Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

YouTube removed a viral video of two doctors calling for an end to quarantine

theblaze.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

521–530 of 714 posts

Re: YouTube removed a viral video of two doctors calling for an end to quarantine

#521

Post by AnthonyMouse »

wvenable wrote: post #515
AnthonyMouse wrote: post #506

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are entitled to a soapbox. You're not entitled to an audience . Each person chooses for themselves, not one party choosing for others.

You aren't entitled to a soapbox unless you make your own soapbox or buy one. Nobody is required to give you one. If you have a soapbox, you might still not get an audience. YouTube took their soapbox away.

They are buying one. The market rate happens to be free; they don't charge money for people to post videos on YouTube. But now Google is saying they won't sell you a soapbox, the same way they do everyone else, based on what you have to say. Building your own YouTube is not within the capacity of ordinary people.

You can either have companies that make decisions for their platforms or you can have monopoly/oligopoly platforms, but not both.

Re: YouTube removed a viral video of two doctors calling for an end to quarantine

#522

Post by victorbstan »

ColanR wrote: post #447

It's too bad that we are so quick to silence those who we perceive as wrong. Apparently, the doctors in the video were using incorrect facts; I wouldn't know, the video is gone. Discussion is being prohibited, wherever there is an approved expert to say the viewpoint is wrong. If dissention is labelled dangerous, and dissenting voices on important subjects are silenced, then we are creating an echo chamber with no re…

I found this breakdown of the claims informative: https://twitter.com/ct_bergstrom/status/1254481543759683584?...

Re: YouTube removed a viral video of two doctors calling for an end to quarantine

#523

Post by shkkmo »

hartator wrote: post #481
ColanR wrote: post #447

It's too bad that we are so quick to silence those who we perceive as wrong. Apparently, the doctors in the video were using incorrect facts; I wouldn't know, the video is gone. Discussion is being prohibited, wherever there is an approved expert to say the viewpoint is wrong. If dissention is labelled dangerous, and dissenting voices on important subjects are silenced, then we are creating an echo chamber with no re…

You can view the full video here: https://www.turnto23.com/news/coronavirus/video-interview-wi... Couple of their quick mental math when asked questions were wrong but most of it is sane and matches other sources.

How is estimating a death rate of 0.01% sane and what sources do you see matching it?

Re: YouTube removed a viral video of two doctors calling for an end to quarantine

#524

Post by RonanTheGrey »

olliej wrote: post #185
golergka wrote: post #161

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> why should YouTube be any different? Because it's almost a monopoly. It's not one of roughly equal dozens video hosting services. It's freaking youtube.

No it’s not. There are innumerable hosting services. The crux is people wanting to spread their views but who don’t want to pay to do that.

> There are innumerable hosting services.

Is this an honest comment or one you hope won't be challenged? There are NO video hosting services with the popularity or reach of YouTube, by a very long shot. Customers of ours have lost their entire livelihood because content that was present on YouTube for a decade was suddenly politically incorrect and their accounts got banned.

That wouldn't be the case if they had more than one reasonable option.

Re: YouTube removed a viral video of two doctors calling for an end to quarantine

#525

Post by zouhair »

RonanTheGrey wrote: post #505
notechback wrote: post #493

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why would you not have a problem with the anti-vax movement spreading disinfo and getting kids killed of diseases that had been eradicated in the country?

"Is life so dear, or peace so sweet, as to be bought at the price of chains and slavery?" Chains and slavery being a bit overstated, but hey that's the quote. In the long term, those few lives matter less than the billions - trillions - uncountable quadrillions - who benefit from free, Liberal cultures (capital L, not lowercase). This is not because the ends justify the means; they do not -- it is because the freedom…

> freedom to choose, even your own death by Darwin, is a pillar of a free society

People who don't want to stay home anymore are not a danger to themselves only, I could not care less if they die, I actually prefer if they do. But by not following distancing orders they are a danger to others.

As of touting this as some kind of Freedom Fight is mostly a load of bullcrap. What you are missing in your perfect world is that we should not tolerate the intolerant.[0]

You want to risk your life, go at it, but you should not be allowed to risk the lives of others.

[0]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paradox_of_tolerance

Re: YouTube removed a viral video of two doctors calling for an end to quarantine

#526

Post by fwn »

zouhair wrote: post #511
fwn wrote: post #502

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> This is not a philosophical debate, people are literally dying. That's a bit like "let's not think about what we're doing, people are literally dying". The gravity of the situation only increases the need for evaluation of our behavior as a society. Public discourse isn't an optional nice-to-have in times in which everything is fine, it's one of the cornerstones of democratic societies.

