Trump's Tariffs Wipe Out over $6T on Wall Street in Epic Two-Day Rout • Hacker News Board

Re: Trump's Tariffs Wipe Out over $6T on Wall Street in Epic Two-Day Rout

#551

Post by polotics » Sat, Apr 05, 2025, 6:08 AM UTC

ants_everywhere wrote: post #357

dcre wrote: post #321

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You haven’t said anything.

Surely this retort sounded cooler in your head? But also, literally I said a lot. There's enough meat there for someone who hasn't spent much time in the history of economics to spend an entire afternoon going down an enjoyable rabbit hole.

that connection between surplus value and the labour theory of value is fully unexplained in your post, so... you have not said nothing, but you haven't said enough to make your post consequential I'm afraid

Re: Trump's Tariffs Wipe Out over $6T on Wall Street in Epic Two-Day Rout

#552

Post by heigh » Sat, Apr 05, 2025, 6:08 AM UTC

larrywright wrote: post #341

loudmax wrote: post #185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Trump's businesses have repeatedly declared bankruptcy. Don't rule out ineptitude.

He bankrupted a casino. I’m not sure how you even manage to do that.

He bankrupted casinos 6 times. Six. Managed to lose money on a money printing machine.

Re: Trump's Tariffs Wipe Out over $6T on Wall Street in Epic Two-Day Rout

#553

Post by tasuki » Sat, Apr 05, 2025, 6:11 AM UTC

csense wrote: post #531

cycomanic wrote: post #324

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was bringing this up with a guy yesterday who was genuinely supporting the policies and somebody chimed in that they were not worried at all, because everyone wants to trade with the big boy in town. Trust is not important if they are afraid of you (I'm paraphrasing). Quite a different perspective, but it is consistent with an observation I made about a lot of US comments, people are quite happy for their country/g…

> "if you don't want it to be done to you don't do it to others" Doesn't work. We opened trade to China in the '70s. They took advantage of us, stealing IP, manipulating currency, paying their people terrible wages, crapping all over the environment. We let their companies freely in the US, they very severely restricted US business ventures in China. Detroit, a former shining city in the industrial heartland, is now…

I think csense is engaging in good faith discussion. The proper response is an explanation, not downvotes.

Re: Trump's Tariffs Wipe Out over $6T on Wall Street in Epic Two-Day Rout

#554

Post by kristiandupont » Sat, Apr 05, 2025, 6:19 AM UTC

vitaflo wrote: post #404

paxys wrote: post #172

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The next president is going to be Trump. If people don't think that's at least a serious possibity they are extremely deluded about the situation the country is in right now.

The constitution says you’re wrong. And the justices he appointed would uphold the constitution if he tried it.

>And the justices he appointed would uphold the constitution if he tried it.

I don't feel that's a given. But even if they do, it needs to be enforced which feels much less likely.

Re: Trump's Tariffs Wipe Out over $6T on Wall Street in Epic Two-Day Rout

#555

Post by Tadpole9181 » Sat, Apr 05, 2025, 6:22 AM UTC

breadwinner wrote: post #106

There is away out of this mess: A U.S. Senate bill that would require congressional approval for new tariffs gained more Republican support on Friday [1]. Trump is not going to back down since that will make him look like a loser. Neither is China. But GOP can help Trump out by creating a new law that automatically expires all new tariffs after 60 days unless approved by congress. This will let Trump extricate his he…

To be clear, this is going to have to pass the house. Then, Trump will veto it. Then, the senate will need 16 Republican senators (30% of the party) to vote against it. And it's still a toss-up if Trump will even obey it or if he'll executively order customs to continue the Tariffs.

So unless Republicans suddenly grow a spine, which is unlikely given their current strategy is "hide the stock ticket on Fox news" and pretend glorious leader is a genius, this is a token effort that will do nothing.

And even if the tariffs are revoked, we've destroyed our reputation. You think countries will want to continue on like nothing happened after this? The only thing that might stop the impending collapse of the US economy as 180 nations divest from the empire we built is if we were to impeach and convict Trump immediately and set an example that this economic chaos will not be tolerated; that allies are not fair game to bully.

But, honestly, I think that ship has already sailed. It needed to happen immediately, not after a week of testing the waters.

Re: Trump's Tariffs Wipe Out over $6T on Wall Street in Epic Two-Day Rout

#556

Post by Tadpole9181 » Sat, Apr 05, 2025, 6:22 AM UTC

OhioMan2943 wrote: post #411

Does anyone have any idea where all of this tarrif(tax) revenue is going? I think it's a little more creative than just increasing wealth. Are there any bold visions or grand plans/futures in the works that this could be going towards?

