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What do grad students in math do all day?

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Re: What do grad students in math do all day?

#51
post #19

Yes, when as a math grad student I saw some of that, I developed some opinions and ideas to look for more productive approaches. Somewhere I read: "There is a famous recipe for rabbit stew that starts out, 'First catch a rabbit'.", and I changed that to, "There is a recipe for how to do applied mathematics, first get an application.". For more, commonly the main criteria for 'research' is that it be "new, correct, an…

Your argument was raised and given a historical context in an interesting article that was posted here a week ago.

http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5353315

Re: What do grad students in math do all day?

#52
post #41

The blog post certainly illustrates the importance of a good copywriter... "Tool to get rid of dust."

Tool not get rid of all dust, only dust tool can get to.

You're focusing on the specifics too much. This is actually very akin to a startup. How can you convey what you do in a clear and concise sentence without muddying it with details. My point in the original reply is that conveying the idea of a vacuum cleaner even with the harsh restrictions set, can still be done without sounding like a robot or caveman.

Re: What do grad students in math do all day?

#53
post #45
post #19

Yes, when as a math grad student I saw some of that, I developed some opinions and ideas to look for more productive approaches. Somewhere I read: "There is a famous recipe for rabbit stew that starts out, 'First catch a rabbit'.", and I changed that to, "There is a recipe for how to do applied mathematics, first get an application.". For more, commonly the main criteria for 'research' is that it be "new, correct, an…

Computer science isn't something that is becoming increasingly more mathematical, but quite the opposite way: computer science was seen as just another branch of mathematics. Alan Turing didn't quite have physical machines at his disposal to develop a theory of computation on, so he invented an abstract machine. Von Neumann thought that the foundational trouble in mathematics with Gödel meant that pure mathematics wo…

Didn't know the von Neumann story about his influence from poor Kurt.

For 'more mathematical', really should say from when! Right, not from von Neumann!

If pick when carefully, if only from yesterday, then since then the field has become more mathematical! Or pick from the start of Stanford Professor Ng's class on 'machine learning' which seems to borrow a lot from maximum likelihood estimation in statistics and steepest ascent optimization from mathematical programming or operations research. Or, CLRS -- they went to mathematical programming and borrowed linear programming. Once at IBM's Watson lab I saw some guys attacking load leveling via some carefully done work in stochastic optimal control. Design of distributed computer systems has long been one of the better applications of queuing theory. Once I needed to find nearest neighbors in R^n so started by doing essentially binary search on each axis (yes, after that need to do some tree backtracking with some cutting planes). I heard that there was such a thing, k-D trees, and, yup, found it in Sedgewick and later discovered that such work is called 'computational geometry'. And, for my last example (drum roll), finally there is some interest in the computer and network monitoring community in regarding monitoring as some continually applied statistical hypothesis tests, maybe! We will see if KPCB sends a copy of my paper to Endgame!

In the short run, to attack a field with math can be one heck of a publishing opportunity. So in the long run, if only from 'academic competitiveness', a field doesn't have much hope as 'science' but to 'mathematize'.

Re: What do grad students in math do all day?

#54

I read the title wrong and became curious what a grad student in math does all day after they graduate? Is there a lot of work in that field?

In the US, the NSA hires a lot of math folks: https://www.nsa.gov/careers/career_fields/mathematics.shtml

Re: What do grad students in math do all day?