No, public discourse in a technical matter is out of the question. Equating the opinion of 2 random doctors to the thousands of epidemiologists worldwide is not helping democracy in any shape or form. It actually destroys it. We need to stop this insanity. Ignorant people's opinion is not worth the opinion of an expert.

I don't even know what "equating opinions" is supposed to mean in that context? We're talking about removing videos.

It's not about equating anything, but allowing people to express themselves.

> Ignorant people's opinion is not worth the opinion of an expert.

That's a very reasonable opinion to have but it's not what we're talking about.

We're talking about whether we should let Google make the decision on an opinions worth by removing videos.

Real discourse does not come with a bouncer, and even if we would try to dream up one that wouldn't outright delegitimize the discourse it certainly wouldn't be a US American for-profit without recourse or checks and balances.

I think it's popular to argue that it's the free press that serves the role of an evaluating institution. ..but here again: not a singular tech monopoly and not by removing those opinions, which just makes every evaluation questionable by default.

Re: YouTube removed a viral video of two doctors calling for an end to quarantine

#527

Post by zouhair »

legolas2412 wrote: post #507
surfpel wrote: post #480

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s all fun and games until your kid gets polio...

You can allow antivax movements to voice their flawed arguments and yet make vaccines mandatory. You can allow them to speak yet consider their opinions worthless.

Yeah, that's what's happening and kids are dead because of it and more will do.

Total free speech is cancer.

Re: YouTube removed a viral video of two doctors calling for an end to quarantine

#528

Post by hartator »

victorbstan wrote: post #522
ColanR wrote: post #447

It's too bad that we are so quick to silence those who we perceive as wrong. Apparently, the doctors in the video were using incorrect facts; I wouldn't know, the video is gone. Discussion is being prohibited, wherever there is an approved expert to say the viewpoint is wrong. If dissention is labelled dangerous, and dissenting voices on important subjects are silenced, then we are creating an echo chamber with no re…

I found this breakdown of the claims informative: https://twitter.com/ct_bergstrom/status/1254481543759683584?...

> From there, they scale up to the state level and claim 12% incidence statewide. The news story says it is using the same calculation, but it can't be—how did they get from 6.6% to 12%?

You have more data from LA: https://reason.com/2020/04/20/l-a-county-antibody-tests-sugg... 12% and more I believe is from NYC: https://www.livescience.com/covid-antibody-test-results-new-...

Re: YouTube removed a viral video of two doctors calling for an end to quarantine

#529

Post by wvenable »

AnthonyMouse wrote: post #521
wvenable wrote: post #515

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You aren't entitled to a soapbox unless you make your own soapbox or buy one. Nobody is required to give you one. If you have a soapbox, you might still not get an audience. YouTube took their soapbox away.

They are buying one. The market rate happens to be free; they don't charge money for people to post videos on YouTube. But now Google is saying they won't sell you a soapbox, the same way they do everyone else, based on what you have to say. Building your own YouTube is not within the capacity of ordinary people. You can either have companies that make decisions for their platforms or you can have monopoly/oligopoly…

No, using a free service is not the same as purchasing something that happens to be zero dollars. If there is a contractual relationship you can be sure that the terms are that Google can remove your video for any reason of their choosing and by using their service you are agreeing to that. And you do agree with that because it's free.

Nobody says you have to build your own YouTube as that is certainly not the only way you can get your message out. You're just being cheap. You want free stuff without consequences and that's not how the world works or how it should work.

Re: YouTube removed a viral video of two doctors calling for an end to quarantine

#530

Post by threatofrain »

nikolay wrote: post #123
threatofrain wrote: post #106

> We're actually seeing the patients. Dr. Fauci hasn't seen a patient for 20 years... it's like the general contractor vs the sub. He's not seeing patients, he's in an ivory tower, and we have a world of respect for him, he's a world reknown immunologist, two different, he's an academic, and we've dealt with academics all of our lives... but academics and reality are two different things. > Coronavirus lasts on plast…

If these are "doctors", I don't want them to treat me! ER is a different kind of health care! ER doctors are not virologists or epidemiologists. So, to use their own example, you don't want a plumber to do your roof!

Dr Daniel Erickson and Dr Artin Massihi have since been condemned by the American Academy of Emergency Medicine (AAEM) and the American College of Emergency Physicians (ACEP):

https://www.aaem.org/resources/statements/joint-endorsed/phy...

Post reply on HN