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My MacBook keyboard is broken and it's insanely expensive to fix

tobiasberg.net

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Re: My MacBook keyboard is broken and it's insanely expensive to fix

#531

Post by throwaway85825 »

StingyJelly wrote: post #526
throwaway85825 wrote: post #416

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The ease of repair only needs to be in proportion to the likelihood of needing repair and frequency of occurrence.

Yes and given that keyboard replacement is really common repair (probably most common repair on butterfly models but still quite common now), the ease of repair is extremely disproportional. In case of OP's Macbook Pro: the rivets, the number of screws, the need to disassemble everything, even having to lift the glued in battery - all just to get to the keyboard.

I agree that the rivets and glued in battery is an issue that ideally would be dealt with by legislation. Some disassembly is always going to be required and I don't see that as a negative. I see a keyboard replacement as an, on average, once in a device lifespan event.

Re: My MacBook keyboard is broken and it's insanely expensive to fix

#532

Post by actionfromafar »

abc123abc123 wrote: post #511
actionfromafar wrote: post #238

Earlier quoted context omitted.

”Rrgulation never works”, is a very shallow take. It could mean anything. China is an autocratic system. Is that working? The US is going in that direction. On top of that, Europe isn’t a country. To have less regulation, you need more of it. Unifying regulations, or else you have dozens of completely different jurisdictions. To a large extent, you still do, even with the EU. You can’t sell to the general public in E…

"To have less regulation, you need more of it." Can you actually see the words you are typing? War is peace?

Sometimes you in fact need yet another standard to obsolete the previous 27 ones, yes. xkcd://927 notwithstanding.

Re: My MacBook keyboard is broken and it's insanely expensive to fix

#533

Post by jen20 »

roryirvine wrote: post #515
jen20 wrote: post #491

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> a few days later i had a new one This really sums up the reason I stuck with MacBook hardware even during the dark days of the end of the Intel era: I can have a new MacBook in basically any moderately developed city in the world inside an hour, and in fact did so twice when something catastrophic happened on work trips. Waiting a few days to fix something or get some custom-order-only laptop would not have been an…

That level of service is far from universal - Apple don't do onsite repairs at all in the UK, let alone inside 1 hour. It's all random third parties with crappy return-it-to-the-shop as a fallback.

I'm not even talking about onsite repairs, just about getting a new laptop to use.

I have indeed had my laptop repaired very quickly in the UK though (I still order them with British keyboards as 30 years of muscle memory does not go away). The Apple Store in Bath just took care of it.

Re: My MacBook keyboard is broken and it's insanely expensive to fix

#534

Post by jen20 »

Grisu_FTP wrote: post #501
jen20 wrote: post #491

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> a few days later i had a new one This really sums up the reason I stuck with MacBook hardware even during the dark days of the end of the Intel era: I can have a new MacBook in basically any moderately developed city in the world inside an hour, and in fact did so twice when something catastrophic happened on work trips. Waiting a few days to fix something or get some custom-order-only laptop would not have been an…

Well even if my Framework would explode it wouldnt be THAT big of a deal to me, i would just move over to my ps5 or steamdeck for the time and since i dont really go outside i would have to wait for the shipment anyway. Only scenario where it would be troubling is if it happened during the rare weeks where i am not home due to being a bit away in school but even then i dont think i would just buy an entirely new lapt…

This indicates effectively trivial use instead of seeing a laptop as a business tool.

"Write on paper" when you're on a consulting site for a client is not an option - much less when you bill by the hour.

I've actually had the situation where someone spilled a drink in my Mac and I was due to give a conference talk three hours later - that was actually recoverable because I could buy a new laptop with approximately the same configuration immediately, and didn't ruin the week.

Re: My MacBook keyboard is broken and it's insanely expensive to fix

#535

Post by piekvorst »

roboror wrote: post #489
piekvorst wrote: post #471

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Courts, police, and the army are proper. That's government. The difference is what kind of government. A proper government holds a monopoly on retaliatory force, it acts after someone initiates force or fraud. It doesn't dictate your screw size, battery compartment, or production method before you've harmed anyone.

Are there laws and lawmakers in this scenario?

Yes, to settle disputes. The purpose of these laws is the protection of individual rights, not consumer “rights” or any other special “rights” that belong exclusively to one group or race and no other.

