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I'm starting a social club to solve the male loneliness epidemic

wave3.social

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Re: I'm starting a social club to solve the male loneliness epidemic

#551

Post by teddyh »

Euphorbium wrote: post #306
keiferski wrote: post #173

This idea appears every once in awhile, as it’s obviously a major issue in modern life. The interesting thing though is how the solution is always location-agnostic. By that I mean it’s never really about a specific cafe or restaurant or soccer field, it’s always an app or service that organizes people to show up in various places. I bring this up because if you look at places that had lively social activities a few…

You are not supposed to stop by. You are supposed to spend money and keep going.

If the business doesn’t make enough money it will not be able to pay rent, and will be replaced with a more profitable business which will make enough money, probably by pressuring people to instead be customers, pay and move on. It’s what the system will produce.

Re: I'm starting a social club to solve the male loneliness epidemic

#552

Post by LargeWu »

wkat4242 wrote: post #102
sandspar wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Huh? "Conformist" is the most common type of person on Earth and conformists prefer hanging out with conformists. Social clubs are entirely a conformist phenomena, almost by definition. All those Elk clubs and bowling clubs and so on were chock full of conformists.

I don't agree. If you choose the right club you don't have to conform and you can just be yourself. Especially in the cities there's a scene for everyone. In the countryside it's slim pickings of course so you do have to conform. Maybe that's one of the reason people in small towns are so different, the social dynamic is stricter because there's just not enough people around to form groups of people that are differen…

> there's just not enough people around to form groups of people that are different.

That's certainly part of it, although I think the bigger factor is that people who are different just leave. Small towns are conformist because of survivorship bias.

Re: I'm starting a social club to solve the male loneliness epidemic

#553

Post by fennecfoxy »

rsynnott wrote: post #325
subscribed wrote: post #242

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oh, but why if they're having a functional clubs already? I feel like men only spaces in the UK are frowned upon (see Garrick club narration). No matter the reason, the only way single sex spaces work here is women only.

So there’s at least one type of men’s only space in the UK; some gay club nights are men-only, and enforce this with registration/membership. Was a bit of a culture shock visiting from Ireland, where, as far as I know, this is not a thing (even the most male-oriented club nights _allow_ women, and there’ll usually be one or two; I’ve never known anyone to have a problem with this). I’m unsure whether there’s a legal…

That's because gay clubs/bars have ended up chock full of straight women. People claim it's because it's "safer from all the gross men in other places", which may be partially true. But also I believe it's because gay clubs can just be nicer overall, plenty of interesting drinks like cocktails available rather than just beer, more variety in music, etc. I think they may disallow women because for the bi/pan men in the crowd - their behaviour changes when women are present, they get more aggressive, domineering, chest beating. I notice it all the time in queer but non-gay friends constantly.

Which always annoyed me because I've been to a few Soho "gay" bars since and they're just full of straight women/hen dos. Asked for a cocktail..."we don't do cocktails". How the fuck do you call yourself a gay bar anymore then!

I go to a regular meet and one of the places next door is a drag bar, whose entire purpose seems to be to host hen dos. Ugh.

Re: I'm starting a social club to solve the male loneliness epidemic

#554

Post by lupusreal »

maxerickson wrote: post #511
lupusreal wrote: post #362

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What I find a bit remarkable is how they lost control of their club dynamics so severely. I've been a regular attendee of a few hacker spaces that were open to the public but never had the problem they describe. I think maybe a key aspect is ensuring that all men, particular the ones that are classically unattractive (even repulsive) feel welcome as valued equals. Many women cannot countenance this and will try to sh…

This is a hilarious take. Men must be welcome as an absolute, women must conform to your expectations or be excluded.

If a woman cannot tolerate the presence of unattractive men in a club meant for socially excluded men, then she doesn't belong in that club.

> absolute

As I said, harassment shouldn't be tolerated. Men who do that should be kicked out.

Re: I'm starting a social club to solve the male loneliness epidemic

#555

Post by UncleMeat »

zug_zug wrote: post #533
UncleMeat wrote: post #529

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I assure you that people really do love these things. The idea that men truly love video games but are actually just experiencing shared psychosis when playing or watching sports is wild to me.

No playing sports for sure is fun and normally authentic behavior. Especially if it's not a particularly "cool" sport (e.g. pickleball). Though of course you definitely do find those people who make "Playing a sport" their personality and spend a ton of money on all the clothes and equipment and never seem to actually be out there doing it, especially if it's a "status" sport like polo/golf. I don't mean to present t…

Maybe I am kidding myself. But I think that these are all things that you just don’t like.

