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List of European organizations that have banned personal messaging apps at work

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Re: List of European organizations that have banned personal messaging apps at work

#51

Post by sigmoid10 »

nekusar wrote: post #32
JoeBOFH wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As much as I prefer the European way of some items. I think the American way of treating the work computer as a company asset and just locking it down to an insane degree makes way more sense. Especially for areas like finance.

Exactly this. I've been in a lawsuit with Oracle (as engineer, not direct). And their discovery hit EVERYTHING. If I used work devices for personal messages, my personal messages would absolutely been in scope. Or if I used personal devices for work, my personal devices are now in scope. Hell NO! My work laptop is on my personal network. Its also on its own vlan and can only talk to the imternet, and not fellow devic…

That is more of a problem with the insane discovery system in the US than with anything else. If you had worked in Europe, GDPR would have protected your personal data from being sent over, as the Credit Suisse case has shown. They had to scrub all personal data before transferring files to a US counsel.

Re: List of European organizations that have banned personal messaging apps at work

#52

Post by jeroenhd »

throwa356262 wrote: post #28
nottorp wrote: post #20

Of course, the consequence is you end up communicating for work on something like Teams instead of an usable chat app.

Like zoom where you chat disappears when the meeting is closed? Or how about slack, that lives in an alternate reality where outlook calendar can be ignored?

I'm living a glorious Outlook-free life at work. I'm glad that I don't need any of that crap. Maybe Slack is right to push people away from the Microsoft shitware that businesses stick to.

Re: List of European organizations that have banned personal messaging apps at work

#53

Post by wolvoleo »

JoeBOFH wrote: post #41
nekusar wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Exactly this. I've been in a lawsuit with Oracle (as engineer, not direct). And their discovery hit EVERYTHING. If I used work devices for personal messages, my personal messages would absolutely been in scope. Or if I used personal devices for work, my personal devices are now in scope. Hell NO! My work laptop is on my personal network. Its also on its own vlan and can only talk to the imternet, and not fellow devic…

I have my work items on a separate network as well but my motivation is more not trusting some random item being pushed down from corp and having it scan my network or something.

Yeah I'm about to do this too just to be safe.

Some of our antimalware like SentinelOne actually does this by default though we have switched it off for privacy reasons (EU)

Re: List of European organizations that have banned personal messaging apps at work

#54

Post by wolvoleo »

sib wrote: post #22
sigmoid10 wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

GDPR guarantees a right to privacy even on work devices. I think you need to filter out personal messages if compliance requires logging.

Which is actually a good reason for entities subject to GDPR to forbid use of personal messaging apps on work devices... (And to forbid users to use work / official apps for personal messaging.)

That sounds like a simple solution but it is not that simple, employees have a right to use work tools for personal reasons too within reason.

And GDPR explicitly forbids personal items to be released during discovery even to jurisdictions that require that.

Re: List of European organizations that have banned personal messaging apps at work

#55

Post by wolvoleo »

nottorp wrote: post #20

Of course, the consequence is you end up communicating for work on something like Teams instead of an usable chat app.

True, Teams is a horrible tool. I wish we had something better but our company insists on keeping everything within the MS ecosystem.

Re: List of European organizations that have banned personal messaging apps at work

#56

Post by wolvoleo »

blitzar wrote: post #23
weinzierl wrote: post #16

"ban personal messaging apps at work" What does that even mean? I doubt you can forbid the usage of personal messaging apps except in very exceptional cases (like a court room). On the other hand: Using personal messaging apps for work related information is a no-go anyway because of confidentiality agreements basically everyone signs.

Finance - no personal devices in the office and no personal (or unauthorised) messaging apps on your work devices.

I've seen this too in a meta moderation center. They were real sticklers for this. Even personal headphones were not allowed.

I don't think this is legal in EU but for that kind of low-level work they tend to get away with that.

Re: List of European organizations that have banned personal messaging apps at work

#57

Post by tpm »

nekusar wrote: post #32
JoeBOFH wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As much as I prefer the European way of some items. I think the American way of treating the work computer as a company asset and just locking it down to an insane degree makes way more sense. Especially for areas like finance.

Exactly this. I've been in a lawsuit with Oracle (as engineer, not direct). And their discovery hit EVERYTHING. If I used work devices for personal messages, my personal messages would absolutely been in scope. Or if I used personal devices for work, my personal devices are now in scope. Hell NO! My work laptop is on my personal network. Its also on its own vlan and can only talk to the imternet, and not fellow devic…

> Or if I used personal devices for work, my personal devices are now in scope. Hell NO!

In Europe, unless it's a criminal investigation, which this wouldn't be, there is no way a lawsuit would touch your personal devices if you didn't agree (and mostly also nobody would care I think).

Re: List of European organizations that have banned personal messaging apps at work

#58

Post by blitzar »

wolvoleo wrote: post #56
blitzar wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Finance - no personal devices in the office and no personal (or unauthorised) messaging apps on your work devices.

I've seen this too in a meta moderation center. They were real sticklers for this. Even personal headphones were not allowed. I don't think this is legal in EU but for that kind of low-level work they tend to get away with that.

Last thing anyone wants is exfiltration of the content meta moderates ...

I see no EU regulation that would give employees a right to play with their phone on the job.

Re: List of European organizations that have banned personal messaging apps at work

#59

Post by retired »

tsimionescu wrote: post #40
retired wrote: post #3

Meanwhile in Spain I use WhatsApp to contact the municipality, the GP uses it to send my blood results and package delivery drivers ask me to share my location. I hate it.

Would you rather they used Teams? Or what would be a better alternative? Phone / email?

Some secure online portal would be nice for the GP or municipality.

The delivery issues can be solved by introducing a standardized address system for Spain but that would take decades to roll out. Some people I know don’t even have an address, they just use the land registry number. Or just the name of their village + surnames, which is typically good enough for the standard mail (but not good enough for DHL/UPS/DPD packages, their drivers want your location via WhatsApp)

Re: List of European organizations that have banned personal messaging apps at work

#60

Post by retired »

reedciccio wrote: post #8
mschild wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why not delete it? I assume that if you don't have it, they offer some other form of communication with you?

Yes, they do but they require walking to their office and deal with paper or call them during ever shrinking office hours. Take your poison.

Thanks for typing the exact reply I wanted to give! Yes, I’m happy that I can request garbage pickup through WhatsApp instead of having to fill out a form at the municipal building. An online portal or app would be even better than WhatsApp.
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