Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

BritRuby cancelled due to a lack of racial and gender diversity

venturebeat.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

51–60 of 79 posts

Re: BritRuby cancelled due to a lack of racial and gender diversity

#51

Post by hugh4life »

rmc wrote: post #14
obstacle1 wrote: post #12

Out of curiosity, why are the complainers in this case not being called out for their own racism/discrimination? The fact that a panel consists of white males, straight males, or purple elephants is not in itself evidence of discrimination. It is entirely possible that these were the most qualified of all applicants to have submitted to this conference. Without knowing the details of the applicant pool, anyone scream…

There are several definitions of racism, one is essentially "making references to someone's race and implying everyone in that group is the same (in some attribute)", or more simply "anything based on race". Lots of people like this definition because it's a nice, simple and objective defintion and it means black people in the UK can be racist to white people, or that affirmative action is racist. I think this is the…

"So no, complaining about the lack of non-white people is not racist."

Implying that all white people are the same and that there is no internal diversity within white people is racist.

Re: BritRuby cancelled due to a lack of racial and gender diversity

#52

Post by aes256 »

mseebach2 wrote: post #50
aes256 wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Anti-discrimination" is part of political correctness. The example you provide falls under both categories, and it falls under political correctness precisely because it would be discriminatory to celebrate one religious festival without celebrating all of them. It is not politically "correct" to partake in discrimination. I don't know if you're from the UK, but society today is highly secular. A British Humanist As…

I meant anti-discrimination as the law that keeps the GP from being fired for admitting he's gay. As for the number of Brits being religious, I think it's easy to conclude that more than 35% of Brits celebrate Christmas. Given the origin of the poll, I would not be surprised if the question was phrased very narrowly. It's not discriminatory to celebrate Christmas by default if your company is in a culture that predom…

The question was "Are you religious?", and 65% answered negatively. You can't really frame something as fundamental as that.

I personally think the 35% figure is inflated by people who identify with Christianity but don't practice it, or people who do practice it but out of fear more than faith.

Britain is no longer a Christian country, and that's not a bad thing. Give it another two generations and Christians will be a small minority (5-10%)

> It's not discriminatory to celebrate Christmas by default if your company is in a culture that predominantly observe Christmas. It would be discriminatory to make special arrangement for time off on Christmas, but not accommodating seasonal holiday requests from Muslims on Eid and Hindus on Diwali.

You can't justify discriminatory actions by deferring to the culture in which they take place. Suppose we replace religion with race. Christmas is now a racial festival celebrating white culture. Is it appropriate to foist these celebrations on black people in the office? Of course not.

Does the fact the company operates in a predominantly white culture justify the practice? Of course not.

Re: BritRuby cancelled due to a lack of racial and gender diversity

#53

Post by [deleted] »

objclxt wrote: post #19
coolestuk wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This shambles could only happen in Britain. Senior politicians get accused of being paedophiles by journalists with no evidence. Politicians routinely steal from public coffers, and don't even lose their place in Parliament (even though some were sent to prison). The country is awash with video surveillance, yet trying to get the police to respond to a crime report is like swimming upstream. A christian preacher who…

I disagree: it could have happened in many Western countries. The problem with a 'it's political correctness gone mad!' argument is it ignores the context in which those laws were enacted. Racism and sexism were systematic and endemic in the UK during much of the 20th century. You say that "political correctness had taken hold in local government by the early 1980s", but you don't mention that the reason for this was…

[deleted]

Re: BritRuby cancelled due to a lack of racial and gender diversity

#54

Post by qwerta »

coolestuk wrote: post #8
thedudemabry wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is definitely an interesting development. While I'm saddened to see a Ruby conference canceled with a full roster of qualified speakers, I'm happier to see the pendulum on this side of perfect balance than the alternative. This problem has clearer and more positive strategies than its opposite. Edit: Whoa. I did more than 10 seconds of research and this situation is more fucked than I snap-judged. My heart goes…

This shambles could only happen in Britain. Senior politicians get accused of being paedophiles by journalists with no evidence. Politicians routinely steal from public coffers, and don't even lose their place in Parliament (even though some were sent to prison). The country is awash with video surveillance, yet trying to get the police to respond to a crime report is like swimming upstream. A christian preacher who…

> Practically every interaction with them requires you to tell them your

I find it _VERY_ disturbing that government is even asking for such information. Political clime is changing quickly and such catalogs may end easily in wrong hands.

