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Why it’s hard to buy deodorant in Manhattan

economist.com

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Re: Why it’s hard to buy deodorant in Manhattan

#511

Post by ryan_lane »

subradios wrote: post #244
ryan_lane wrote: post #180

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Knowing your suppliers and that their goods are legitimate is a pretty basic function of a business, and calling people progressive to enforce that is a bit strange. Amazon isn't a pawn shop. They have a lot of choice when it comes to dealing with known businesses.

It is a valuable activity that Amazon and eBay will ship any product to anyone at a fair price with a minimum of obligatory hoop jumping. The more pressure they receive from the public and regulators to put a stop to those dastardly shoplifters, the more room Nike has to stop people from selling Nike shoes without a badge of certification from Nike.

Selling stolen goods hurts everyone, which is why it's a crime. It hurts the companies being stolen from, it hurts competing businesses who have a hard time competing legally, it hurts consumers, who get reduced choice due to reduced competition, and it hurts communities when their local chains shut down because organized crime has a place to fence their goods.

It's mind boggling that folks are defending the ability to sell stolen goods, while wanting to harshly punish petty theft.

Re: Why it’s hard to buy deodorant in Manhattan

#512

Post by Epitom3 »

standardUser wrote: post #112
Vaslo wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What punishment do you suggest then? The unacceptable answer is none.

The fact that the only solution you see is "punishment" is exactly the problem. No reasonable punishment will stop these crimes. Period. And unreasonable punishments, like locking a human in a cage without rehabilitation for years of their life, only make the problem worse and cost us a ridiculous amount of money (and humanity). So maybe take a step back, or five, and think about the causes of petty crimes and why th…

Can't even argue with someone who thinks like this. But in an ideal situation, you would get to live in a city with no prosecution for theft and I get to live somewhere with harsh punishment for theft.

The problem is I have to live under the mayors you vote for because there's a few more of you than me.

Re: Why it’s hard to buy deodorant in Manhattan

#513

Post by hn_throwaway_99 »

hellfish wrote: post #447
HDThoreaun wrote: post #438

Earlier quoted context omitted.

New York is where the jobs are. Just leave and get another 200k job as a banker where?

> New York is where the jobs are. Just leave and get another 200k job as a banker where? If you scale that 200k for cost of living it shouldn't be very hard to find an alternative

This economics point is often misunderstood, because at the high-end of the earnings spectrum, a large portion of income can go to savings, and cost-of-living differences make no impact on that.

That is, if you're making a $200k salary in NYC, let's say you spend 50k a year on housing and 50k a year on other expenses, but the rest you can put towards savings.

Then you move somewhere that is 50% cheaper, but you make 50% less. So now you can get the same quality apartment for $25k and your other expenses are only $25k, but you're only saving $50k a year instead of $100.

Obviously this is a gross oversimplification, but the vast majority of time if you move to a place with a much lower cost of living, your reduction in salary, if looking at local jobs, is unlikely to make up for it. Never mind the fact that for many industries there are only a few places where you can live if you really want a career: if you work in high finance or fashion in the US, you probably want to live in NYC. Film or TV, you'll be in LA, etc.

Re: Why it’s hard to buy deodorant in Manhattan

#514

Post by themitigating »

aliqot wrote: post #476
bushbaba wrote: post #462

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Except products like deodorant are considered health products. Amazon doesn’t just let you easily sell health products, you need to produce invoices, receipts, etc. More likely this stuff is sold on ebay

> Except products like deodorant are considered health products. Amazon doesn’t just let you easily sell health products, you need to produce invoices, receipts, etc. I have doubts about this.

It appears to be true. This page describes the categories and there seems to be an approval process to prevent what this article is talking about. https://www.sellerapp.com/blog/amazon-restricted-categories-...

It does link to Amazon's seller central but I don't have an account to see the actual list.

Re: Why it’s hard to buy deodorant in Manhattan

#515

Post by kriskrunch »

dls2016 wrote: post #363
axutio wrote: post #161

Most of the comments here are ignoring the difference between regular old shoplifting and the trend driving the increase discussed in the article, which they're referring to as "organized retail crime". I think it's very fair to have differing attitudes/moral thresholds for an impoverished mother shoplifting a week's worth of baby formula versus "a couple in Alabama [which] pled guilty to shifting $300,000-worth of s…

> Most of the comments here are ignoring the difference between regular old shoplifting and the trend driving the increase discussed in the article, which they're referring to as "organized retail crime". I guess, but conversely I'd argue that organized retail theft has been around pretty much as long as supply chains have existed. That's the mob's bread and butter. The phrase "riding shotgun" is in common use. Perha…

You have it backwards. Saying it's the store's fault is like blaming a victim of rape.

