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EU countries must implement right to repair laws within two years

consilium.europa.eu

51–60 of 120 posts

Re: EU countries must implement right to repair laws within two years

#51
post #28

As far as I can tell, this directive mainly mandates that producers offer to repair certain categories of products, for a price or for free and that independent professional repair shops/services can access tools, parts and information needed to do so. > Producers shall ensure that >independent [professional] repairers (From Art. 5) Unless I'm missing something, there is nothing here granting the right or feasibility…

You have the right to repair what you own. This is aimed at preventing companies from preventing you from doing so. Parts are already available in many cases and no-one prevents you from sourcing them. But in reality most people don't do that and don't want to do that. Either they call a repairman or they buy a new appliance, and this law won't change any of that.

> You have the right to repair what you own.

Based on what? Specifically, it's not listed in Article 17 of the Charter of Fundamental Rights [0]

> This is aimed at preventing companies from preventing you from doing so.

This is aimed at preventing companies from preventing professional repair services from doing so.

[0] https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/TXT/HTML/?uri=CEL...

Re: EU countries must implement right to repair laws within two years

#52
post #21

It’s another nail in the coffin of consumer hardware startups. In addition to CE and waste issues now comes a requirement for repairability. Only the big guys with departments of clerks can launch a product nowadays.

But repairing things can be a way to learn to build them, and usually happens closer to the end consumer, so I think if there is any burden imposed by this that could delay things, this other part is more than enough to compensate.

Re: EU countries must implement right to repair laws within two years

#53
post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Framework laptop seems to be a counter example to your theory, the company seems to be just under 50 people which isn't all that big even for a startup, and repairability is one of their main selling points.

May I ask you what this company has to do with EU? If you could open the website you would find this information: Company: Framework Computer Inc Headquarters Address: 447 Sutter St, PMB 135, San Francisco, CA, 94108-4618, United States

If they want to sell their products in the EU it doesn't matter where they are based. And Framework is in a very good position to do so since they designed their products with repairability in mind from the start, and all that without a "big department of clerks".

Re: EU countries must implement right to repair laws within two years

#54
post #29

Holy shit anyone else notice the "accept cookies" options on this page, where "Accept" is a tiny checkmark and "Reject" is a large text button?

This is what it looks like for me: https://imgur.com/2eFW3Ef Two big clearly labeled buttons.

It's gigantic for me, even: https://i.ibb.co/QMZdXTb/www-consilium-europa-eu-en-press-pr...

Re: EU countries must implement right to repair laws within two years

#55
post #37

This is only phase one; the citizens of Europe must now petition their own countries to implement great "Right to Repair" laws. Important economic fact: If only one single European country (with sufficient population) implements a rather strict right to repair law, then likely all manufacturers in all countries will need to adhere to it, since tech companies don't like to have to build multiple product variants (per…

A more probable outcome of a single country doing that is that new products won't be available there

Companies like to pretend like that's one possible outcome, but realistically that's never gonna happen. Can you imagine what a field day Samsung would have if Apple suddenly announced they're not gonna sell phones to Germany or w/e anymore?

Re: EU countries must implement right to repair laws within two years

#56
post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you sure about that? The core rule is usually that contracts are binding. In some cases they are void if exceptionally unreasonable. > While this proposal regulates certain business practices concerning repair in view of the sustainable consumption objective, >it safeguards contractual freedom Page 8

Well, since EULAs are straight-up invalid in Sweden, obviously it can't be done in an EULA. If it were allowed it have be part of an agreement with the company that is done before the sale, and which is an actual proper contract. Article 16 says only: Article 5(1) and (2) and Article 6 of this Directive shall not apply to contracts for the provision of repair services concluded before [24 months after the entry into…

I hope you're right, söta bror.

> since EULAs are straight-up invalid in Sweden

Is there anywhere I can read more about that? I didn't find anything with a quick search. Sources in Swedish are fine.

This EU source says basically the same as I do: EULAs are in principle legal, unless they're unreasonable/unfair.

https://europa.eu/youreurope/citizens/consumers/unfair-treat...

Re: EU countries must implement right to repair laws within two years

#57
post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The most vocal person behind the right to repair movement: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Npd_xDuNi9k Oh, and he runs a professional repair shop...

Saying Louis Rossmann is fighting for the right to repair while trying to keep individuals from repairing their own devices is like saying Linus Torvalds created Linux to keep people from getting the idea to build their own operating system. Rossmann is fighting the good fight and also often doing videos showing how a repair actually works. Most famously a video where he showed that a certain type of common Macbook s…

I think the internet has broken people’s brains.

Yes, he’s a really nice guy and likable and I enjoy his videos too.

But you cannot ignore the fact that he’s highly financially incentivized to hold the positions he does, given he both owns a repair shop and probably makes even more money talking about repairing things on YouTube.

Re: EU countries must implement right to repair laws within two years

#58
post #49

That's not "right to repair". Right to repair is: - I can repair it myself - with free access to schematics - with access to spare parts - without coupling between hardware and software The EU completely misunderstood what right to repair is and is now implementing something so that they can say that they have "right to repair". This will damage the RTR movement even further. I wonder who lobbied for this.

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Re: EU countries must implement right to repair laws within two years

#59
post #4

Why is there gatekeeping of "professional" repairers and "repair services"? Why can't I as a consumer view a service manual and buy a part? If a washing machine costs £220, and a professional repair man costs £70 per hour, nobody will repair out of warranty.

> Why can't I as a consumer view a service manual and buy a part? Have you ever helped a family member with their computer problems, only to notice that they often start as something benign, and the mess you are dealing with is from the family member attempting to fix that benign problem themselves? Outside of tech, how many people do you know who actually read manuals instead of just going at it?

> Have you ever helped a family member with their computer problems, only to notice that they often start as something benign, and the mess you are dealing with is from the family member attempting to fix that benign problem themselves?

No, not really. Why do you think this story is relevant here?

Re: EU countries must implement right to repair laws within two years

#60
post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Saying Louis Rossmann is fighting for the right to repair while trying to keep individuals from repairing their own devices is like saying Linus Torvalds created Linux to keep people from getting the idea to build their own operating system. Rossmann is fighting the good fight and also often doing videos showing how a repair actually works. Most famously a video where he showed that a certain type of common Macbook s…

I think the internet has broken people’s brains. Yes, he’s a really nice guy and likable and I enjoy his videos too. But you cannot ignore the fact that he’s highly financially incentivized to hold the positions he does, given he both owns a repair shop and probably makes even more money talking about repairing things on YouTube.

Can't both things be true at the same time?

* He is fighting an honest fight for the right to repair

* His business is benefiting from right to repair laws

For example when he supported the right to repair for farming equipment, I hardly believe he did that for his repair shop bottom line

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