#55
post #19

Yes, when as a math grad student I saw some of that, I developed some opinions and ideas to look for more productive approaches. Somewhere I read: "There is a famous recipe for rabbit stew that starts out, 'First catch a rabbit'.", and I changed that to, "There is a recipe for how to do applied mathematics, first get an application.". For more, commonly the main criteria for 'research' is that it be "new, correct, an…

Your argument was raised and given a historical context in an interesting article that was posted here a week ago. http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5353315

Yes, I saw that and considered commenting but didn't because it seemed that the thread was mostly about bringing the 'revolution' to teaching in K-12. A one word description of the revolution is Bourbaki, and I'm not thrilled about seeing that influence K-12. For the 'revolution' good courses in plane geometry or trigonometry are about as close to the revolution as I would want to see. And for first calculus, I believe that the traditional ways are fine -- lots of water flowing from tanks, lots of solids of rotation, lots of pictures and intuition. An alternative would appear to be to drag compact sets and uniform continuity into first calculus, and I would discourage that. Another alternative would be to dispense with Riemann integration and just teach measure theory -- I'd discourage that also.

For Bourbaki and 'telegraph style' definitions, theorems, and proofs, I see them as crucial ingredients in the soup but not the whole soup.

Re: What do grad students in math do all day?

#56
post #39
post #19

Yes, when as a math grad student I saw some of that, I developed some opinions and ideas to look for more productive approaches. Somewhere I read: "There is a famous recipe for rabbit stew that starts out, 'First catch a rabbit'.", and I changed that to, "There is a recipe for how to do applied mathematics, first get an application.". For more, commonly the main criteria for 'research' is that it be "new, correct, an…

Mathematizing a fields is a bit of a double edged sword though and I think needs a great deal of skepticism and caution. Yes, if you do it right you can get insights and prove things more rigorously. If you do it wrong, the mathematics can easily become divorced from reality: it really does require ongoing skepticism and awareness of the connection between whatever mathematical abstractions you've built and reality.…

I have only one answer for you: Yup!

Re: What do grad students in math do all day?

#58
post #27
post #21

Sounds like what math grad students did 50 years ago, before we solved all the pure math even tenuously related to the 4 dimensional reality we live in.

You are just wrong. For example, algebraic topology is one of the most abstract subjects I hear conversations about week. It has applications in physics, data analysis, and numerical computing. Also, saying that reality is 4-dimensional is hooding yourself. The machine learning techniques we use everywhere depend on the math of higher-dimensional spaces, and they wouldn't work if reality couldn't be meaningfully view…

Machine learning casts a problem into higher dimensions in order to linearize it. Linear problems are easier solve, and can be projected back into the original space. An extra dimension is literally just another variable, which doesn't necessarily have a physical meaning.

Re: What do grad students in math do all day?

#59
post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tool not get rid of all dust, only dust tool can get to.

You're focusing on the specifics too much. This is actually very akin to a startup. How can you convey what you do in a clear and concise sentence without muddying it with details. My point in the original reply is that conveying the idea of a vacuum cleaner even with the harsh restrictions set, can still be done without sounding like a robot or caveman.

There's a very big difference between a tool that gets rid of all dust, and a tool that only gets rid of a small subset of dust.

It may be a specific, but so is the fact that it gets rid of dust...

Today on HN: Math analogy spawns discussion on marketing copy and the properties of vacuum cleaners.

Re: What do grad students in math do all day?

#60
post #23

I prefer the explanation that I developed back when I was a math student: Imagine that all of mathematics is represented as a solid sphere (ball). At the core (origin) of this sphere are the most basic concepts in math, that we all learn in elementary and high school. On top of the core are many layers of knowledge that are all interconnected, but lead in different directions from the origin. These layers have names…

Agreed, but as a slight counterpoint, some research is about stripping away unnecessary middle layers, to find abstractions, a quicker way to the surface in other words. If we didn't do this, research would inevitably stop, unless eternal life lies inside a 100 year radius of the sphere (and we can keep learning and getting smarter forever, which I doubt)

And, some stuff has been forgotten. Even if it used to seem pretty important.

Speaking about spheres, there's lots of stuff about spherical trigonometry that you can find in old books (say, 1880s to 1920s [1]). They used to think it was math, but it has been determined to not be math any more. It's now stuff that "everyone knows".

[1] http://ebooks.library.cornell.edu/cgi/t/text/pageviewer-idx?...

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