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China Blocks WhatsApp

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561–570 of 648 posts

Re: China Blocks WhatsApp

#561

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That is totally wrong. If you think that China lacks innovation then you clearly have never been there. China is one of the most dynamic capitalistic countries in the world and there is no shortage of innovation. Even if then they have 1/3rd the innovators as the US, they still have 40% more innovators than the U.S. Innovation will just happen within the context of Chinese political constraints. The real threat is no…

ok, I understand that this is an emotional subject (I can relate), so please re-read the comment that you're responding to. 1. It didn't say China lacks innovation. 2. It is not critical of China as a whole. It is critical of the ones making stupid, selfish laws in China out of fear, which imo will hurt growing innovation in China. 3. If there's no shortage of Chinese innovation, why is there so much fear of 'inferio…

Yet, the comment does say China lacks innovation.

> The end result is that China's fate as being relegated to being the world's giant copy machine is sealed unless things revert

Why do you think that China has "fear of 'inferior' outside competition"?

Re: China Blocks WhatsApp

#562

WeChat is the replacement for WhatsApp, fully compliant with Chinese censorship controls. What's mildly disturbing is that many Chinese Americans, both American citizens and not, living in the US use WeChat. They use it because of their cultural and social ties with China. Chinese tourists as well have had increasingly better integration inside the US as well, which would only serve to spread the usage of WeChat to a…

If the US were smart, they'd ban WeChat. An eye for an eye, eh?

Re: China Blocks WhatsApp

#563

What the long-term effects will be: China's ruling class further cement their power at the cost of China's innovation and future growth. Interesting and useful things are made when people able share and consume information. e.g. Jack Ma's US visit exposed him to Yahoo. Ma Huateng was clearly inspired by his exposure to ICQ. The list goes on. The same thing happens in the West but it happens a lot more often since the…

I disagree - I think having some control over the self-destructive urges of a population during times of economic trouble is a positive thing. Several democracies with cancerous social media networks are teetering on the brink of right-wing proto-fascist parties as a result of the recent recession and perceived immigration issues. The mob needs to be controlled for progress to be protected.

You really should read about fascism.

You're the fascist, trying to control people, because you think you know what's best for them.

Re: China Blocks WhatsApp

#564
post #187

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Neither did South America What are you talking about? South America was colonized by the Portuguese and Spanish, which most definitely come from the western liberal tradition. It's fine to take a position against "Chinese culture", but it should be an honest one.

I'm basing that off a book I read which described how the original liberators of South America (who were mainly locals, not from the Spanish or Portuguese elite who ruled) were heavily influenced by these (mainly French and English) liberal European thinkers - which is why they wanted a revolution in the first placed. It didn't come from local culture. The Spanish did not create liberal "western" democracies when the…

I don't think that japan and south korea fits too well in here japan was ruled by america in the years after the second world war, which is where a lot of the modern thinking is coming from. And I belive that similar thing have been happening in south korea, but I am not too sure of that.

Re: China Blocks WhatsApp

#565
post #505
post #222

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Chinese engineers didn't make the hoverboard. If anything the hoverboard example disproves your example as they just copied the hoverboard from foreign companies. I know what you're point seems to be even though you aren't communicating it very well. I do think you're missing the fact that producing goods cheaply does not make you a leader in tech. Besides quick fads like hoverboards or fidget spinners China does not…

I doubt anybody will ever see this response, but about the Hoverboard, here it is: Hoverboards are originally from China [1] however, most of us have likely learned about them from Kickstarter etc. I think the users of HN would agree that "invention is never a sudden thing". The process for hoverboards has been iterative, of course. I have heard claims of having commercial hoverboards as much as five years before the…

Hover boards are a poor knockoff of a segway. There was even a stickless version hacked up by someone in the US a few weeks after the Segway's release. This dates back to patents filed in 1994.

Re: China Blocks WhatsApp

#566
For what it's worth, the Matrix protocol (matrix.org) isn't blocked in China at all to our knowledge, meaning folks get both decentralised & e2e encrypted comms. Given the transport is just HTTPS and can hit any arbitrary server, it's relatively hard to fingerprint and block in the manner that WhatsApp has been.

Re: China Blocks WhatsApp

#567
post #193

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think it'll be a contradiction for China to create a special city with more liberal values to attract liberal talent, or if China permits liberalism in a controlled context. Tech talent such as Andrew Ng already go to work in China knowing the political context surrounding China. I'm sure some HN people go to work in Dubai, which I'm sure has some contradictions to western cultural values. I'm also not sure i…

> I don't think it'll be a contradiction for China to create a special city with more liberal values to attract liberal talent, or if China permits liberalism in a controlled context. Hong Kong has been the test laboratory for what the Communist Party calls “One country, two systems”. It doesn’t seem like the regime is very happy with the experiment, or would be looking to expand it.

