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Introducing Copilot+ PCs

blogs.microsoft.com

521–530 of 614 posts

Re: Introducing Copilot+ PCs

#521

"In fact, 87% of the total app minutes people spend in apps today have native Arm versions." - Are they meaning web browsers? I'm pretty sure the majority of time people spend in apps are web browsers, so it feels incredibly misleading if that's what they're referring to.

Browser, Office and VS Code

Re: Introducing Copilot+ PCs

#523

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I hope you realize that most of the gaming world runs on ARM CPUs and iGPUs today. Smartphones and tablets far outnumber gaming PCs.

You're made that same comment several times in this thread. But: - All gaming PCs are x86 - PS5 and Xbox are x86 - Handheld PCs (Steam Deck, Legion, etc) are x86 This is the market people are talking about when they say "gaming" and you know it.

Arm based Nintendo switch has sold more than PS5 an xbox Series combined

Re: Introducing Copilot+ PCs

#524

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I ran windows under qemu, with a GPU, and a dedicated soundcard, and multi-monitor for years - even though ostensibly there was a 10-15% "overhead" due to emulation/virtualization. I had exactly zero issues, and to be quite frank i couldn't tell any difference in framerates, especially compared to my windows laptop running the same games with roughly equivalent GPUs.

Could you share a little more about your setup? I assume a linux host, and perhaps 2 GPUs with one per OS? I'm guessing it's a desktop build and not a laptop (iGPU+dGPU)? I've really wanted to switch fully to linux, but I still use some "power" features in MS Office which apparently don't play nice on linux. Dualbooting Fedora is decent... when I can understand what's happening and don't need to go 4 layers deep ever…

ryzen 3700 64GB(total), gentoo on NVME, nvidia 1060; windows on another NVME as a qcow (or whatever), nvidia 1070ti, 8 physical cores no HT, 32-48GB RAM.

you have to disable the specific GPU you want to use for another OS in the kernel command line - this means you need two different spec/brand GPUs, probably. There were some tweaks that i could probably dig out eventually, but most of what i used to troubleshoot were the archlinux wiki and forum posts pointing to blogs. However if you're just needing Office, just installing windows in qemu on literally any GPU will probably be just fine!

you can rsync the qcow to back up the entire windows OS.

for me to run games and audio software in windows my command line was:

qemu-system-x86_64 -enable-kvm -m 1024 -cpu host,kvm=off -smp 4,sockets=1,cores=4,threads=1 -device virtio-scsi-pci,id=scsi -device vfio-pci,host=0d:00.0,x-vga=on -device vfio-pci,host=0d:00.1 -drive if=pflash,format=raw,readonly,file=/mnt/m2bay/ovmf/OVMF_CODE.fd -drive if=pflash,format=raw,file=/mnt/m2bay/ovmf/OVMF_VARS.fd -drive file=/mnt/m2bay/windows10-01.img,id=disk,format=raw,if=none -device scsi-hd,drive=disk -drive file=/mnt/synology/iso/Windows_10-32_64_pro_home.iso,id=isocd,if=none -device scsi-cd,drive=isocd -drive file=/mnt/synology/iso/virtio-win/virtio-win-0.1.171.iso,id=virtiocd,if=none -device ide-cd,bus=ide.1,drive=virtiocd -usb -device usb-host,hostbus=1,vendorid=0x046d,productid=0xc31c -device usb-host,hostbus=5,vendorid=0x1a2c,productid=0x0042 -soundhw hda -vga none -object input-linux,id=kbd,evdev=/dev/input/by-id/usb-Logitech_USB_Receiver-event-kbd,grab_all=y -object input-linux,id=mouse,evdev=/dev/input/by-id/usb-Logitech_USB_Receiver-if01-event-mouse

you press both ctrl buttons to switch back and forth between host and guest, windows gets its own ip. Running office wouldn't require >60% of that stuff

i should note that command line is probably from the first time i got it working, i'd have to boot that machine to get the latest version

Re: Introducing Copilot+ PCs

#525
post #230

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure, but the problem is S and X sound very similar when spoken, causing more confusion. Try clarifying which one you are talking about in a loud room at a conference.

