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Baltimore sues Hyundai, Kia over spike in car thefts

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Re: Baltimore sues Hyundai, Kia over spike in car thefts

#491

Post by loeg »

alphanullmeric wrote: post #425
loeg wrote: post #421

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The whole conceit of pre-trial detention is that we do not know if the detainees are guilty.

Which does not disprove the implication I made, since you assumed the hypothesis to be false. Given that they are guilty, would you still support them? There sure seems to be a lot of “we should be nicer to thieves” in this thread, so I think we already know the answer.

I don't support thieves. This hypothetical where we know guilt before trial is not especially interesting or enlightening.

Re: Baltimore sues Hyundai, Kia over spike in car thefts

#492

Post by georgeplusplus »

khm wrote: post #437

Baltimore has a police force out of their control (it's in state hands) but they still have to pay for it. This has resulted in massive retention and recruitment issues, and some of the cops who did stick around were on the take -- specifically the Gun Trace Task Force, home of the locally-famous Jump Out Boys. Baltimore is an independent city, so it can't rely on county assistance for anything. Furthermore, state la…

I wouldn't threaten cops with a choice to get a covid vaccine or keeping their jobs. Which you left out.

But yeah let's blame carmarkers for shitty behavior by one of the worst cities in the country.

Re: Baltimore sues Hyundai, Kia over spike in car thefts

#493

Post by throwaway57443 »

cdogl wrote: post #469
flextheruler wrote: post #438

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t have a problem with some drugs being state regulated and I know it would reduce violence but the harder drugs should never be state sold we already have huge issues with alcohol which is a very hard drug. Acting as if lone actors serving narcotics or prostitutes are regular small business owner is an insult to legitimate entrepreneurs

Aside from the legality, what’s different between a liquor store owner and a weed dealer? You may disagree with their breaking the law, but commerce is commerce, and this is victimless except with regard to the rule of law.

[flagged]

Re: Baltimore sues Hyundai, Kia over spike in car thefts

#494

Post by lostlogin »

ehnto wrote: post #489
matthewdgreen wrote: post #465

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Once you’ve had a gun pointed at you from a car, taken down the license plate, then been told there’s nothing they can do because the car was stolen —- you’ll realize that car theft isn’t some individual problem. We’ve had the tech to solve this problem for decades, but car manufacturers decided to save a few bucks.

Which is why many countries mandate immobilisers in cars. I have had my car stolen twice so this issue isn't distant from me, if it has become a state issue it needs a state solution. Individual responsibility seems to be the American preference though, on an individual level you have the ability to install an immobiliser, and being familiar with the car's features when you make such a massive purchase shouldn't be u…

So it’s the buyers fault.

This is a darkly hilarious take.

Re: Baltimore sues Hyundai, Kia over spike in car thefts

#495

Post by lstodd »

ehnto wrote: post #489
matthewdgreen wrote: post #465

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Once you’ve had a gun pointed at you from a car, taken down the license plate, then been told there’s nothing they can do because the car was stolen —- you’ll realize that car theft isn’t some individual problem. We’ve had the tech to solve this problem for decades, but car manufacturers decided to save a few bucks.

Which is why many countries mandate immobilisers in cars. I have had my car stolen twice so this issue isn't distant from me, if it has become a state issue it needs a state solution. Individual responsibility seems to be the American preference though, on an individual level you have the ability to install an immobiliser, and being familiar with the car's features when you make such a massive purchase shouldn't be u…

Yeah, I had one with an immobiliser. By the third time it went nuts and blocked me from starting the car it took me about 3 minutes to reset it, and the tools were already kept in the trunk for just this.

Now I live in a country where it's normal to leave cars with open windows and even doors in the street so that they don't overheat in the sun. Sometimes even with keys dangling.

No immobilisers necessary -- only decent people are.

