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The Greatest Wealth Transfer in History Is Here, with Familiar (Rich) Winners

nytimes.com

51–60 of 176 posts

Re: The Greatest Wealth Transfer in History Is Here, with Familiar (Rich) Winners

#51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The inheritors didn't earn it.

So?

The question was about fairness. When concentrated wealth goes to a selected individual or group of individuals, it is usually seen as "fair" when it has been earned in some way. This didn't need to be explained, right?

Re: The Greatest Wealth Transfer in History Is Here, with Familiar (Rich) Winners

#52

In Russia, if you are born in Moscow and inherit a granny's flat¥, it gives you an enormous boost. You are free to choose any occupation and dabble in any kind of weird lifestyles or rent it out and live abroad with very modest effort. Meanwhile, if you did not inherit one and don't work in IT, expect to work hard and spend the majority of earnings on rent/mortgage. This applies nontheless even if all of your ancesto…

That is kind of outdated for Russia. Many new buildings, salaries increased. Rent is reasonable with cheap energy. And metro goes everywhere.

Problem being, any wage growth in Moscow caused prices to appreciate, because real estate is most/only reliable vehiche for long term worth storage in middle class. If you have spare cash, you buy an apartment.

Indeed, the great amount of constructions works to limit this effect.

Re: The Greatest Wealth Transfer in History Is Here, with Familiar (Rich) Winners

#53
post #6

Meanwhile the estate tax in the US only applies to inheritances larger than $12.9 million. People with that kind of wealth also know how to start planning early to avoid the tax, so the tax is practically ineffectual. A fairer inheritance tax could go a long way to fixing the worsening wealth gap in America.

What’s the argument FOR an inheritance tax, when it comes to fairness? The person who’s passsing the money down already paid tax on the money, whether income tax or capital gains tax. The government already got a hefty chunk of that earned money. Why should it be taxed again? Especially when we see how inefficient the government is at spending money for the public good.

Speaking in extreme generalities, the people in favour of taxes believe that there is only a tenuous link between improving society and getting paid money. That the state's view of what would be an improvement is superior to the view of wealthy individuals. Anyone being wealthy is somewhat suspect because they have claim on resources and the pro-tax types don't believe they can use those resource more effectively than a government.

From that perspective, the handover of assets that happens during an inheritance is a great time for a tax - they don't believe that the inheritee will use the money to improve the world, they don't believe that the deceased was making optimum use of those funds and so this is an opportunity to level the playing field for the next generation and redirect assets to a more fundamentally wise and fair state.

I don't agree with that view (the USSR alone, let alone all the other attempts...) but it is internally consistent.

Re: The Greatest Wealth Transfer in History Is Here, with Familiar (Rich) Winners

#54
post #6

Meanwhile the estate tax in the US only applies to inheritances larger than $12.9 million. People with that kind of wealth also know how to start planning early to avoid the tax, so the tax is practically ineffectual. A fairer inheritance tax could go a long way to fixing the worsening wealth gap in America.

For comparison, adding up the Dutch tax rates for when my nephew inherits from me and buys a product with it:

- Income tax: 49.5% (36.93% on income under €73k)

- Inheritance tax: 40% (30% for inheritance under €138k)

- VAT: 21%

Thus, poor people pay 65% tax and rich 76% in such a scenario.

Re: The Greatest Wealth Transfer in History Is Here, with Familiar (Rich) Winners

#55
post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No. Once you die and transfer the assets to your children, the cost basis gets reset.

But isn’t the inheritance tax (for everything over $12 mil until 2026) even larger than the capital gains tax? And it applies to the whole value, not only the increase in value.

There are some games that can be played with various types of trusts - irrevocable trusts, irrevocable life insurance trusts, grantor retained annuity trusts and other things I believe.

https://www.financialsamurai.com/how-do-millionaires-and-bil...