All that is missing is the "Xbox E", hopefully the next one will be called that. Let's pray we get a special Tesla edition on launch day.

I see you haven't heard of the Xbox 360 E: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Xbox_360_retail_config...

Re: Introducing Copilot+ PCs

#526

The coordinated launch of real ARM laptops across 4 different companies, Dell, Lenovo, HP and Samsung is quite an achievement for Microsoft after a decade of failed ARM launches. This seems uniquely different to me because, there is a real and marketable limitation to what you can find in Intel/AMD (the lack of NPU). Before Microsoft pushed ARM as an option for "all day battery power" however, the huuuuuge tradeoff w…

Both Intel's and AMD's newer chips have NPUs as well. They are also better in the power consumption area, not as good as arm though. I don't see a reason they can get there as well, the actual instruction set does not matter much for power consumption. The MS announcement also talks about Intel/AMD favors of their "Copilot+ PCs"

Re: Introducing Copilot+ PCs

#527

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If in 18 months anyone feels that their ARM laptop isn't cutting it, i'll gladly pay $0.15/$1.00 for them. I know lots of people who could definitely benefit from a laptop that cannot afford them, and IME ARM runs linux just fine.

Really? Just researched this recently and it seemed the consensus was linux on Arm Surface devices is still mostly a non-starter.

will that be the case in 18 months?

Re: Introducing Copilot+ PCs

#528

Earlier quoted context omitted.

apple never wanted to use intel hardware, they were forced to by motorola/IBM et al; whoever was selling them the PowerPC chips told them to pound sand because the xbox and playstation needed way more PPC chips than apple. Apple made a business decision to switch to intel, which caused a bit of a to-do in the community at the time. That apple switched off intel at their earliest possible chance - that which took time…

IBM didn't want to design a power-efficient PowerPC chip. And then they switched from Intel once Intel stopped being able to design new power-efficient chips.

Well, that's not what the story was at the time. "You don't order enough" was the reasoning.

Further, nearly contemporaneously after apple M chips debuted intel released chips with P and E cores. Furthermore, Intel made lots of chips that have TDP under 10W, even 5W - multicore, even. I still use them to run HA VMs for emergency communications internet gateways.

"power-efficient" is a weird thing to claim, anyhow. What does it mean? PPC were much faster per socket than maybe even server class chips by intel, if you wanted power efficiency you could run them slower and get whatever FLOPS/J intel could give.

I am very sure i remember Apple not having a choice.

Re: Introducing Copilot+ PCs

#529

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, “ARM-based Linux laptop with 22h battery life” is much more interesting to me than “Windows 11 ARM-based AI PC”. If the TPU can eventually be utilized by open models under Linux that’s just a cherry on top.

Lenovo claimed 28h on their last arm laptop, real world was more like 10 for light tasks and 2 to 4 for heavier work like development

Laptop battery life estimates outside of Apple are downright criminal. I'm still bitter over the time I bought a fully loaded Sony Vaio which had an advertised battery life of 11 hours. When in actuality, I only got less than three hours of battery life and complained, they explained to me that they meant it gets 11 hours of standby mode with the lid closed. I only made the mistake of buying a non-Apple laptop one more time with a fully loaded XPS which could barely manage 4 hours of battery life. I honestly have no idea how anyone can put up with non-Apple laptops. It's pure garbage out there.

Re: Introducing Copilot+ PCs

#530

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not really. It was a little confusing when they renamed .net core to .net, but most people have moved past it

Is it not currently asp.net core?

Yes, it's still called "ASP.NET Core", even though ".NET Core" was renamed ".NET" from version 5 -- not to be confused with ".NET Framework 5", which was renamed ".NET Core 1.0" before launch.

Don't forget ".NET Standard" that could be used from both .NET Core and .NET Framework, until version 2.1.

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