Re: My MacBook keyboard is broken and it's insanely expensive to fix

#536

Post by 1718627440 »

raw_anon_1111 wrote: post #529
1718627440 wrote: post #517

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ignorance is a type of action, malevolence is a motivation. You can be ignorant out of malevolence and your ignorance can result in your actions being malicious. Voting based on who the (to be) elected hate instead of on actual policy is ignorant towards the serious matter of the art of leading a state (politics). Being malevolent regarding politics would be to sabotage elections or trying to dissolve state organs.

You mean when thousands of yokels broke into the Capital to try to overturn an election in January of 2020?

I thought we are still talking about "electing".

Re: My MacBook keyboard is broken and it's insanely expensive to fix

#537

Post by pixl97 »

piekvorst wrote: post #473
pixl97 wrote: post #394

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Right, this typically works very well after you spend tens to hundreds of thousands of dollars getting all the stuff to court in the first place to have a trial drag on for years in discovery all the while the hospital is sending out debt collectors. Oh, that's if it wasn't actually a shell company in the first place that has no assets. A good portion of the things you mention existed before we had food regulations,…

My claim is narrower: the principle of retaliatory force is practicable. That is, a society can function using only courts, class actions, and government-as-plaintiff, without preemptive editcs on screw sizes or battery compartments. As I said earlier in this thread: > Determining the best means of applying the principle of suing corporations in practice is an very complex question that belongs to the philosophy of l…

>My claim is narrower: the principle of retaliatory force is practicable

Ah yes, the school of theory that says it's better to clean up the spilled milk after its been contaminated with uranium waste.

Re: My MacBook keyboard is broken and it's insanely expensive to fix

#538

Post by Night_Thastus »

wolvoleo wrote: post #514
Night_Thastus wrote: post #385

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've never seen any evidence that either of those are true. However, it's not planned obsolescence either. It's just math. Building things to be repairable costs more money and time. There is very little incentive to do so, because most customers simply do not care. Thus, Apple does not bother. Nothing conspiratorial about it.

Most people do care even though they won't do any repairs themselves. This very article explains how it makes a few broken keys a 700$ repair. Customers do care about that.

No, enthusiasts care about that. People who have a soldering iron and will try to fix things themselves.

Most people do the following:

* Take it to Apple * Apple says it will cost $X * Customer says 'yes' and gets it repaired OR customer says 'no' (and proceeds to buy a new one)

That's what the vast, vast, vast majority of customers do.

Re: My MacBook keyboard is broken and it's insanely expensive to fix

#539

Post by piekvorst »

pixl97 wrote: post #537
piekvorst wrote: post #473

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My claim is narrower: the principle of retaliatory force is practicable. That is, a society can function using only courts, class actions, and government-as-plaintiff, without preemptive editcs on screw sizes or battery compartments. As I said earlier in this thread: > Determining the best means of applying the principle of suing corporations in practice is an very complex question that belongs to the philosophy of l…

>My claim is narrower: the principle of retaliatory force is practicable Ah yes, the school of theory that says it's better to clean up the spilled milk after its been contaminated with uranium waste.

You’re assuming that without preemptive permits, nothing stops a company from spewing uranium. But liability, if properly enforced, is a powerful deterrent. The threat of paying full cleanup costs, compensating victims, and facing criminal charges for negligence doesn’t require an official to approve one’s pipe size in advance.

Further, the principle doesn’t deny retaliating in advance when violence can be objectively anticipated.

Re: My MacBook keyboard is broken and it's insanely expensive to fix

#540

Post by pixl97 »

piekvorst wrote: post #539
pixl97 wrote: post #537

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>My claim is narrower: the principle of retaliatory force is practicable Ah yes, the school of theory that says it's better to clean up the spilled milk after its been contaminated with uranium waste.

You’re assuming that without preemptive permits, nothing stops a company from spewing uranium. But liability, if properly enforced, is a powerful deterrent. The threat of paying full cleanup costs, compensating victims, and facing criminal charges for negligence doesn’t require an official to approve one’s pipe size in advance. Further, the principle doesn’t deny retaliating in advance when violence can be objectivel…

This does not and cannot exist when the corporate veil exists. Make a corporate shell and throw it away like a used condom.

Add to that a company can cause a trillion dollars of damage while having only a billion dollars on hand. Criminal charges don't fix things, if they did there wouldn't be murderers in jail.

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