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CERN uses ultra-compact AI models on FPGAs for real-time LHC data filtering

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Re: CERN uses ultra-compact AI models on FPGAs for real-time LHC data filtering

#51

Post by progval »

SiempreViernes wrote: post #18
100721 wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Huh? The first paragraph literally says they are using LLMs > [ GENEVA, SWITZERLAND — March 28, 2026 ] — CERN is using extremely small, custom large language models physically burned into silicon chips to perform real-time filtering of the enormous data generated by the Large Hadron Collider (LHC).

the site might have fixed it, to me it says "artificial intelligence" instead of LLM, still bad but not" steaming pile of poo on you bank statement" bad

They changed it from AI to LLM then back to AI: https://theopenreader.org/index.php?title=Journalism:CERN_Us... and https://theopenreader.org/index.php?title=Journalism%3ACERN_...

Re: CERN uses ultra-compact AI models on FPGAs for real-time LHC data filtering

#52

Post by progval »

dmd wrote: post #31
100721 wrote: post #5

Does anyone know why they are using language models instead of a more purpose-built statistical model? My intuition is that a language model would either be overfit, or its training data would have a lot of noise unrelated to the application and significantly drive up costs.

… they’re not? Who said they are? The article even explicitly says they’re not?

For 40 minutes, the article claimed they used LLMs. They changed the wording twice: https://theopenreader.org/index.php?title=Journalism:CERN_Us... and https://theopenreader.org/index.php?title=Journalism%3ACERN_...

Re: CERN uses ultra-compact AI models on FPGAs for real-time LHC data filtering

#53

Post by zingar »

LiamPowell wrote: post #44
phire wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm sure I've seen basic hill climbing (and other optimisation algorithms) described as AI, and then used evidence of AI solving real-world science/engineering problems.

Historically this was very much in the field of AI, which is such a massive field that saying something uses AI is about as useful as saying it uses mathematics. Since the term was first coined it's been constantly misused to refer to much more specific things. From around when the term was first coined: "artificial intelligence research is concerned with constructing machines (usually programs for general-purpose co…

That definition moves the goalposts almost by definition, people only stopped thinking that chess demonstrated intelligence when computers started doing it.

Re: CERN uses ultra-compact AI models on FPGAs for real-time LHC data filtering

#54

Post by IshKebab »

amelius wrote: post #46

When is the price of fabbing silicon coming down, so every SMB can do it?

My guess would be never. The closest you can get is "multi project wafers" where you get bundled with a load of other projects. As I understand it they're on the order of $100k which is cheap, but if you actually want to design and verify a chip you're looking at at least several million in salaries and software costs. Probably more like $10m, especially if you're paying US salaries. And of course that would be for a low performance design.

I think a better question would be "when are FPGAs going to stop being so ridiculously overpriced". That feels more possible to me (but still unlikely).

Re: CERN uses ultra-compact AI models on FPGAs for real-time LHC data filtering

#55

Post by [deleted] »

100721 wrote: post #6
sh3rl0ck wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's no mention of SLMs or LLMs, though. > This work represents a compelling real-world demonstration of “tiny AI” — highly specialised, minimal-footprint neural networks FPGAs for Neural Networks have been s thing since before the LLM era.

Huh? The first paragraph literally says they are using LLMs > [ GENEVA, SWITZERLAND — March 28, 2026 ] — CERN is using extremely small, custom large language models physically burned into silicon chips to perform real-time filtering of the enormous data generated by the Large Hadron Collider (LHC).

[deleted]

Re: CERN uses ultra-compact AI models on FPGAs for real-time LHC data filtering

#56

Post by blitzar »

dcanelhas wrote: post #32
intoXbox wrote: post #26

They used a custom neural net with autoencoders, which contain convolutional layers. They trained it on previous experiment data. https://arxiv.org/html/2411.19506v1 Why is it so hard to elaborate what AI algorithm / technique they integrate? Would have made this article much better

I'm half expecting to see "AI model" appearing as stand-in for "linear regression" at this point in the cycle.

I'm half expecting to see "AI model" appearing as stand-in for "if > 0" at this point in the cycle.

Re: CERN uses ultra-compact AI models on FPGAs for real-time LHC data filtering

#57

Post by Eufrat »

zingar wrote: post #53
LiamPowell wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Historically this was very much in the field of AI, which is such a massive field that saying something uses AI is about as useful as saying it uses mathematics. Since the term was first coined it's been constantly misused to refer to much more specific things. From around when the term was first coined: "artificial intelligence research is concerned with constructing machines (usually programs for general-purpose co…

That definition moves the goalposts almost by definition, people only stopped thinking that chess demonstrated intelligence when computers started doing it.

The term artificial intelligence has always been just a buzzword designed to sell whatever it needed to. IMHO, it has no meaningful value outside of a good marketing term. John McCarthy is usually the person who is given credit for coming up with the name and he has admitted in interviews that it was just to get eyeballs for funding.

Re: CERN uses ultra-compact AI models on FPGAs for real-time LHC data filtering

#58

Post by etrautmann »

intoXbox wrote: post #26

They used a custom neural net with autoencoders, which contain convolutional layers. They trained it on previous experiment data. https://arxiv.org/html/2411.19506v1 Why is it so hard to elaborate what AI algorithm / technique they integrate? Would have made this article much better

It seems like most of the implementation is FPGA, which I wouldn’t call “physically burned into silicon.” That’s quite a stretch of language

Re: CERN uses ultra-compact AI models on FPGAs for real-time LHC data filtering

#59

Post by yread »

dcanelhas wrote: post #32
intoXbox wrote: post #26

They used a custom neural net with autoencoders, which contain convolutional layers. They trained it on previous experiment data. https://arxiv.org/html/2411.19506v1 Why is it so hard to elaborate what AI algorithm / technique they integrate? Would have made this article much better

I'm half expecting to see "AI model" appearing as stand-in for "linear regression" at this point in the cycle.

And why not, when linear regression works, it works so well it's basically magic, better than intelligence, artificial or otherwise

Re: CERN uses ultra-compact AI models on FPGAs for real-time LHC data filtering

#60

Post by armcat »

Not on the same extreme level, but I know that some coffee machines use a tiny CNN based model locally/embedded. There is a small super cheap camera integrated in the coffee machine, and the model does three things: (1) classifies the container type in order to select type of coffee, (2) image segmentation - to determine where the cup/hole is placed, (3) regression - to determine the volume and regulate how much coffee to pour.
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