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Works With Nest

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Re: Works With Nest

#51

Post by cbeach »

aisenik wrote: post #35
Niten wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It was Apple that chose to make HomeKit a nonstandard, proprietary protocol for the purpose of locking people into iOS. You simply cannot fault Google for failing to fall in line with Apple's play for the market.

Putting HomeKit behind MFi is a barrier, but hardly one that should put Nest off the platform. The majority of their installed user base uses iOS. I kind of expected my Nests to last me 10+ years, but now I'm left wondering if I'll be replacing them sooner. (It's not clear to me how Nest's API is any more standard than HomeKit.) Of course, from a business perspective this all makes sense. But as a customer, it's disa…

It's a pity Google acquired Nest. If not, it probably would have supported both Apple and Google's control solution.

HomeKit is mostly just an addressing system allowing the house to be described in config. It's not a huge loss for consumers if both Apple and Google have their own flavours of this.

Provided the product companies producing hardware remain independent rather than being swallowed up by Apple or Google.

I'd be equally annoyed if Apple started acquiring companies like Withings.

Re: Works With Nest

#52

Post by [deleted] »

aisenik wrote: post #35
Niten wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It was Apple that chose to make HomeKit a nonstandard, proprietary protocol for the purpose of locking people into iOS. You simply cannot fault Google for failing to fall in line with Apple's play for the market.

Putting HomeKit behind MFi is a barrier, but hardly one that should put Nest off the platform. The majority of their installed user base uses iOS. I kind of expected my Nests to last me 10+ years, but now I'm left wondering if I'll be replacing them sooner. (It's not clear to me how Nest's API is any more standard than HomeKit.) Of course, from a business perspective this all makes sense. But as a customer, it's disa…

[deleted]

Re: Works With Nest

#53

Post by nevi-me »

cbeach wrote: post #32
AVTizzle wrote: post #18

Looking at the Nest lineup, I was reminded of that adage: "Google is getting better at design faster than Apple is getting better at web services." Those products look damn good.

Of course they look good. They were designed by the Nest team, not by Google's own designers. Nest was an acquisition, and I can't see those guys getting involved in the huge challenge of making Google's other properties look good.

Yea, they bought it. Doesn't that give them the right to call it their own product? Will that always apply to future Nest products, or is it only for the ones that existed at the time of acquisition? If 'we' acquire something at work, it becomes ours. We incorporate its results and start being measured by its performance.

Re: Works With Nest

#54

Post by andybak »

aisenik wrote: post #35
Niten wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It was Apple that chose to make HomeKit a nonstandard, proprietary protocol for the purpose of locking people into iOS. You simply cannot fault Google for failing to fall in line with Apple's play for the market.

Putting HomeKit behind MFi is a barrier, but hardly one that should put Nest off the platform. The majority of their installed user base uses iOS. I kind of expected my Nests to last me 10+ years, but now I'm left wondering if I'll be replacing them sooner. (It's not clear to me how Nest's API is any more standard than HomeKit.) Of course, from a business perspective this all makes sense. But as a customer, it's disa…

Choosing to install a Google app on an Apple device is a much lower barrier than there not even being an Apple app for a Google device.

I'm no lover of walled gardens but one that allows you entry without buying a $700 smartphone is the lesser of two evils.

I was discussing the cost of laser barcode scanners with someone the other day and the few models that are iOS certified are significantly more expensive due to MFi.

Re: Works With Nest

#55

Post by [deleted] »

aisenik wrote: post #35
Niten wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It was Apple that chose to make HomeKit a nonstandard, proprietary protocol for the purpose of locking people into iOS. You simply cannot fault Google for failing to fall in line with Apple's play for the market.

Putting HomeKit behind MFi is a barrier, but hardly one that should put Nest off the platform. The majority of their installed user base uses iOS. I kind of expected my Nests to last me 10+ years, but now I'm left wondering if I'll be replacing them sooner. (It's not clear to me how Nest's API is any more standard than HomeKit.) Of course, from a business perspective this all makes sense. But as a customer, it's disa…

[deleted]

Re: Works With Nest

#56

Post by ars »

vnorby wrote: post #13
yitchelle wrote: post #8

I am a little bit unenthusiastic about Nest integration into the Mercedes Benz where it tells Nest to warm up the house prior to arrival. What a waste of energy! Is it so difficult for physical human body to endure some discomfort while the house warms up? Imagine thousands of household doing something similar. OK, there could be a use-case where the elderly is due to arrive home and needs the house to be at the righ…

Wasting/saving energy is not as simple a calculation as that. When energy is at peak use (say in the winter, around 5:30/6:00 when everybody returns from work), it becomes more expensive for energy companies to procure the requisite energy needed. During these peak times, they often have to buy energy from other companies at a higher cost or find less efficient means of generating it (e.g. coal) to meet the demand. G…

I looked into the nest but I don't think it would save me any energy. And I'm wondering if that's actually true for lots of people.

