India's pro-business Modi storms to historic election win • Hacker News Board

Re: India's pro-business Modi storms to historic election win

#51

Post by darwinGod » Fri, May 16, 2014, 3:45 PM UTC

To those very new to India's politics, there are few things to consider before forming an opinion of Modi's involvement in the 2002 riots.

(a) The Government in power at the center was the opposition party ( Congress) throughout the last decade. (2004-214). If they had the power to twist Supreme court's arm (appointment of judges etc), they would have most certainly done that, and influenced the outcome.

(b) The Government at the Center (2004-2014) has had at its disposal the main investigative body of the country (CBI) to do any arm-twisting against Modi.

(c)Despite this, and despite intense media scrutiny in India, if the Supreme Court- the highest court in India- has given Modi a clean chit on his involvement in the riots, then sufficient respect has to accorded to the same. It is significantly way,way,WAY more authoritative than any wannabe-investigative journalists airing their opinions non-stop on television or highly-viewed blog articles. Let that sink in.

If a thousand well-indexed news articles/ well followed blogs paint a different picture, that does not change facts.

The Supreme court of India has been known to be strong and independent,even openly rebuking the Center for it's stupidity and corruption ( Search for 2G-Spectrum scam). True we have a lot of corruption everywhere,but the arm-chair dismissal of Indian Supreme Court's weightage- by Indians ourselves- against top 10 google search results - pains me.

If Indians ourselves cant do that, how can we expect the global audience to form an informed opinion?

Re: India's pro-business Modi storms to historic election win

#52

Post by cscurmudgeon » Fri, May 16, 2014, 3:47 PM UTC

monsterix wrote: post #49

I usually do not write comments on politicians, but being an Indian I feel sad that someone like Narendra Modi has even been considered for the post of Prime Minister by my countrymen. Let alone the decision to elect him for the top job. But so it is, he is now the PM, and I accept what democracy and fate has asked me to accept and go with. Having said that I am yet to understand why the following murders by the Godm…

Let us apply a non zero amount of critical thinking and logic.

> Narendra Modi and his team of murderers

You either have evidence for that statement or you don't.

1. If it is the first, go to the courts, else you will be deemed complicit in the murders.

2. If it is the latter, you are not telling the truth.

Which one is it?

Re: India's pro-business Modi storms to historic election win

#53

Post by pessimizer » Fri, May 16, 2014, 3:48 PM UTC

cstross wrote: post #33

Calling Modi "pro-business" seems like a bit of an over-simplication. He's a member of the RSS ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rashtriya_Swayamsevak_Sangh ), which is arguably a violently anti-muslim paramilitary group, as well as leading the BJP ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bharatiya_Janata_Party ). It's not unreasonable to call the BJP centre-right on economic/business issues ... but they have other policies as…

Leaving this here before it falls to the bottom of the page:

Narendra Modi and the rise of India’s neo-fascist Far-Right: The facts

http://www.loonwatch.com/2014/04/narendra-modi-and-the-rise-...

Re: India's pro-business Modi storms to historic election win

#54

Post by joosters » Fri, May 16, 2014, 3:50 PM UTC

Brakenshire wrote: post #41

joosters wrote: post #24

Note that 'pro-business' is a politically empty phrase. After all, no candidate in any election would claim to be 'anti-business'. If the opposite to any given political standpoint is completely unacceptable, then IMO that makes the original viewpoint empty and meaningless.

> Note that 'pro-business' is a politically empty phrase. After all, no candidate in any election would claim to be 'anti-business'. Not sure I agree, for instance no candidate would claim to be 'anti-life', but that doesn't make 'pro-life' a politically empty phrase. In that case, you know exactly what someone means by it. But pro-business is definitely vague. It might just as well mean 'friendly with industrialists…

True, a good counterexample!

I think in general it is a good rule of thumb to evaluate political statements by. There are elections coming up near me soon and several candidates like to claim that they will 'support the local community'. Strangely no-one is against that!

Re: India's pro-business Modi storms to historic election win

#55

Post by [deleted] » Fri, May 16, 2014, 3:53 PM UTC

kshatrea wrote: post #16

tokenadult wrote: post #12

Submitted in part because a Hacker News participant recently berated Americans on Hacker News for not being more aware of the election in India. (The person who wrote that comment is an American of Indian heritage, I'm pretty sure.) I was drawn to this article from the Google News news aggregator because it was listed as one of the "in-depth" articles. I was also startled by the title because until now I haven't hear…

Thanks for the clarification - you've very politely reduced my objections to dust.

[deleted]

Re: India's pro-business Modi storms to historic election win

#56

Post by DangerousPie » Fri, May 16, 2014, 3:53 PM UTC

discardorama wrote: post #36

cstross wrote: post #33

Calling Modi "pro-business" seems like a bit of an over-simplication. He's a member of the RSS ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rashtriya_Swayamsevak_Sangh ), which is arguably a violently anti-muslim paramilitary group, as well as leading the BJP ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bharatiya_Janata_Party ). It's not unreasonable to call the BJP centre-right on economic/business issues ... but they have other policies as…

> I'm not Indian and have no connection to the sub-continent. I am, so allow me. 1. The RSS is not "violently anti-muslim", despite what you read on teh internets. They have a Muslim wing, so to speak: http://www.hindustantimes.com/india-news/the-saffron-muslim/... 2. If the "BJP has other policies, which are disturbing", please enlighten us. Just lobbing an attack and walking away doesn't do any good. 3. The US deni…

edit: Right, why am I getting downvoted for this??

