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EU Commission looking at practical consequences of Anthropic decision

reuters.com

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Re: EU Commission looking at practical consequences of Anthropic decision

#51

Post by inigyou »

miohtama wrote: post #15
IveSeenItAll wrote: post #14

It remains to be seen what the actual consequences of the "Anthropic decision" are. Will it be struck down by the courts? Does it matter anyway? (And, from my POV, the answer to that is "No" -- Opus 4.whatever did several fine jobs for me this weekend, and I've yet to be convinced of Fable/Mythos/Whatever superiority). Does "Europe" need a leading-edge model? Yeah, most likely, but chasing the "SpaceX-buys-all-the-Nv…

Software development productivity can go up 10x for some industries and tasks with SOTA model. If the EU cannot access such model it means the EU cannot produce software at competitive prices. Software is eating the world and if the EU is not in the software business, it has no stakes in the future.

There is no evidence these models substantially increase productivity.

That's a strong statement, isn't it? But so far it seems true. They lower barrier to entry but they don't enable experts to get more things done better. Studies like the METR report show they make experts less productive but with the feeling of being more productive.

Re: EU Commission looking at practical consequences of Anthropic decision

#52

Post by vb-8448 »

sajithdilshan wrote: post #31

This is a wake up call for EU, but it’s already too late IMO. ChatGPT was launched in 2022 and since then only company in EU which has released a model that is even closer to a frontiers is Mistral. With strong data protection, copyright and privacy laws, it would be a nightmare for any company to train models because activists lawyers would sue left and right. Even by some miracle they come up with the model, again…

> It would take years to build a European equivalent of AWS and not to mention the talent required to do that.

It will never happen because it's a political decision!

European politicians and bureaucrats, at any level, are idiots(in the best case scenario) or corrupted(in the worst one). Cloud computing is a thing since at least 10 years, and we still don't have a single fucking hyperscaler despite having everything already in place: Ovh, Hertzner + several other big cloud providers in all major countries, but instead of acting as a unique actor ...

Re: EU Commission looking at practical consequences of Anthropic decision

#53

Post by sajithdilshan »

monssooon wrote: post #48

Hopefully it will prompt more EU investment into ai and hopefully EU will have something good in the future. EU will maybe never be like the US and maybe the US will be stronger and richer than the EU... But us EU people have nice weather and lots of good things like small cars and bike lanes and soccer teams and socker teams and suckerteams and lots and lots of windmills and sea windmills small tiny farms that are s…

Don’t forget Deutsche Bahn, and the best railway system in whole world

Re: EU Commission looking at practical consequences of Anthropic decision

#54

Post by willtemperley »

inigyou wrote: post #47
willtemperley wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I choose to follow the law, but it’s an obligation not a decision. Framing it like this just misses the big picture entirely. A few words from a tech CEO is all it takes for this government to take extreme measures like this.

Viewing it as an obligation means you are weak. There are consequences to disobeying the law - a successful person will view them through the lens of cost-benefit analysis, not of dogma.

Good luck with that. I hope you’re successful in your law breaking endeavours with your highly informed cost benefit analyses.

Re: EU Commission looking at practical consequences of Anthropic decision

#55

Post by includenotfound »

rippeltippel wrote: post #33
this_user wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That would imply that the EU has the ability to build its own, competitive AI ecosystem. At the moment, it's mostly just Mistral, and they have been way behind SOTA for a while now. You can't just legislate this into existence, you also need the money and talent to do it, not to mention the hardware.

Hopefully, EU-based Yann LeCunn's AMI Labs will develop foundational world models at some point. As I see it, the main problem in EU is not lack of talent: it's lack of investments. Mistral itself recently secured 4B, which is 50 times less than what it could have made in the US.

Investing in the EU is like burning cash. Excessive regulation, high costs and taxes (especially of human labor), and investors get punished for creating and growing companies.

Even if you overcome all of this and become successful, you'll get chased by politicians for having too much money (which is not allowed in the EU).

And even if you don't, today, it will be tomorrow.

Easier to just take a long haul flight to your favorite US coast and do it there.

Re: EU Commission looking at practical consequences of Anthropic decision

#56

Post by alecco »

The White House has Sachs and Krishnan and the CCP is full of engineers. In contrast, the EU Commission:

- Commissioner for Digital and Frontier: Henna Virkkunen (JOURNALIST, experience PR) [1]

- Executive Vice-President for Prosperity and Industrial Strategy: Stéphane Séjourné (LAWYER, politics, but hey, his mom was a telephone switch operator!) [2]

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Henna_Virkkunen

[2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/St%C3%A9phane_S%C3%A9journ%C3%...

inb4 Sacks is MD/lawyer... but he is a Stanford econ graduate, was PayPal COO, is tech VC, etc.

Re: EU Commission looking at practical consequences of Anthropic decision

#57

Post by includenotfound »

krzys wrote: post #32
dgellow wrote: post #5

Please, for once, react in a meaningful way. No "we are concerned and will consider strongly monitoring".

I'm seeing this downvoted, but it's - unfortunately - painfully true! European politicians are only ever judged by what they say, not what they do, so there's no incentive beyond the empty words. As a result, this is all they do: they express a populist opinion and jump to the next hot topic, with no actual work put into solving any of the issues.

European politicians are subject to US's (and thus Trump's) orders.

The "strong and deep statements" they release are cheap theater.

The US is defending Europe through NATO. Until that changes, the EU will continue to be the US's slave.

Re: EU Commission looking at practical consequences of Anthropic decision

#58

Post by root-parent »

fvdessen wrote: post #43
sajithdilshan wrote: post #31

This is a wake up call for EU, but it’s already too late IMO. ChatGPT was launched in 2022 and since then only company in EU which has released a model that is even closer to a frontiers is Mistral. With strong data protection, copyright and privacy laws, it would be a nightmare for any company to train models because activists lawyers would sue left and right. Even by some miracle they come up with the model, again…

These stories about regulation preventing EU frontier models are frankly complete bullshit. The real reason is much simpler, but also harder to fix. To build frontier models you need VC money. There’s no VC money because VC believe that there is no market for a ‘EU Champion’. There’s no market for a EU champion because internal EU market is not big enough for VC returns. Why invest in EU champion when the US champion…

In most EU countries if your company went bankrupt, you are not allowed to open another one. Think about that for a little bit.

The Southern Countries are parasitically living from EU funds and EU programs, including money transfer for the budgets. The rich countries are desperately seeing China eating their lunch in Cars and all the rest.

Add to this the aging population, and now having the head under the sand on AI, and it does not look pretty...

Re: EU Commission looking at practical consequences of Anthropic decision

#59

Post by alecco »

sajithdilshan wrote: post #31

This is a wake up call for EU, but it’s already too late IMO. ChatGPT was launched in 2022 and since then only company in EU which has released a model that is even closer to a frontiers is Mistral. With strong data protection, copyright and privacy laws, it would be a nightmare for any company to train models because activists lawyers would sue left and right. Even by some miracle they come up with the model, again…

You forgot no energy and deep resentment for anybody earning more than 85k/y (except politicians).

Worst part is Europe was near the top of nuclear and microchips ~30 years ago, and France had bleeding-edge AI.

Re: EU Commission looking at practical consequences of Anthropic decision

#60

Post by alecco »

libertine wrote: post #18
alecco wrote: post #3

I don't envy the interns whose job is to explain things to the EU leadership.

Which internships are better? Explaining things to the US leadership? Or to the Chinese leadership?

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=48529685
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