Once I chased a thief out to the waiting car, and blocked the door from closing, leaned into the car, and came to my senses...

I let them go. It was only worth $750. And I wasn't about to brawl inside a car with two thugs.

I could have been stabbed or shot. It's not worth the risk. And I was the store owner. Let me tell you straight up: it's not understaffing.

I would expressly tell my staff to not risk their safety for merch.

A couple years after I sold the store, they had an armed robbery at closing and lost about a hundred thousand. Also, break-ins went up: they tried cutting the safe out but couldn't reach the rear bolts to cut them. They even stole the security cameras.

I only reported once because I knew the guy and I felt betrayed. I don't know for certain, but I think the vast majority of retail theft goes unreported.

And your favorite shoplifting fact is down-right offensive. If you were more balanced in your counterargument you'd also ask the reader: What is the cost to the public for added security, staff, deterrence tech, and lost merch? And lost sense of safety and security? Those are priceless in the eyes of most reasonable people.

It's sad to think we may have lived through the golden era of retail where stores were relatively safe and pallets of merch could be left out unguarded.

These gangs are ruining it for everyone. We shouldn't even have this discussion. We should all unify with retailers of all sizes. Theft is straight up wrong, and the thieves should be punished.

Re: Why it’s hard to buy deodorant in Manhattan

#516

Post by hn_throwaway_99 »

compiler-guy wrote: post #25
bobbylarrybobby wrote: post #19

The article says prosecutors don't go after these thefts but I'd think the issue is with the cops and the number of arrests. After the BLM protests of 2020 (George Floyd) cops basically went hands off on these so called minor crimes, and so I'd imagine many of them don't even make it to prosecutors. We'd need a graph of incidents and arrests for years prior to 2020 (or months in early vs late 2020) to see the change.

The article claims that the BLM protests made little difference, and include a graph of various states comparing the amount of shoplifting with the amount of prosecution. Generally there doesn’t seem to be a correlation between states with large BLM protests and reduced prosecution. For example, Oregon had huge protests and weak government responses, and yet prosecutes large amounts of shoplifting. Blaming this on th…

As others have said, aggregating at the state level makes no sense.

For example, in Austin, TX, I can't speak for retail crimes in particular but there has most definitely been a change in prosecuting other crimes. Hit-and-runs are an epidemic now in the city, primarily because the police won't even respond unless there is a major injury. I was in a hit and run, I got a detailed description of the car and license plate, and yet there were 0 consequences to the person that hit me. It actually makes more sense to run if you hit someone because there are literally no downsides (except for people with a conscience, of course).

But if you looked across TX as a whole, this data would definitely not show up.

Re: Why it’s hard to buy deodorant in Manhattan

#517

Post by alkonaut »

renlo wrote: post #265
ulfw wrote: post #227

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The US is not a continent, let alone "an entire fucking" one. Sorry mate.

In that case neither is Europe or Asia ;)

I don't think anyone claims Europe or Asia are "Continents" or "Entire continents".

Re: Why it’s hard to buy deodorant in Manhattan

#518

Post by alkonaut »

A cheap deodorant (Dove/whatever) is like $2-3 in expensive parts of Europe. That's not worth stealing. What makes them $8 or $10 in manhattan? It's an expensive area and I guess there aren't many large stores to buy from but more smaller pharmacies, but that still doesn't explain why there is a 2-3x price difference for deodorants in particular.

Re: Why it’s hard to buy deodorant in Manhattan

#519

Post by crackercrews »

aliqot wrote: post #478
Robotbeat wrote: post #144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Same as any small business reselling stuff bought in bulk that people need like one or two of every year?

One or two in a year? Is this a passing hobby or a hygiene regimen?

How many do you go through? Probably 2 for me. Definitely not more than 3.

Re: Why it’s hard to buy deodorant in Manhattan

#520

Post by jahnu »

oerpli wrote: post #410
public_defender wrote: post #365

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Getting a low-level criminal or junkie off the street, alive, is worth a lot. Off the street and on to Riker's Island. A jail so dangerous that it has a high likelihood of being put into federal receivership in the next year. People are safer on the street. Full stop.

But the streets are safer with some of those people in Riker.

Short term. What happens long term? What are the aggregate consequences of such policies to society?

I don't know the answers to these questions, I would want an expert to weigh in.

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