanket mass surveillance of WhatsApp chats, no. > Whatsapp is out not because it can't let authorities audit it, but because of other economic reasons. Do you have any evidence or even arguments for that ass…

WeChat employs people in China.

But WeChat is dominant in China already. Nobody gives a rat's ass about WhatsApp in China (except a few people communicating across borders), as far as I can tell. The market share/penetration of WeChat won't appreciably rise due to this act.

It's not driven by economics.

Re: China Blocks WhatsApp

#572

Post by emiliobumachar »

TeMPOraL wrote: post #548
jacquesm wrote: post #295

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That is going to be tough. A whole generation of Chinese see the west as cool and to be emulated. I have a hard time seeing a whole generation of Europeans and Americans wanting to emulate the Chinese, Japan, maybe. China, not so much.

As an European of almost 30, I used to feel America is cool, but I got pretty disillusioned over the last 10-15 years. I can tell the same about many people I know too. US is no longer a country to be emulated. It's a country to fear (for what they can, and do, to other countries) and a country to pity (for what it does to its own citizens). China, OTOH, looks more and more cool now. A lot of things that made them se…

You called China "the only country on the planet that seems to think and execute long-term". I agree with that. That gives them a huge advantage.

The issue about repression stifling creativity is orthogonal to that (unless to the extent repression might be necessary for long-term-ness), and gives them a huge disadvantage.

Which huge thing is huger is anyone's guess. They look to be winning so far. (What could really derail them is a bad leader, Mao-style. Checks and balances would be to avoid that. But that's a different topic altogether)

Re: China Blocks WhatsApp

#573

Post by dwighttk »

TeMPOraL wrote: post #545
processing wrote: post #398

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Peak Hacker News "Sharing data using physically present word of mouth is a lot more expensive and slower than sharing it instantly via an open internet connection."

If stating obvious facts is "peak Hacker News" then that's good, isn't it?

as long as circumlocution is valued.

Re: China Blocks WhatsApp

#574

Post by nradov »

TylerE wrote: post #416
nradov wrote: post #370

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In terms of consumer preferences, the US and Chinese auto markets are actually pretty similar right now. Chinese buyers seem to want most of the same things as US buyers. Of course they're not exactly the same but more alike than Japan, Europe, Africa, or South America. Australia is also fairly similar to China and the US. It's hard to predict the impact of potential trade restrictions and electrification requirement…

I'd say it's more like the US market of 20 or 30 years ago. They sell lots of Buicks.

I was referring to general vehicle size and configuration preferences, not specific brands.

Re: China Blocks WhatsApp

#575

Post by chaostheory »

a1371 wrote: post #505
Sargos wrote: post #222

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Chinese engineers didn't make the hoverboard. If anything the hoverboard example disproves your example as they just copied the hoverboard from foreign companies. I know what you're point seems to be even though you aren't communicating it very well. I do think you're missing the fact that producing goods cheaply does not make you a leader in tech. Besides quick fads like hoverboards or fidget spinners China does not…

I doubt anybody will ever see this response, but about the Hoverboard, here it is: Hoverboards are originally from China [1] however, most of us have likely learned about them from Kickstarter etc. I think the users of HN would agree that "invention is never a sudden thing". The process for hoverboards has been iterative, of course. I have heard claims of having commercial hoverboards as much as five years before the…

Actually the video confirms that the hoverboard was created by a Chinese American, living in Seattle, who also patented it. The Chinese versions even look identical to the patent filing.

Re: China Blocks WhatsApp

#576

Post by chaostheory »

IncRnd wrote: post #561
chaostheory wrote: post #493

Earlier quoted context omitted.

ok, I understand that this is an emotional subject (I can relate), so please re-read the comment that you're responding to. 1. It didn't say China lacks innovation. 2. It is not critical of China as a whole. It is critical of the ones making stupid, selfish laws in China out of fear, which imo will hurt growing innovation in China. 3. If there's no shortage of Chinese innovation, why is there so much fear of 'inferio…

Yet, the comment does say China lacks innovation. > The end result is that China's fate as being relegated to being the world's giant copy machine is sealed unless things revert Why do you think that China has "fear of 'inferior' outside competition"?

No the comment says China WILL lose its current momentum for innovation. It’s a prediction of the future

It’s pretty evident China fears outside competition when they block competitors from entering their market. They have no confidence in their home grown companies surviving contrary to hard evidence

Re: China Blocks WhatsApp

#577

Post by chaostheory »

briandear wrote: post #525
chaostheory wrote: post #40

What the long-term effects will be: China's ruling class further cement their power at the cost of China's innovation and future growth. Interesting and useful things are made when people able share and consume information. e.g. Jack Ma's US visit exposed him to Yahoo. Ma Huateng was clearly inspired by his exposure to ICQ. The list goes on. The same thing happens in the West but it happens a lot more often since the…

The west is nowhere near China enough it comes to censorship and government control. It’s an entirely different league.

My comment was about the future and not the past or present

Re: China Blocks WhatsApp

#578

Post by throwaway1984_ »

sytelus wrote: post #330
chaostheory wrote: post #40

What the long-term effects will be: China's ruling class further cement their power at the cost of China's innovation and future growth. Interesting and useful things are made when people able share and consume information. e.g. Jack Ma's US visit exposed him to Yahoo. Ma Huateng was clearly inspired by his exposure to ICQ. The list goes on. The same thing happens in the West but it happens a lot more often since the…

I don't think there is virtually any impact on innovations in China because of western social media censorships. China is on track to match US in AI research paper output, for example. Same goes for other fields in medicine and manufacturing. Also, you have to look at Chinese view point to understand why there is no revolt in China around blocking Google or Facebook. The argument that government has successfully made…

High-output of research papers from China is not surprising at all: considering they pay hundreds of thousands of dollars per paper published in a prestigious journal[1].

[1]: https://www.timeshighereducation.com/news/chinese-scholars-w...

Re: China Blocks WhatsApp

#579

Post by p-funk »

TeMPOraL wrote: post #555
jacquesm wrote: post #553

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> A lot of things that made them seem evil turned out to be exaggerations and propaganda Such as?

People living in fear. Strong and full censorship for political reasons (it turned out neither strong not being done for political reasons, but rather economical ones). Population control through forced abortions and murders everywhere (it turned out to be not true). Evil communist leaders. Shit-quality manufacturing (that's the fault of western companies; China manufactures to the specs you give and pay for, it's we…

>Shit-quality manufacturing (that's the fault of western companies; China manufactures to the specs you give and pay for, it's western companies that decide to cheap out on products)

Many times, US companies take Chinese products "off the shelf" and slap their brand on it, based on a spec that the Chinese company themselves came up with on their own. Most manufacturers have catalogs for you to browse, and many are quite reluctant to modify their designs with your own specifications, although this depends on the company. So I would disagree that it's western companies cutting corners. Typically the manufacturers cut cost to increase their own margins, regardless of what spec you give them.

Re: China Blocks WhatsApp

#580

Post by Danihan »

chalupa-man wrote: post #473
Danihan wrote: post #329

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's simply factually wrong. The US has much better press freedoms, freedom of speech and gun ownership rights than any other large country. It has nothing to do with an echo chamber. The laws are objectively very different. Comparing surveillance by the NSA to information accessibility in general is disingenuous at best.

"Than any other large country" is a big stretch. The US is ranked 43rd on this year's Press Freedom Index.

Correct -- and no country with a higher population is higher ranked.

Or even close, really.

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