Re: Baltimore sues Hyundai, Kia over spike in car thefts

#496

Post by lostlogin »

georgeplusplus wrote: post #492
khm wrote: post #437

Baltimore has a police force out of their control (it's in state hands) but they still have to pay for it. This has resulted in massive retention and recruitment issues, and some of the cops who did stick around were on the take -- specifically the Gun Trace Task Force, home of the locally-famous Jump Out Boys. Baltimore is an independent city, so it can't rely on county assistance for anything. Furthermore, state la…

I wouldn't threaten cops with a choice to get a covid vaccine or keeping their jobs. Which you left out. But yeah let's blame carmarkers for shitty behavior by one of the worst cities in the country.

An underperforming department with huge corruption and brutality problems and you pick this as the issue to focus on?

On the upside, cleaning shop is needed and this helped get that started.

Re: Baltimore sues Hyundai, Kia over spike in car thefts

#497

Post by csomar »

HDThoreaun wrote: post #331
plagiarist wrote: post #247

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why is that?

America's dominant culture is toxic individualism. Respecting others is largely thought of a waste of time. There is no culture of shame like there is in eastern asian countries. Seriously, disrespecting people is something to be proud of for a huge number of americans. Everyone looks out for themselves and taking care of number 1 is generally seen as the correct decision. There is incredible income inequality which…

This is wrong. No amount of toxic individualism is going to make someone cross the Rubicon of using extreme violence (ie: shooting someone). Maybe non-violent theft but the US has serious violence issues.

People who use extreme violence against other people are deranged. It's a mental health issue. In other countries, it's limited and so the heuristic is to just lock these people up in some place called prison. In the US it's endemic making it difficult to control no matter how many people you are incarcerating.

Re: Baltimore sues Hyundai, Kia over spike in car thefts

#498

Post by jolux »

barry-cotter wrote: post #456
jolux wrote: post #351

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I linked the DOJ and not the Equal Justice Initiative because I thought they would be less likely to be seen as partisan or politically motivated. But here’s EJI on the same issue: https://eji.org/issues/prison-conditions/ and Harvard Political Review making a similar argument to my top post (that US prisons don’t adequately rehabilitate): https://harvardpolitics.com/recidivism-american-progress/ And since you linked…

Rehabilitation doesn’t work. The modern sociological study of crime and criminals began at the latest in the 70s. They’ve been looking for a reliably working method of rehabilitation for 50 years and have nothing. Prisons works fine as incapacitation, keeping criminals warehoused until they age out of their prime criminal years but rehabilitation doesn’t work. > Prisoner rehabilitation does not work, says former pris…

Call it what you like. Treating people with dignity would be a good place to start.

Re: Baltimore sues Hyundai, Kia over spike in car thefts

#499

Post by shuckles »

nogginjoggin wrote: post #480
shuckles wrote: post #462

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The poster wants to imply the population is black Americans even though similar ethnic groups in other countries don’t have nearly the same violent crime rates. Either there are structural factors at play or black Americans are somehow a specific distinct population from people of that diaspora around the world. This is where the analytical skepticism of people who insinuate these ideas tends to fall apart.

[flagged]

This is what I mean by strangely inconsistent demands for intellectual rigor. Not only does your summary of that article ignore that Central and South American countries with predominantly Latino populations dominate the top charts, but also it totally misses the actual point which is black Americans have higher crime rates than other countries with large numbers of black people which is a different claim than countries with large number of black people are low crime.

In fact, every demographic has higher crime rates in America than comparable countries. White Americans are much, much more violent than Europeans, Asian Americans are more violent than Asians, and black Americans are way more violent than Africans. The only ethnic group with lower crime rates in the USA is Latinos, which is mostly an indictment of Central America. Must be the radioactive water messing up the genes!

Re: Baltimore sues Hyundai, Kia over spike in car thefts

#500

Post by c8formal »

typeofhuman wrote: post #218
peoplearepeople wrote: post #167

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No it's completely ridiculous that police think this is a car manufacturer issue. This is a failure of the police

Not the police. It's a failure of the courts. Prosecutors are simply not charging or reducing charges for these offenders. The police routinely arrest the same people over and over again - including for gun charges! But the courts let them out. Case in point. A couple of teens stole a car, smashed it into another car, killed a 6mo old and put his mother in the hospital. The charges? Trespassing.

It would help your point to provide a source
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