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What It's Like To Be Ridiculed For Open Sourcing A Project

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Re: What It's Like To Be Ridiculed For Open Sourcing A Project

#511

Post by steveplace »

quasque wrote: post #82
jlongster wrote: post #36

What the fuck. (And I rarely say that word.) We've got to grow up. This is 9th grade all over again. You know, those weird people that do things that you don't understand? They're the ones that grow up and make big impacts on the world. Why can't we get over our negativity? We can't stop ourselves from thinking horrible things, or even saying them out loud to people around us, but surely we can restrain ourselves fro…

I wouldn't be at all surprised if there was a strong undercurrent of misogyny involved here, motivating their incivility and rudeness.

I don't want to be the one to say it, but it hasn't yet been mentioned in this thread.

If the author was named Henry instead of Heather, this wouldn't make front page or have a comment thread full of white knights.

That doesn't make the critics right in their aggressiveness, and people overall should be nicer.

Re: What It's Like To Be Ridiculed For Open Sourcing A Project

#512

Post by caw »

pekk wrote: post #442
doktrin wrote: post #411

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> 1. You can pipe find/sed/grep/cut/awk/whatever to other utils. Today you might be replacing, tomorrow you might be analyzing text logs, and the more core utils you learn the more things you can do with them. Fair. This boils down to an individual's needs. I think most people in a position to be making this choice are fairly well aware of what's possible with standard nix CLI tools, and can decide whether or not to…

You actually do hear this brought up as a case against dotfiles and vim plugins, even the use of vim as opposed to vi. There is just this school of thought which says you should never use anything which isn't in a default CentOS install.

As a sysadmin, I can totally relate to those thoughts.

If you run nonstandard, you basically have to learn vim/vi as a default install for an OS and another with all your add-ins and customization. Sure the key bindings are similar, but I don't have my macros and why is my tabbing funny, there's no line numbers, and damn it, the backspace key doesn't work. I forgot I set that in my .vimrc.

Sure, I can remember most of the latter with set tab and set no, but when you're popping around systems, switching to root (with it's on .vimrc), keeping applications as stock as possible is very helpful.

I personally have a slightly custom .vimrc for my local use, but I don't rsync my dotfiles across the globe for my other home directories. I basically try to keep it as code development (with .vimrc) and sysadmin (may not have niceties, but I'm not editing code).

Re: What It's Like To Be Ridiculed For Open Sourcing A Project

#513

Post by scott_w »

mrb wrote: post #277
doktrin wrote: post #249

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Honestly, I think you ended up really making the case for replace. The nix CLI examples are convoluted at best. I've used CLI tools for years, and it would probably take me 5-10 minutes of scanning the man pages to reproduce all but the simplest of those snippets. Granted, this boils down to the sporadic use-case, but that's the entire point. The replace examples are all clean. It would mean I would not be juggling l…

Then take the 5-10 minutes to scan the man pages. Write a simple shell script wrapper exposing a syntax as simple as "replace". And be done with it in 15 minutes top. It seems to me that writing all this js code would take a lot longer than 15 min.

The issue is that it's 5-10 minutes to scan each man page every single time I want to use sed, find, xargs, etc.

I quickly reach a point where I just think "Fuck it, I'm writing a Python script for this."

A simple tool that only takes a couple of minutes to learn, then a five second look at the man page to refresh the syntax is very valuable, particularly if it focuses on doing the one job that people want to do most often.

Re: What It's Like To Be Ridiculed For Open Sourcing A Project

#514

Post by ygjb »

keeperofdakeys wrote: post #354
lloeki wrote: post #346

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> There's nothing wrong with rewriting sed in [X] Indeed, especially since there's sed and sed . The examples given use -i, but no luck with BSD sed, where you will use -i~ at best. Also, lack of -e before the expression may make things blow up at times. And the sed regex does not support stuff like +, so many times I end up replacing sed -i~ -e with perl -pi -e or ruby. Besides, sometimes your looping logic is not i…

> And the sed regex does not support stuff like + Are you talking about BSD sed here, because GNU sed does support + with the -r flag.

You just made his point.

Re: What It's Like To Be Ridiculed For Open Sourcing A Project

#515

Post by muratmutlu »

cachvico wrote: post #370
doktrin wrote: post #224

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Fair point. Once I read the names of those involved, I was a little taken aback for this very reason. Friends I respect think quite highly of Corey, for instance. Also worth noting, both [Steve and Corey] have published apologies on their own blogs. Both are worth reading.

Here's the other apology, http://blog.steveklabnik.com/posts/2013-01-23-node Heather, don't take it personally - your code is fine! JavaScript, on the other hand, is a wounded warrior by now..

Out of curiosity, do you think there would there have been blog post apologies if the harthur post was written by a guy?

Re: What It's Like To Be Ridiculed For Open Sourcing A Project

#516

Post by vital101 »

This is a lot what it feels like to blog about something technical, and then have someone swoop in and question not just your article, but your parentage and your IQ. It hurts a lot that people can't be constructive with their criticism, but I hope that Heather continues posting open source projects. Haters 'gonna hate, you just can't let them bring you down.

Re: What It's Like To Be Ridiculed For Open Sourcing A Project

#517

Post by kimmel »

muratmutlu wrote: post #515
cachvico wrote: post #370

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Here's the other apology, http://blog.steveklabnik.com/posts/2013-01-23-node Heather, don't take it personally - your code is fine! JavaScript, on the other hand, is a wounded warrior by now..

Out of curiosity, do you think there would there have been blog post apologies if the harthur post was written by a guy?

No. The hot button topic right now in open source is "increasing diversity" which means more attention is being focused on this.

Re: What It's Like To Be Ridiculed For Open Sourcing A Project

#519

Post by andreasvc »

mrb wrote: post #361
_ZeD_ wrote: post #275

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Please, tell me you're jocking: on your platform you cannot afford a pipe but you can launch node.js? by the way: "-print0 | xars -0" is really idiomatic, you know? Lucky you didn't have a single filename with spaces to handle...

"find -print0 | xargs -0" handles spaces in filenames perfectly correctly.

That's his point.

Re: What It's Like To Be Ridiculed For Open Sourcing A Project

#520

Post by d0m »

sid6376 wrote: post #392
tptacek wrote: post #221

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've been coding since 1993 and I have never made room in my brain for stuff like -print0. Moreover, there are times when you'll want to do this stuff from within another program. What are you going to do, shell out to a find(1) pipeline? Then people like me will be giving you shit. There's nothing wrong with rewriting sed in Javascript.

I looked up what print0 does as I use find and xargs a lot. Here's what print0 does - it separates the filenames with a null byte so that names containing spaces and newlines can be interpreted correctly. Hopefully someone else will find it useful.

The TL;DR of -print0 is just to make sure find works with all kind of weird filenames.
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