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The disturbing white paper Red Hat is trying to erase from the internet

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Re: The disturbing white paper Red Hat is trying to erase from the internet

#51

Post by bpavuk »

mmh0000 wrote: post #49
eqvinox wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's also a chasm of (non-)accountability. You or your subordinates target an elementary school: that's a war crime. Your "battlefield AI" targets an elementary school: software bug, it happens, can't be helped.

"War Crimes" only apply to the loser of the war and are prosecuted by the victor. Meaning whatever horrors are done on either side, only the horrors committed by the loser will be "crimes". The inclusion of AI doesn't change that.

sadly that's also true within Ukraine. like, I know that Russians are handling Ukrainian prisoners of war very brutally (no sources, why: [0]) but, if not for [0] AND if I wouldn't be killed by my co-citizens for that, I would point out a good chunk of misconduct on Ukrainian side as well.

I also recall the history lessons. I can't remember anyone who committed a war crime against Nazi Germany that also was internationally prosecuted. yep, the West did prosecute domestically, and there were some loud cases with German POWs, but I can't recall any, any Soviet soldier being charged for e.g. rape.

[0]: there is nothing public to link to that remained up, and I'm long out from private Telegram channels where such videos are posted; plus, even if I could, you and mods wouldn't want to see the video of someone getting beheaded

Re: The disturbing white paper Red Hat is trying to erase from the internet

#52

Post by vzqx »

As someone who works for the DoD, the so called "disturbing" language in the paper is very commonplace in this industry. Idk if or why Red Hat is trying to redact the paper, but I'm sure it's not because they're embarrassed their software is killing people. That's par for the course for defense contractors.

Re: The disturbing white paper Red Hat is trying to erase from the internet

#53

Post by nailer »

Qem wrote: post #5
nickdothutton wrote: post #3

Better to have smart bombs than dumb ones. Or rather, better to have 1 smart bomb than 1000 dumb ones spread across an entire city in order to pick off the particular building, vehicle, or person you want.

Specially AI Hallucination bombs, that hit a park named "Police Park", because it thinks it's killing policemen[1], or a children school with Shahed in the name[2], because it thinks It has something to do with drones. [1] https://x.com/MarioNawfal/status/2029575052535173364 [2] https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2026/3/6/elementary-school-in...

There are no mainstream sources about the police park story when I looked. I’m pretty sure it’s a hoax.

Re: The disturbing white paper Red Hat is trying to erase from the internet

#54

Post by tjwebbnorfolk »

tastyface wrote: post #42
tjwebbnorfolk wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> and the world is controlled by the people who can do that better than others Yes, welcome to Earth. There's absolutely no morality in deciding to be weaker than you have to be. If you are eaten by a predator when you had the option not to be eaten, you're not some high-minded righteous peace-lover, you're simply dead.

This directly contradicts most religions, which the people with the biggest weapons somehow claim to follow.

I must be missing your point. You're talking about a thought / belief framework. I'm talking about how the world actually works. In any fight between theory and practice, practice always wins.

Re: The disturbing white paper Red Hat is trying to erase from the internet

#55

Post by greazy »

mmh0000 wrote: post #47

It's weird to me that this is "suddenly" an issue. It has been known for decades that Red Hat Inc's largest customer is the U.S. Army[1]. It's a very large part of the reason why Red Hat took over development of SELinux and made it on by default in their distros. And the Army isn't exactly known for handing out cupcakes... [1] https://unixdigest.com/includes/files/Army-RedHat-Whitepaper... [1] "Red Hat’s partnership…

Optics. One can argue that Red Hat was working with DoD on just security. But after this white paper on how to better kill people, that facade has fallen over.

Before it was a maybe, now it's certainty.

Ambiguity is quiet comforting.

Re: The disturbing white paper Red Hat is trying to erase from the internet

#56

Post by Gibbon1 »

DonHopkins wrote: post #13
nickdothutton wrote: post #3

Better to have smart bombs than dumb ones. Or rather, better to have 1 smart bomb than 1000 dumb ones spread across an entire city in order to pick off the particular building, vehicle, or person you want.

Smart bombs are no good if they are directed by a dumb AI targeting system, a dumb alcoholic accelerationist religious fanatic Secretary of War, or a dumb narcissistic genocidal pedophile President.

I had a thought about that. Using weapons that don't give the opponent an opportunity to surrender feels like a war crime.

Re: The disturbing white paper Red Hat is trying to erase from the internet

#57

Post by neilv »

This post looks artificially buried on page 3 now, and the topic is one of the most important things that tech company workers should be thinking about right now.

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  76. The disturbing white paper Red Hat is trying to erase from the internet (osnews.com)
  153 points by choult 6 hours ago | flag | hide | 51 comments

  77. Code is run more than read (2023) (olano.dev)
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Re: The disturbing white paper Red Hat is trying to erase from the internet

#58

Post by creatonez »

frumplestlatz wrote: post #36

> With things like the genocide in Gaza ... Population: ~2,050,000 Density: 15,455.8/sq mi Words have meaning, and their emotional force derives from that meaning. The knowing misuse of a term like “genocide” for its emotional force is manipulative sophistry.

Nice genocide denial you got there.

The Gaza Genocide is a verified fact. It has been recognized by a United Nations special committee and a commission of inquiry, the International Association of Genocide Scholars, Amnesty International, Doctors Without Borders, B'Tselem, Physicians for Human Rights–Israel, International Federation for Human Rights, and almost all genocide scholars.

What has happened? Mass killings, deliberate starvation, prevention of births, blockading, destroying healthcare facilities and killing healthcare and aid workers, blocking medical evacuations, systematically killing journalists, destroying civilian infrastructure, intentionally causing mass displacement, mass torture and death camps, the use of crying drones to inflict psychological anguish, the use of mass surveillance that far exceeds what any other population experiences, tracking militants to their home to intentionally bomb their entire family, sexual violence, destruction of agriculture, ecocide, and the intentional destruction of educational, religious, and cultural sites. It's likely that more than 150,000 people have been killed by the IDF in Gaza. All of it has been confirmed countless times, and the perpetrators have admitted to it countless times.

Re: The disturbing white paper Red Hat is trying to erase from the internet

#59

Post by floralhangnail »

Qem wrote: post #5
nickdothutton wrote: post #3

Better to have smart bombs than dumb ones. Or rather, better to have 1 smart bomb than 1000 dumb ones spread across an entire city in order to pick off the particular building, vehicle, or person you want.

Specially AI Hallucination bombs, that hit a park named "Police Park", because it thinks it's killing policemen[1], or a children school with Shahed in the name[2], because it thinks It has something to do with drones. [1] https://x.com/MarioNawfal/status/2029575052535173364 [2] https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2026/3/6/elementary-school-in...

What's the running rumor right now of which AI was involved? I heard Claude awhile back, but this makes me wonder how much Redhat could have been involved?

Re: The disturbing white paper Red Hat is trying to erase from the internet

#60

Post by Sabinus »

tastyface wrote: post #41
RickJWagner wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Former Red Hatter here. People who use terms like ‘fascist regime’ don’t get consideration. That’s like someone on the other side referring to ‘unprincipled savages’. Name calling just doesn’t win. Maybe it makes the name caller feel better, but it loses the audience.

[flagged]

Indeed. Despite their many glaring flaws neither the Israeli nor American governments are fascist so the former Redhatter is right in that you should discount the associated opinion when encountering that phrase.
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