Really, I think they are expanding in that area, just not pushing for deregulation just yet: https://www.theguardian.com/cities/2016/may/10/china-pearl-r...

Re: China Blocks WhatsApp

#568

What the long-term effects will be: China's ruling class further cement their power at the cost of China's innovation and future growth. Interesting and useful things are made when people able share and consume information. e.g. Jack Ma's US visit exposed him to Yahoo. Ma Huateng was clearly inspired by his exposure to ICQ. The list goes on. The same thing happens in the West but it happens a lot more often since the…

China has gone from basically poverty to the second largest economy in the world in roughly 25 years. You have to give them a little credit for doing something right. As long as people have food to eat and people 's lives are getting better they will put up with government. Once that stops happening problems will start happening. Are there negatives? Yes. Lack of freedom. Corruption. At the same time people are able to get job not worry about food etc. You have to look at the baseline of where they where.

Re: China Blocks WhatsApp

#569

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> A lot of things that made them seem evil turned out to be exaggerations and propaganda Such as?

People living in fear. Strong and full censorship for political reasons (it turned out neither strong not being done for political reasons, but rather economical ones). Population control through forced abortions and murders everywhere (it turned out to be not true). Evil communist leaders. Shit-quality manufacturing (that's the fault of western companies; China manufactures to the specs you give and pay for, it's we…

> People living in fear.

In the former Eastblock people weren't living in fear either, as long as they did not think of sticking their heads up too far above the field in terms of political activism and such. If you did then you were pretty sure to be targeted.

China today is still very repressive when it comes to political freedom.

https://freedomhouse.org/report/freedom-world/2017/china

And as long as they are 'one party rule' I think that it is both strong and for political reasons. Keep in mind that all of politics is ultimately rooted in economy so it is pretty easy to get lost in the mix.

> Population control through forced abortions and murders everywhere (it turned out to be not true).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/One-child_policy

It very much turned out to be true, and you can add a very large number of forced sterilizations to that list.

> Evil communist leaders.

That's an opinion, I'm not going to argue with opinions.

> Shit-quality manufacturing (that's the fault of western companies; China manufactures to the specs you give and pay for, it's western companies that decide to cheap out on products).

This is false. China can make quality products but there is also a culture of substitution where quality samples are replaced with lower grade manufacture at later points in a contract to deliver. This has bitten many Western companies that turned to China for their manufacturing and which has caused a lot of companies to bring their quality control to China, just before shipping to save on the amount of stuff shipped that simply did not work or did not work as advertised. This QA issue has been very well documented and can definitely not be laid at the door of the Western companies placing their orders in good faith.

> Those are all things I've been led to believe through media reports.

Media mostly reports, it mostly does not make stuff up. And most of those media reports are backed by at least my personal experience over the years where I will be more than happy to note that this stuff isn't a constant but that there are trends with some stuff improving and other things worsening. If you know your stuff it is very well possible to manufacture quality goods in China.

> The point being, whatever happened there 40 or 60 years ago, currently China is not that much different from the US

That is hilarious in so many ways. China is extremely different from the US along almost any axis that you care to name. Other than that of course the Chinese are people, just like Americans and Europeans but that's about it.

> and unlike the latter, it's only getting better.

This may very well be true, but then again, that's a function of where they were only a few decades ago. It's hard to remain at the top of something if there are other parties that wish to ascend, in dutch we have a proverb that reads 'standing still is going backwards' (I'm not sure how well that translates), but it fairly accurately sums up the sentiment.

Re: China Blocks WhatsApp

#570
post #229

What the long-term effects will be: China's ruling class further cement their power at the cost of China's innovation and future growth. Interesting and useful things are made when people able share and consume information. e.g. Jack Ma's US visit exposed him to Yahoo. Ma Huateng was clearly inspired by his exposure to ICQ. The list goes on. The same thing happens in the West but it happens a lot more often since the…

> The people who will get ahead in China in the future are the ones who are somehow able to live outside of China to experience new ideas. There are more people in China than in the United States, Europe, and Russia combined. China already manufactures your clothes, chips, computers, phones, and missile chips. I don't think it's correct, given the world's dependence on China, to say China is somehow behind the times…

I had to Google the missile thing. Bit of a shocker: "Last year, the U.S. Navy bought 59,000 microchips for use in everything from missiles to transponders and all of them turned out to be counterfeits from China." (http://www.businessinsider.com/navy-chinese-microchips-weapo...)
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