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German court bans Tesla ad statements related to autonomous driving

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Re: German court bans Tesla ad statements related to autonomous driving

#511

Post by OnlyForF1 »

dlp211 wrote: post #381
DenisM wrote: post #248

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In aviation the auto-pilot is a relatively dumb machine that must be supervised, whereas a co-pilot is a human that could be trusted with full operations of the aircraft. I find it rather droll that the common use of the words completely inverted the original meaning.

It likely inverted because vehicles don't come with two sets of steering instruments and therefore co-pilot/driver means something else in the driving world.

A co-driver in the driving world is either a Rally co-pilot who gives extremely detailed navigation instructions or someone who will literally get into the drivers seat to relieve the duties of the other driver on long road trips. It's a much more involved process than what an airplane autopilot can do.

Re: German court bans Tesla ad statements related to autonomous driving

#512

Post by OnlyForF1 »

FabHK wrote: post #89
perbu wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Have you flown on autopilot? It maintains speed, height and direction. It doesn't land or take off. Originally it couldn't even turn.

Sure. And during those hours of straight and level flight you can read a book or talk to the cabin crew or have a meal. Shouldn't do that in the car (yet).

That violates the sterile cockpit rule and is a HUGE no no. Pilots can only read a book or talk to cabin crew if the control of the aircraft is with the other human pilot in the cockpit. Someone has to be ready to take control of the aircraft at a moment's notice in the case of a sensor, software, or mechanical failure.

Re: German court bans Tesla ad statements related to autonomous driving

#513

Post by maxharris »

catalogia wrote: post #402
maxharris wrote: post #383

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hmm, looks like Tesla actually does do sensor fusion, just not with lidar: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19803817 I also think that being so cynical about Tesla's motives is pretty short-sighted from an investment perspective. In the long-term, they don't win if they don't get this right.

Their radar/ultrasound has awful angular resolution. That's where LIDAR excels. This is why Telsa cars run into trucks parked across the street. Their stereoscopic depth map is shoddy and the radar or ultrasound has awful angular resolution that can't tell the difference between an object parked next to the street and one parked in the middle of the street. > "In the long-term, they don't win if they don't get this r…

I have 110 shares, and I'd love to talk to you about how that's going in 2024. I'm maxharris9 on twitter

Re: German court bans Tesla ad statements related to autonomous driving

#514

Post by asddubs »

catalogia wrote: post #252
itsoktocry wrote: post #205

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> who has arguably done/will do more for the continuation for humanity than anyone else who has ever lived. Because he's building some electric cars? How low is your bar?

Presumably they mean "populate Mars and thus avert human extinction" but that's definitely counting chickens before they hatch.

maybe the billionaires could actually do something about climate change instead of trying to flee to mars. i doubt musk is saving space for me in his escape pod

Re: German court bans Tesla ad statements related to autonomous driving

#515

Post by LoSboccacc »

ashtonkem wrote: post #430
LoSboccacc wrote: post #408

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> next year this year https://www.forbes.com/sites/johnkoetsier/2020/07/09/elon-mu...

If you buy Tesla or Musk’s promises on when FSD will arrive, then I have a bridge for sale. They’ve been promising that “soon” for a long time now.

did I ever say I believed him?

Re: German court bans Tesla ad statements related to autonomous driving

#516

Post by fomine3 »

alasdair_ wrote: post #507
Smoosh wrote: post #457

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It's not really the car design I think it partly is the car design. They were the first manufacturer trying to make a mainstream car which was designed from the ground up to take advantage of being a BEV (for example with batteries flat under the floor). Others always based their electric car upon an existing ICE design despite the ensuing compromises.

This is super important. Most ICE vendors tried to take an existing vehicle, remove the ICE components and shoehorn in an electric motor. Tesla really nailed the “ground up” design (a drag coefficient of 0.24 was almost unbelievable when the model S debuted) and even now the other makers haven’t really caught up.

2016 Toyota Prius – 0.24 Cd.

Re: German court bans Tesla ad statements related to autonomous driving

#517

Post by sjwright »

frenchy wrote: post #6
H8crilA wrote: post #2

Tesla has been selling level 5 autonomy since 2016. I can see nothing wrong with that. Definitely not vaporware /s https://www.tesla.com/blog/all-tesla-cars-being-produced-now...

I'm not sure it should be called level 5 autonomy until Tesla is willing to take responsibility for any accidents it causes.

This is correct. The driver is responsible when their actions—in contravention of the road rules—cause an accident. If a vehicle is L5, the only "driver" is software. This software would need to attain a driver license just like a human would. Thus software becomes the vehicle's legal driver for the purpose of accountability in an accident.

Tesla is absolutely willing to take responsibility. You'll have to use Tesla as your car insurance provider, but it'll be cheaper than anyone else's insurance so that's fine.

Why would it be cheaper? Because they're insuring a driver that never gets angry, never gets distracted, doesn't drink and has high resolution dash cams pointing in every direction and capturing every moment. Even as the software is imperfect, it's going to have so many fewer accidents that the statistical risk of insuring the entire fleet is going to be minuscule compared to random humans.

Re: German court bans Tesla ad statements related to autonomous driving

#519

Post by knocte »

ojnabieoot wrote: post #21
dkonofalski wrote: post #3

I agree with this wholeheartedly, even as a Tesla owner. Tesla goofed from the beginning by calling tech like "Autosteer" and "Traffic Assisted Cruise Control" under the moniker "Autopilot" while shifting everything above that to "Full Self-Driving". They should have called it "CoPilot" since that infers that you're still the driver in charge of controlling the vehicle and it would have had exactly the same reception…

> Tesla goofed from the beginning by calling tech like "Autosteer" and "Traffic Assisted Cruise Control" under the moniker "Autopilot" I am not accusing you specifically of using weak language, but let's call a spade a spade: it's not a "goof," it's a dangerous and deceptive business practice. It's one that Elon Musk is directly responsible for and directly encouraged with misleading statements where he deliberately…

Amen.

Re: German court bans Tesla ad statements related to autonomous driving

#520

Post by erinnh »

lostsock wrote: post #472
_lmm8 wrote: post #295

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because the original parent comment is using an analogy to aviation terms, and depending on a more than cursory understanding of the limits of an aircraft autopilot. I am willing to make a monetary bet most members of the population do not understand the precise limitations of an aircraft autopilot, though I admit I have not conducted a poll to verify this. I also think Tesla likely named it this to differentiate it…

I bet if I asked 10 people what is more autonomous, an autopilot or a copilot 10 out of 10 of them would say a copilot.

Id you'd asked me, I wouldve said the autopilot. Cause its more "automatic" and a co-pilot would still require me to be there, hence the "co".

But thats just how I understood it before.

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