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An update on Steam / GOG changes for OpenTTD

openttd.org

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Re: An update on Steam / GOG changes for OpenTTD

#51
post #21

Now with AI I wonder if it’s possible to just let agents build a perfect emulation of the game. It reminds me of fuzzers. You let the agent go loose on the game and it brute forces every possible state. Then recreates the code. It’s very inefficient- but it probably works.

So https://malus.sh/

Good luck with all that

Re: An update on Steam / GOG changes for OpenTTD

#52
post #30
post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Note that, while it is a rewrite, it was done so through disassembling the original game, not via a clean room implementation. I find this particularly relevant given that the original was written (mostly) in assembly too.

Also even if it is a ground up rewrite, the look and feel still matters. Try creating a 1:1 dupe of a Hermes bag or a Rolex and see how their legal team reacts (even if you call it an OpenBirk)

[flagged]

Re: An update on Steam / GOG changes for OpenTTD

#53
post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> limited by no "platforms" but only by their own lack of desire. Or Google's low ranking of their content

I don't even. Relying on third-party ranking of whatever is a clear indicator of lack of effort.

Short of developing psychic abilities, how would you then address the discoverability problem without relying on a third party?

Forums, search engines, social media, and link aggregators are all third parties with their own ranking. Nobody outside of a handful of small-web hobbyists have put a "cool links" section into a website since 1997.

Re: An update on Steam / GOG changes for OpenTTD

#54

This is beyond reasonable. You can still download it for free outside of Steam. If I make a Sonic fan game and Sega is like, you can keep it online, but just not on Steam, that’s nice. In this situation you still have the option of playing it on Steam for a modest price The alternative is the Nintendo route…

Fully agree, and glad you posted this. Atari has no responsibility to the open source community, and indeed has every reason to push back against this effort. That they're willing to discuss things at all, and that they agree to help support the effort, is frankly astonishing and extremely kind-hearted.

Re: An update on Steam / GOG changes for OpenTTD

#55
post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What copyright? OpenTTD doesn't copy any code or assets from the original game. It is a ground-up rewrite. There is no copyright violation.

Reproducing someone’s intellectual property and publishing it is exactly what constitutes a copyright violation. You can retype someone’s book with your keyboard, it’s still not yours.

Learn something new, dear GenZers:

https://osgameclones.com/

Maybe you all realize how much brainwashed from corporations yall actually are.

Re: An update on Steam / GOG changes for OpenTTD

#56
post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Open internet is dead only to those that don't take the effort to discover. Otherwise it's still as open as it always was. Since there was an internet to speak of, there always were and still are vast amounts of people unaware of stuff that exists, limited by no "platforms" but only by their own lack of desire.

That is true to some extent. However, let me ask you one simple question: how would you try to search for something if you are not aware of it's existence? In other words, how people that are not aware of existence of open-source projects (such as OpenTTD) are supposed to discover them if they're not searching for them on purpose (which is impossible given that they have no clue about their existence)? Of course ther…

> In other words, how people that are not aware of existence of open-source projects (such as OpenTTD) are supposed to discover them if they're not searching for them on purpose (which is impossible given that they have no clue about their existence)?

This question tickles me. In the before time, something would be so good you were compelled to tell someone about it.

Sriracha, Costco are brands you likely know that dont advertise, and somehow got popular. In the 90's there were bands that were massively popular with little to no air play, and less promotion (Fugazi is a great example).

Re: An update on Steam / GOG changes for OpenTTD

#57
post #26
post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What copyright? OpenTTD doesn't copy any code or assets from the original game. It is a ground-up rewrite. There is no copyright violation.

There's two issues: 1. OpenTTD is not a clean room rewrite. It started by disassembling the original game and manually converting to C++ on a piecemeal basis. 2. As the game was updated, sure lots of this code has been rewritten. Almost certainly the majority. But has all of it been legally rewritten? Ehh... much less clear. This sort of process has generally been held to produce a derived work of whatever you're clo…

Correct me if I'm wrong but wasn't BSD in a similar legal limbo for a while? In that case wouldn't there be precedent for such projects to be legally fine so long as they've existed long enough and been heavily modified?

Re: An update on Steam / GOG changes for OpenTTD

#58

As a sidenote, this whole situation implies just how important platforms are. Nothing about OpenTTD has changed. You can literally just go download it off their website for free - same as it was 20 years ago. And you can add it to your Steam library just fine. It's only been on the Steam store for 5 of those years. But the open internet is dead now and just being "de-merchandised" from a platform feels like being rel…

I don't remember how I first heard about slashdot, but I know I discovered debian and enlightenment through it, and I would assume I discovered openttd through it.

Perhaps some comment on a forum or usenet somwhere. Or perhaps on a compuserve group. Or maybe someone else at school.

Re: An update on Steam / GOG changes for OpenTTD

#59
post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't even. Relying on third-party ranking of whatever is a clear indicator of lack of effort.

Short of developing psychic abilities, how would you then address the discoverability problem without relying on a third party? Forums, search engines, social media, and link aggregators are all third parties with their own ranking. Nobody outside of a handful of small-web hobbyists have put a "cool links" section into a website since 1997.

There’s always a relationship aspect in discoverability. Unless the set is small, there will always be intermediary nodes in that graph that will connect consumers and producers. But there’s no need for it to be a mega tech company. Radio DJs help with discovering musics. Books club can help with recommending books.

Re: An update on Steam / GOG changes for OpenTTD

#60
post #8

Atari is releasing an inferior product and needs the superior community one delisted. The remaster cannot compete, simple as.

it is neither being delisted, nor was it requested to be. As far as rights holders exercising their rights, this is about the most collaborative way it could have gone. Not every rights holder is a John Carmack.
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