Holocaust was enabled just because of such lists. Birth Records was first thing nazis were after when they invaded new space. Without them they would not recognize Polish, Russian from Jews. For example Kafka: he had Czech name, most of his friends were Germans, was Jewish and spoke fluently all local languages.

I dont care about assurances, they may be void tomorrow. Collecting such information is simply completely unacceptable. Even Russia is more liberal in this.

Re: BritRuby cancelled due to a lack of racial and gender diversity

#55

Post by [deleted] »

mseebach2 wrote: post #30
rmc wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Political Correctness is great if you are a minority. It means you have similar rights to the powerful group. As a gay man, I know I can mention the gender of my spouse (male!) in a workplace environment without being worried about being fired (for example). Straight people have always (more or less) been able to mention their spouse in the workplace without fear of repercussion. Now I can too! Political Correctness…

That's not political correctness, that's anti-discrimination. Political correctness is "Seasons Greetings" instead of "Merry Christmas" for fear of offending non-Christians. It's idiotic because for those not celebrating Christmas, indeed those that might be offended by mentions of Christmas, there is no season to celebrate. Don't send them a card . "Seasons greetings" is not "culture neutral", it's a code for Christ…

[deleted]

Re: BritRuby cancelled due to a lack of racial and gender diversity

#56

Post by mkr-hn »

josteink wrote: post #49

Minority/Majority are only terms which makes sense in a specific context. This context can be gender, can be race, can be nationality, age, experience, school of thought, sexual orientation, preference in food, preference in code-editor etc. If you find yourself in a "minority", it's because you have chosen to identify yourself with something which puts you on the outside. People calling for discrimination in cases l…

Do you get dizzy screaming at the ants from atop your pedestal?

Re: BritRuby cancelled due to a lack of racial and gender diversity

#57

Post by rmc »

hugh4life wrote: post #51
rmc wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are several definitions of racism, one is essentially "making references to someone's race and implying everyone in that group is the same (in some attribute)", or more simply "anything based on race". Lots of people like this definition because it's a nice, simple and objective defintion and it means black people in the UK can be racist to white people, or that affirmative action is racist. I think this is the…

"So no, complaining about the lack of non-white people is not racist." Implying that all white people are the same and that there is no internal diversity within white people is racist.

No-one suggested that.

Re: BritRuby cancelled due to a lack of racial and gender diversity

#58

Post by rmc »

josteink wrote: post #49

Minority/Majority are only terms which makes sense in a specific context. This context can be gender, can be race, can be nationality, age, experience, school of thought, sexual orientation, preference in food, preference in code-editor etc. If you find yourself in a "minority", it's because you have chosen to identify yourself with something which puts you on the outside. People calling for discrimination in cases l…

You're not living under South African apartheid rule. You are not being oppressed.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LGBT_rights_by_country

Re: BritRuby cancelled due to a lack of racial and gender diversity

#60

Post by mantas »

rmc wrote: post #36
mseebach2 wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's not political correctness, that's anti-discrimination. Political correctness is "Seasons Greetings" instead of "Merry Christmas" for fear of offending non-Christians. It's idiotic because for those not celebrating Christmas, indeed those that might be offended by mentions of Christmas, there is no season to celebrate. Don't send them a card . "Seasons greetings" is not "culture neutral", it's a code for Christ…

This can become a no true scotsman argument. What's the difference between political correctness and anti-discrimination? Is saying "spouse" or "partner" (instead of "wife") to a man you know is married politically correct or anti-discrimination? Mostly PC is not about avoiding "offence", but about ensuring under-represented minority is not felt left out purely for being in that group. Despite what right wing tabloid…

Why should I be aware of everybody's likes and dislikes? I'm just living my own life and that's it.

Are we going to call meat "animal-sourced food" next? Just to let vegetarians know we're aware of them...

Post reply on HN