They just signed the budget, it's not a secret. They're giving $2.5 trillion in tax cuts to the wealthiest Americans.

Re: Trump's Tariffs Wipe Out over $6T on Wall Street in Epic Two-Day Rout

#557

Post by nitwit005 » Sat, Apr 05, 2025, 6:23 AM UTC

thethimble wrote: post #525

nitwit005 wrote: post #505

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm fairly convinced it's easier feel like there is some plan, even if a bad or sinister one, than things being in a state of genuine chaos. You occasionally see the people jumping between different ideas as to what the underlying plan is, once events no longer support their initial idea.

The plan is crystal clear: 1. When equities crash, market liquidity floods the bond market causing yields to drop 2. Refinance debt at these lower rates massively reducing interest burden 3. Cut government spending to cause rates to drop further 4. Reduced rates with a balanced budget results in non-inflationary borrowing and an economic upswing Along the way, eliminate taxes for those earning below $150k. If all of…

Let us know what the new plan is when Trump does something that doesn't fit with this.

Re: Trump's Tariffs Wipe Out over $6T on Wall Street in Epic Two-Day Rout

#558

Post by CapricornNoble » Sat, Apr 05, 2025, 6:25 AM UTC

gonzo41 wrote: post #184

owebmaster wrote: post #161

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I'm tempted to think (hope? dream?) that the markets and trade will rebound if all this chaos makes American politics swing back The pump'n'dump scheme against Ukraine will forever change how small countries see the US support for democracy, even if it changes back to the previous status-quo.

The US treatment of Ukraine is having a massive impact on how everyone thinks about security. All the US had to do was supply it's old weapons to Ukraine whilst replenishing it's stock (creating jobs in America) and things would have been fine. Now we're all in a world were Europeans are openly talking about developing nuclear weapons. Taiwan is totally on it's own, and Greenland is worried about being annexed. There…

> All the US had to do was supply it's old weapons to Ukraine whilst replenishing it's stock (creating jobs in America) and things would have been fine.

Well, no, it's not fine, partly because we can't replenish our stocks fast enough. Ukraine is consuming nearly the entire planet's production capacity of Patriot missiles, eating enough of our ATACMS stockpile that it makes Combatant Commanders nervous, and more. To say nothing of the argument "supply Ukraine for as long as it takes, even if that means indefinitely" never made any sense; actions taken without a clear, achievable end goal in mind are just a waste of resources.

https://economictimes.indiatimes.com/news/international/us/d...

https://www.bruegel.org/analysis/us-defence-industrial-base-...

Re: Trump's Tariffs Wipe Out over $6T on Wall Street in Epic Two-Day Rout

#559

Post by lenerdenator » Sat, Apr 05, 2025, 6:26 AM UTC

JackYoustra wrote: post #535

lenerdenator wrote: post #434

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But then what are you doing to "help" American manufacturing?

I mean clearly nothing but why does that matter

Gotta have a hook. Look at how he did in the Upper Midwest in '24 vs. '20. That was through appealing to the manufacturing base. There are elements of that bloc that have wanted tariffs for decades.

If you lay off people to send the stock price up, you are the enemy. If you do it to "protect American manufacturing", you're a hero.

Well, to a very niche part of the voting public, but it's enough.

Re: Trump's Tariffs Wipe Out over $6T on Wall Street in Epic Two-Day Rout

#560

Post by _t9ow » Sat, Apr 05, 2025, 6:31 AM UTC

wtcactus wrote: post #56

jarym wrote: post #7

It is interesting that tech (Nasdaq) is the hardest hit here. The real engine of US exports for recent decades and likely to be a casualty as other countries plan their trade-war retaliation. And that's not even taking into consideration what might happen in the domestic market should there be a real recession - consumers will cut down their consumption and that'll filter back to lower corporate earnings. In previous…

This all tariff imbecility created solely by Trump it’s atrocious, still, if EU response is to hit the main players in Nasdaq - where there are a lot of chip producers necessary for the ongoing AI revolution - we are just shooting ourselves majorly in the foot. Surely there are much better companies for the EU to apply directed tariffs. EU absolutely has their weaknesses, but giving blunt responses (like China just d…

> giving blunt responses (like China just did and put tariffs on everything)

It's incorrect to describe their response as "blunt". As someone who follows mainland Chinese media I can assure you that their policymakers have thoroughly prepared themselves for years. They even foresaw in 2021, after Biden took office, that Trump would become President again, unless he was assassinated. (Yes, they foresaw the assassination attempts as well; and no, they did not orchestrate these attempts -- if they did, Trump would be dead already.)

The Chinese have much more foresight than you seemingly give them credit for, unless I'm misinterpreting your words (in which case I apologise). On the other hand, European leaders have been extremely geopolitically infantile.