Baltimore sues Hyundai, Kia over spike in car thefts • Hacker News Board

Re: Baltimore sues Hyundai, Kia over spike in car thefts

#521

Post by quad_eye_oh » Sat, May 13, 2023, 5:16 AM UTC

cdogl wrote: post #467

quad_eye_oh wrote: post #427

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think some of this political conflict is over what constitutes a harmless or victimless or nonviolent crime. In the past year I've seen different people claim that hemp consumption, property crime, and even intimidation with a firearm were nonviolent and that their perpetrators were merely marginalized individuals who need social assistance rather than prosecution. I think GP's point is that even property crime is…

Hemp consumption _is_ non violent. I agree with your overall sentiment but that inclusion made me squint.

That's my point, that some people will draw the line at things that are objectively nonviolent, and others will draw it at things that are objectively very close to violent. Actually come to think of it, violence is really just a proxy for harm to others.

Re: Baltimore sues Hyundai, Kia over spike in car thefts

#522

Post by Georgelemental » Sat, May 13, 2023, 5:23 AM UTC

c8formal wrote: post #500

typeofhuman wrote: post #218

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not the police. It's a failure of the courts. Prosecutors are simply not charging or reducing charges for these offenders. The police routinely arrest the same people over and over again - including for gun charges! But the courts let them out. Case in point. A couple of teens stole a car, smashed it into another car, killed a 6mo old and put his mother in the hospital. The charges? Trespassing.

It would help your point to provide a source

Seems to be Chicago, not Baltimore: https://wgntv.com/news/chicagocrime/teens-charged-with-misde...

Re: Baltimore sues Hyundai, Kia over spike in car thefts

#523

Post by cat_food » Sat, May 13, 2023, 5:32 AM UTC

pb7 wrote: post #343

carabiner wrote: post #224

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The US has very similar camps in the form of forced labor (i.e. slavery) by prisoners. These slaves have built products in the US that many of us have used, including clothes and office furniture. They make 63 cents per hour - make no mistake, they are slaves .

This is voluntary work for people who have been convicted. I agree they should be paid more though.

Several states still do not pay inmates, including Texas.

Re: Baltimore sues Hyundai, Kia over spike in car thefts

#524

Post by rocket_surgeron » Sat, May 13, 2023, 5:33 AM UTC

local_crmdgeon wrote: post #140

The City of Baltimore has repeatedly demonstrated that they will do anything besides try to change the behavior of the population. It's a failed city, and luckily the model is being exported to places like SF, LA, and DC. Why should we punish people who repeatedly commit crime anyway? Fuck it, why do anything? Let's sue Kia instead, maybe we can get a payday

[flagged]

Re: Baltimore sues Hyundai, Kia over spike in car thefts

#525

Post by Georgelemental » Sat, May 13, 2023, 5:37 AM UTC

shuckles wrote: post #499

nogginjoggin wrote: post #480

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

This is what I mean by strangely inconsistent demands for intellectual rigor. Not only does your summary of that article ignore that Central and South American countries with predominantly Latino populations dominate the top charts, but also it totally misses the actual point which is black Americans have higher crime rates than other countries with large numbers of black people which is a different claim than countr…

People I know who have spent a lot of time working all throughout Africa, say that Africans tend to be a lot more "tough" culturally about crime compared to African-Americans, especially in rural areas. When you are living at the edge of subsistence, you have absolutely zero tolerance for bullsh*t. You can't afford to. But in America there is much more of a safety net, and crime problems can get worse while still allowing the system to persist.

There are also issues with American culture more broadly, that as you note affect all demographics. As a country we have always emphasized freedom and independence; I generally like this view, but it does lead to some problems as well.

Re: Baltimore sues Hyundai, Kia over spike in car thefts

#526

Post by dragonwriter » Sat, May 13, 2023, 5:43 AM UTC

pb7 wrote: post #343

carabiner wrote: post #224

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The US has very similar camps in the form of forced labor (i.e. slavery) by prisoners. These slaves have built products in the US that many of us have used, including clothes and office furniture. They make 63 cents per hour - make no mistake, they are slaves .