What's your response to the Economist article that was posted here [1]? To quote:

"One reason why the inquiries into the riots were inconclusive is that a great deal of evidence was lost or wilfully destroyed. And if the facts in 2002 are murky, so are Mr Modi’s views now. He could put the pogroms behind him by explaining what happened and apologising. Yet he refuses to answer questions about them. In a rare comment last year he said he regretted Muslims’ suffering as he would that of a puppy run over by a car. Amid the uproar, he said he meant only that Hindus care about all life. Muslims—and chauvinist Hindus—heard a different message. Unlike other BJP leaders, Mr Modi has refused to wear a Muslim skullcap and failed to condemn riots in Uttar Pradesh in 2013 when most of the victims were Muslim."

[1] http://www.economist.com/news/leaders/21600106-he-will-proba...

Re: India's pro-business Modi storms to historic election win

#57

Post by shas3 » Fri, May 16, 2014, 3:54 PM UTC

discardorama wrote: post #36

cstross wrote: post #33

Calling Modi "pro-business" seems like a bit of an over-simplication. He's a member of the RSS ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rashtriya_Swayamsevak_Sangh ), which is arguably a violently anti-muslim paramilitary group, as well as leading the BJP ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bharatiya_Janata_Party ). It's not unreasonable to call the BJP centre-right on economic/business issues ... but they have other policies as…

> I'm not Indian and have no connection to the sub-continent. I am, so allow me. 1. The RSS is not "violently anti-muslim", despite what you read on teh internets. They have a Muslim wing, so to speak: http://www.hindustantimes.com/india-news/the-saffron-muslim/... 2. If the "BJP has other policies, which are disturbing", please enlighten us. Just lobbing an attack and walking away doesn't do any good. 3. The US deni…

I think the problem with Modi, like extreme politicians (e.g. Le Pen in France or the Tea Party) in other democracies is that some of his utterances are contradictory to Enlightenment humanist ideals. It remains to be seen if the subset of his views that can be considered to be extreme are just rhetoric or if he intends to act on them. Historically, such politicians resemble the nationalistic polities of pre-1945 Europe and post-colonial South America.

The bright side about India is that its sheer diversity and the existence of regional leaders (who do not belong to Modi's party) serve as checks and balances. As an example, regional parties organized on linguistic and non-traditional ideologies (communists, anarchists, etc.) basis have captured close to 140 seats in the parliament, including clean-sweeps in several States such as Tamil Nadu (population ~70 million), Odisha (population ~40 million), Seemandhra/Telangana (population ~85 million), and West Bengal (population ~90 million).

Re: India's pro-business Modi storms to historic election win

#58

Post by monsterix » Fri, May 16, 2014, 3:55 PM UTC

cscurmudgeon wrote: post #52

monsterix wrote: post #49

I usually do not write comments on politicians, but being an Indian I feel sad that someone like Narendra Modi has even been considered for the post of Prime Minister by my countrymen. Let alone the decision to elect him for the top job. But so it is, he is now the PM, and I accept what democracy and fate has asked me to accept and go with. Having said that I am yet to understand why the following murders by the Godm…

Let us apply a non zero amount of critical thinking and logic. > Narendra Modi and his team of murderers You either have evidence for that statement or you don't. 1. If it is the first, go to the courts, else you will be deemed complicit in the murders. 2. If it is the latter, you are not telling the truth. Which one is it?

You mean go to a Modi controlled court and ask milord Modi "where should I seek justice against the crimes you have been doing?"

I am sure you are smarter than this.

Re: India's pro-business Modi storms to historic election win

#59

Post by visava » Fri, May 16, 2014, 3:58 PM UTC

cstross wrote: post #33

Calling Modi "pro-business" seems like a bit of an over-simplication. He's a member of the RSS ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rashtriya_Swayamsevak_Sangh ), which is arguably a violently anti-muslim paramilitary group, as well as leading the BJP ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bharatiya_Janata_Party ). It's not unreasonable to call the BJP centre-right on economic/business issues ... but they have other policies as…

How many Iraq civilians were killed in Gulf war compared to 2000 in Gujrat riots. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/10/15/iraq-death-toll_n_4... There have been many communal riots in India since 2002 but Gujrat has been peaceful place since 2002.

Re: India's pro-business Modi storms to historic election win

#60

Post by chaofguan » Fri, May 16, 2014, 3:58 PM UTC

cstross wrote: post #33

Calling Modi "pro-business" seems like a bit of an over-simplication. He's a member of the RSS ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rashtriya_Swayamsevak_Sangh ), which is arguably a violently anti-muslim paramilitary group, as well as leading the BJP ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bharatiya_Janata_Party ). It's not unreasonable to call the BJP centre-right on economic/business issues ... but they have other policies as…

If you are outsider please don't form opinions what is stated in media. Indian media is by large same as US media. Outsiders only see what is stated by shills and may not be true. If you think it is over-simplification then what you call US/UK ? Tyranny ? Politics is extremely complex in India than any other country in the world. I guarantee you US and UK will now be in queue to get appointment with him. Also, after all comments posted here I get sense that how narrow people from US / UK are. You may not like him but victory is in your face. So chill and enjoy.