I have a modulating (i.e. change flame level) condensing boiler (the highest efficiency available). I programmed it to run as close to 24/7 as I could, because that way it uses the lowest flame, which is the most efficient flame.

When I tried a setback thermostat when the boiler attempted to rewarm the house it shifted to a higher and therefor less efficient flame. So I gave up on that and let it run on low all the time. So there would be no peak usage by me.

As people shift to more efficient ways to heating I suspect that this will happen to everyone. Not just modulating boilers, but also multi-stage heating with a heat pump. By trying to rapidly heat the home you can't use the heat pump.

It's also true with an A/C - the faster you are trying to cool the larger temperature gradient you need, and therefor you lose efficiency.

If I'm wrong here I would be happy to be corrected, but the US Government seems to agree with me: https://www.energystar.gov/index.cfm?c=archives.thermostats_...

Re: Works With Nest

#57

Post by rightnow »

I dont get it with those thermostats. Dont you have floor heating in concrete as we have in sweden? Adjusting the thermostat takes up to 2 days before you feel a difference.

Re: Works With Nest

#58

Post by chaz »

Google's Nest seems to be setting out a home automation standard, partnering with Whirlpool, Mercedes-Benz, Jawbone, LIFX, IFTTT, Logitech, and Chamberlain. Over the weekend, Quirky announced its $79 Wink hub, partnering with Home Depot, Honeywell, GE, Rachio, and Philips.

The two announcements were obviously timed against each other. It's hard to tell who is reacting to whom, but my bet is that Quirky is hurriedly reacting to a pending Google I/O announcement this week, and getting the word out by giving the NYT an exclusive [1]. It also looks like Nest has an actual, planned microsite vs Quirky, who only has mention of GE on their website (https://www.quirky.com/ge) and doesn't have much of an official Wink page yet (https://www.quirky.com/wink is bare).

Add to that Apple's Homekit, announced at WWDC, partnering with Osram Sylvania, Skybell, TI, Chamberlain, August, Honeywell, Haier, Schlage, Philips, Black and Decker, Netatmo, Withings, and others. More brands/logos, but it's early.

Regardless, it's at least a three-horse race and we'll see it get worse before it gets better. All have serious brands on board and consumers will be confused for quite some time. A single, open, interoperable standard is coming but the race will encourage a flurry of product investments to get smarter devices in the initial stages.

[1] http://www.nytimes.com/2014/06/23/technology/quirky-hopes-wi...

Re: Works With Nest

#59

Post by hueving »

AVTizzle wrote: post #46
cbeach wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Of course they look good. They were designed by the Nest team, not by Google's own designers. Nest was an acquisition, and I can't see those guys getting involved in the huge challenge of making Google's other properties look good.

You're absolutely right. I understand, and completely agree. But by virtue of said acquisition, Nest's design chops == Google's design chops.

Well nest is still independent from what they want people to believe at least, so it's actually unlikely that the nest designers will help any other Google products.

It's like saying Tina Fey is part of Comcast's acting talent because of her role in 30 rock.

Re: Works With Nest

#60

Post by jvanloov »

yitchelle wrote: post #8

I am a little bit unenthusiastic about Nest integration into the Mercedes Benz where it tells Nest to warm up the house prior to arrival. What a waste of energy! Is it so difficult for physical human body to endure some discomfort while the house warms up? Imagine thousands of household doing something similar. OK, there could be a use-case where the elderly is due to arrive home and needs the house to be at the righ…

We have a thermostat in our house that has a weekly programme: it turns the heat on in the morning, then off at 7:30 when everyone is at work/school, back on at 16:30 so that the house is heated when we get back home from work/school, and off again at 22:30 around bedtime. During weekends it heats during the day and is off during the night.

There was never any question on using this system; everyone I know has this, unless they live in a really old house or an apartment block with common heating. It's a standard for heating systems called OpenTherm.

Is this really that uncommon, or is this a European thing?

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