This is voluntary work for people who have been convicted. I agree they should be paid more though.

> This is voluntary work for people who have been convicted.

Except its not; the 13th amendment allows, and several states have institutionalized, involuntary servitude of prisoners.

> I agree they should be paid more though.

In addition to not always being voluntary, it is also not always paid at all.

Re: Baltimore sues Hyundai, Kia over spike in car thefts

#527

Post by strix_varius » Sat, May 13, 2023, 6:06 AM UTC

elif wrote: post #487

ravensfan69 wrote: post #139

I live in Baltimore, in a pretty "good" part of town where most of the young professionals and Hopkins hospital staff live. I know 4 different people who've had cars stolen in the past 24 months. In 3 of these cases the perpetrators were teenagers, and in 2 of these cases they brandished guns. Only one of these thefts were Hyundai/Kia-related, and the thief punched my buddy in the face during the theft. Many others I…

In my small neighborhood there is a group of 4 teenagers who have stolen probably a dozen kias. They drive them for 20 minutes, total them for a tik tok, and walk away with immunity. They have been arrested, charged, and released at least 3 times. One of my neighbors has a recent kia that is not susceptible to these hacks, and 2 weeks ago witnessed these teens trying to steal her car one night. She went out and told…

"You stole a deadly vehicle and put people's lives in danger with it. Multiple times. You will be tried as an adult and the minimum sentence is 5 years."

Why is this not the obvious solution?

(not as if you could single-handedly enact it, of course, but why isn't the city's leadership doing so?)

Re: Baltimore sues Hyundai, Kia over spike in car thefts

#528

Post by georgeplusplus » Sat, May 13, 2023, 7:58 AM UTC

lostlogin wrote: post #496

georgeplusplus wrote: post #492

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wouldn't threaten cops with a choice to get a covid vaccine or keeping their jobs. Which you left out. But yeah let's blame carmarkers for shitty behavior by one of the worst cities in the country.

An underperforming department with huge corruption and brutality problems and you pick this as the issue to focus on? On the upside, cleaning shop is needed and this helped get that started.

Sounds like you're saying that only the corrupt cops didn't choose to get the shot. Which is consistent with blaming car manufacturers for crime.

I hope you live in this city to reap the reward of such crime that's an obvious fallout of your lovely ideas that has dominated it's city politics for decades.

Re: Baltimore sues Hyundai, Kia over spike in car thefts

#529

Post by ehnto » Sat, May 13, 2023, 8:09 AM UTC

lostlogin wrote: post #494

ehnto wrote: post #489

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which is why many countries mandate immobilisers in cars. I have had my car stolen twice so this issue isn't distant from me, if it has become a state issue it needs a state solution. Individual responsibility seems to be the American preference though, on an individual level you have the ability to install an immobiliser, and being familiar with the car's features when you make such a massive purchase shouldn't be u…

So it’s the buyers fault. This is a darkly hilarious take.

Well it's no one persons fault, except the criminal obviously. But there are a few contributors, and I feel in the US's responsibility model defending your property is usually your job.

Re: Baltimore sues Hyundai, Kia over spike in car thefts

#530

Post by ehnto » Sat, May 13, 2023, 8:11 AM UTC

lstodd wrote: post #495

ehnto wrote: post #489

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which is why many countries mandate immobilisers in cars. I have had my car stolen twice so this issue isn't distant from me, if it has become a state issue it needs a state solution. Individual responsibility seems to be the American preference though, on an individual level you have the ability to install an immobiliser, and being familiar with the car's features when you make such a massive purchase shouldn't be u…

Yeah, I had one with an immobiliser. By the third time it went nuts and blocked me from starting the car it took me about 3 minutes to reset it, and the tools were already kept in the trunk for just this. Now I live in a country where it's normal to leave cars with open windows and even doors in the street so that they don't overheat in the sun. Sometimes even with keys dangling. No immobilisers necessary -- only dec…

Yeah I ultimately agree with your last sentence, I used to live in a little town where that was the case. But cities will atract all types so you must hedge your bets.