Re: The Greatest Wealth Transfer in History Is Here, with Familiar (Rich) Winners

#56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not clear to me there needs to be any exemption at all on inheritances. It should all be taxable income IMO. Poor people having their inheritances taxed will just get it back later in enhanced government benefits. More in fact since rich people have way larger inheritances to tax. Another huge loophole is charitable deductions. There's absolutely no reason the government needs to be helping fund individual chari…

So you slave away your younger years and pay ~40%+ income tax. You manage to afford 2 children and own a nice house outright by the time you're 65. You have a nest egg large enough to afford a high quality life in retirement (mostly to pay your property taxes & income taxes & capital gains on inflation [not even REAL capital gains]...) You die with $1M to your name plus a $1M estate (this is top ~6% or so). Now you w…

> Now you want to take away 50% of that before passing it on to the kids?

Yes, or spend it…

I’ve met too many people who are quite concerned about their parent’s wealth and spending later in life, and it seems to become more concerning for the kids once their parents become closer to death.

I believe, as a rule of thumb, dynastic wealth is bad for society at large and encourages a rise in rentiers and other parasitic behaviors.

> But also, that brings your effective tax rate for your life at close to ~66%…

Such an odd concept: the tax rate of all income you have had over the span of your life. Once you’re dead, you no longer ‘own’ anything. It belongs to your estate, and whoever owns that estate is the person who is taxed.

Re: The Greatest Wealth Transfer in History Is Here, with Familiar (Rich) Winners

#57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That is kind of outdated for Russia. Many new buildings, salaries increased. Rent is reasonable with cheap energy. And metro goes everywhere.

Problem being, any wage growth in Moscow caused prices to appreciate, because real estate is most/only reliable vehiche for long term worth storage in middle class. If you have spare cash, you buy an apartment. Indeed, the great amount of constructions works to limit this effect.

They are not competing with global foreign investors. Look at property markets in postsoviet countries like Poland or Czechia.

Russians can invest in foreign stock markets etc... It is not like in China or Korea.

Price rise you see is normal growth.

Re: The Greatest Wealth Transfer in History Is Here, with Familiar (Rich) Winners

#58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So you slave away your younger years and pay ~40%+ income tax. You manage to afford 2 children and own a nice house outright by the time you're 65. You have a nest egg large enough to afford a high quality life in retirement (mostly to pay your property taxes & income taxes & capital gains on inflation [not even REAL capital gains]...) You die with $1M to your name plus a $1M estate (this is top ~6% or so). Now you w…

So don't save up $2 million for inheritance... No one is forcing you to do that. Not to mention the increased taxes will be paid back, at least to some extent, in enhanced services. Maybe your kids could get a free education and free healthcare instead of $1M each in inheritance. Or instead of increased services, we could tax other things less such as the income of living people. I'd much rather have dead people, who…

Encouraging people to frivolously spend on luxury instead of saving is a terrible idea.

Re: The Greatest Wealth Transfer in History Is Here, with Familiar (Rich) Winners

#59
post #10

It is sort of interesting how Gen X is screwed here. Also the children of Gen X eg under 18s and younger Gen Z today.

Gen X has always been screwed. There's never been enough of us to matter demographically. The boomers have us boxed in before us, and Gen-Y/Millenials after.

It will probably be good for GenX during retirement. Nursing homes, elder care and such will be much less burdened than they are now for the baby boomers.

Re: The Greatest Wealth Transfer in History Is Here, with Familiar (Rich) Winners

#60
post #6

Meanwhile the estate tax in the US only applies to inheritances larger than $12.9 million. People with that kind of wealth also know how to start planning early to avoid the tax, so the tax is practically ineffectual. A fairer inheritance tax could go a long way to fixing the worsening wealth gap in America.

What’s the argument FOR an inheritance tax, when it comes to fairness? The person who’s passsing the money down already paid tax on the money, whether income tax or capital gains tax. The government already got a hefty chunk of that earned money. Why should it be taxed again? Especially when we see how inefficient the government is at spending money for the public good.

Otherwise wealth accumulates in the hands of an asset holding class which makes everything more expensive for everyone else.
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