Re: I'm starting a social club to solve the male loneliness epidemic

#556

Post by fennecfoxy »

steveBK123 wrote: post #501
craftkiller wrote: post #458

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Those two scouts programs aren't even remotely comparable, both in substance and prestige. Many girl scout troops barely did any camping/outdoor activity, whereas boys got to earn the prestige of "eagle scout" and go on various outdoor adventures (multi-day treks through the mountains, building igloos and camping inside them, camping on an island only accessible by a canoe, etc). It was a tragedy that girls didn't ha…

Flip your own framing around - aren't there likely boys who would have preferred the Girl Scouts coded activities, and being disallowed from membership is therefore also an unfair dis-opportunity?

Yup exactly. Same as all the "feminist" groups campaigning to disallow trans women from such groups, usually using the excuse that they'll get assaulted by the "really just men" trans women a la "won't somebody please think of the children!" when the incidences of this happening is almost 0 comparatively.

Turns out some are allowed to have special clubs, but others not so much. And we only have societal perception of women to blame; the thing they're relying on for all this "they need their own space to protect them" is demeaning, imo. Besides the fact that the majority of victims of crime are male (and before someone points out that the majority of criminals are also male - did you know that's a sexist statement to make? It's judging an entire sex by the actions of individuals).

Re: I'm starting a social club to solve the male loneliness epidemic

#557

Post by sfmz »

FirmwareBurner wrote: post #443
_zaey wrote: post #417

Bouldering (indoor climbing) is the most social sport I’ve tried, and I’d highly recommend going on your own as you will find opportunities to meet new people, and others will talk to you (as long as you’re not wearing headphones!). Bouldering provides an open space you can move freely in, with no inherent social hierarchy (no tutors, teachers), just people trying varying difficulties of bouldering routes. If someone…

I can disagree with this take. For one, bouldering is not great if you have a fear of heights or maybe some mobility issues due to a previous injury. It's then a massively painful and risky chore and not a pleasurable activity but requires you to be at 100% health physically and mentally in order to do anything beyond kiddy walls. Otherwise you can fall and injure yourself pretty badly. Granted, that's mostly on you,…

It has a built-in gating function. People who are out-of-shape or with injuries will opt-out. Bouldering favors slim people. On the other hand, I think gating functions are necessary to build community. Often gating-functions are accomplished with wealth (gated community, country club), but its more interesting when its some other function.

Maybe good idea for a meetup might be to solve some tech challenge, idk. Solve X get invited to some hacker house/space maybe? (i'm saying this as a person who probably wouldn't solve it)

Re: I'm starting a social club to solve the male loneliness epidemic

#558

Post by sfmz »

nothercastle wrote: post #530
seb1204 wrote: post #488

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But not on a park bench or park area with tables?

In the USA people would graffiti the benches pee on the seats and a homeless person would move in. Almost no protection exists to prevent destruction of public property. I think that’s intentional to discourage people from embracing socialism.

Modern benches and even parks have anti-homeless features. iirc some park in Minneapolis removed their basketball courts because black people would congregate there (also there was drug-dealing). In USA its spend money or get out.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hostile_architecture

Re: I'm starting a social club to solve the male loneliness epidemic

#559

Post by bluefirebrand »

tstrimple wrote: post #291
solraph wrote: post #189

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Men aren't allowed to have male-only gyms but women do Is that legally true? AFAICT, nobodies opening male-only gyms because there's no demand for them.

You can have a private club with gym equipment that is exclusively for men. But when you're a business open to the public you cannot discriminate based on certain characteristics. Bob's Burgers can't sell just to men. But Bob's Boys Club that happens to have a kitchen which sells burgers to its "private" membership can absolutely keep women out.

> You can have a private club with gym equipment that is exclusively for men. But when you're a business open to the public you cannot discriminate based on certain characteristics.

You can if those certain characteristics are currently in favor.

Plenty of women only gyms exist

Re: I'm starting a social club to solve the male loneliness epidemic

#560

Post by parliament32 »

jl6 wrote: post #253
subscribed wrote: post #242

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oh, but why if they're having a functional clubs already? I feel like men only spaces in the UK are frowned upon (see Garrick club narration). No matter the reason, the only way single sex spaces work here is women only.

In UK law, it is generally considered sex discrimination to exclude someone on the basis of their sex, unless that exclusion is a “proportionate means of achieving a legitimate aim”. It’s fairly well understood that women have sex-based needs that justify this aim, but very rarely recognized that men might have such needs too. Maybe this is one of them. The fear will always be that male-only spaces will become center…

>it is generally considered sex discrimination to exclude someone on the basis of their sex

So are women-only gyms not a thing in the UK then? Here in NA they're everywhere, we even have a women-only version of the YMCA (YWCA).

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