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Modern city dwellers have lost about half their gut microbes

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Re: Modern city dwellers have lost about half their gut microbes

#51
post #20

Does anyone know of probiotics with a variety of bacteria? Currently they (and yoghurts) seem to be just a single type, which doesn't make a lot of sense to me. If there are unusual bacteria out there where do they come from and how can we get them? I've done a bunch of anti-biotics in the last few years so what to get back to what I was.

chobani claims six strains of yogurts, I used that as starter for my homemade yogurt batches since then. Otherwise I try and get my exposure in from the environment. I'm vaccinated so I don't bother with the mask unless there are hard rules. I will avoid overusing hand sanitizer. I take crowded public transit and otherwise walk around sidewalks and stores with a bunch of people vs private car and delivery of all my needs. I do computer work but I do almost all of it outdoors on a patio table, where I am exposed to pollen and spores and microbe aplenty (but probably better air quality than indoors given the plastic off gassing in the modern home). Basically I am trying to inoculate myself with a wide variety of things available in my local environment, just like people used to be before all this modern society stuff locked us sitting in rooms. It seems to work as far as I can tell anecdotally; I can't remember the last time I was sick.

Re: Modern city dwellers have lost about half their gut microbes

#52

About ten years ago my former PI (second author in the below paper) did quite a job on this in Burkina Faso, analyzing the composition of the gut in children living outside cities, in cities, and a comparison with European children. Obligatory disclaimer: I was working in his laboratory at the time, but I wasn't involved in that research. https://www.pnas.org/doi/10.1073/pnas.1005963107

How does one analyze the gut biome? I imagine it involves running poop through a machine - what kind of machine? I would love to learn more about the technical process.

Re: Modern city dwellers have lost about half their gut microbes

#53

It's the diet. City dwellers tend to eat a lot more unhealthy foods. They also eat a lot less vegetables, fruit and nuts than their rural country(wo)men. You want more microbes in your gut? Eat more plant-based food.

The study doesn't show this: it compares humans (who happen to live in cities) to primates (who definitely don't live in cities). It doesn't compare between human populations.

Ironically, cities (particularly affluent ones, but in general) probably have better access to fresh and healthy produce than do medium or low-income rural areas. Some of that is supply and demand (the economics of moving bulk produce favor large population clusters), and some of it is pricing (affluent consumers prefer cities and suburbs on average). You can see these trends in the USDA's Food Atlas[1], which shows lots of rural areas with poor access to produce.

[1]: https://www.ers.usda.gov/data-products/food-access-research-...

Re: Modern city dwellers have lost about half their gut microbes

#54
post #48
post #20

Does anyone know of probiotics with a variety of bacteria? Currently they (and yoghurts) seem to be just a single type, which doesn't make a lot of sense to me. If there are unusual bacteria out there where do they come from and how can we get them? I've done a bunch of anti-biotics in the last few years so what to get back to what I was.

I've had good luck with these, taken one in the morning and one at night. https://www.amazon.com/Probiotics-Formulated-Probiotic-Suppl... Now, instead of taking the probiotics, I make yogurt from whole milk (it's easy!) and open 3 probiotic capsules as the starter, letting it ferment for 24 hours to ensure all of the milk sugar is gone. This gives 2 quarts of yogurt and I eat a tablespoon every morning with breakfast…

You don't need to order more starter once you have your yogurt. You can use a spoonful of your last batch to start the next batch. I go 30 minutes at 180-190*f with the milk, then i let it cool to 110*f, then I add my scoop of yogurt, then I will hold that at 110*f in a separate container in a 110* waterbath (just a big pot of 110* water holding my yogurt tupperware containers that I periodically splash more hot water into) for like 8-12 hours or so (I sometimes forget about it on the stove...). Then I put it in the fridge for two days and after its good to go. If you want it to be more like greek yogurt you can strain it with coffee filter paper and use the whey liquid for various things.

Re: Modern city dwellers have lost about half their gut microbes

#55

It's the diet. City dwellers tend to eat a lot more unhealthy foods. They also eat a lot less vegetables, fruit and nuts than their rural country(wo)men. You want more microbes in your gut? Eat more plant-based food.

> near non-sequitur thesis not discussed in article stated definitively

> flimsy evidence which isn't true [https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3365871/]

Certified HackerNews moment!

Re: Modern city dwellers have lost about half their gut microbes

#56
post #2

Could this explain trends like increasing food allergies in countries where more and more people are becoming urban dwellers?

There's a guy (Jasper Lawrence, who had a horrible allergy problem) had heard of a study where they were testing to see if allergies was related to parasites. He was rejected from the study, so, long story short, he ended up flying to northern Africa and walking around barefoot to get hookworm. He now monitors and manages his hookworm infection with low doses of anti-parasite medication, and he sells soil infected wi…

I know a person who contracted a transient parasite infection, possibly hookworm, while doing research in Africa and walking around barefoot. In the decade+ since, they’ve suffered terribly from debilitating and incurable auto-immune diseases brought on by the initial parasite infection.

So, YMMV.

Re: Modern city dwellers have lost about half their gut microbes

#57
post #45

Pretty much every culture around the world 100 years ago had some staple fermented food. Nowadays, a lot of people in western culture at least outright refuse yogurt or other fermented foods like saurkraut or pickled cabbage that used to be staples in these people's ancestor's diets a few generations ago. People are becoming even lactose intolerant. You have to fertilize your microbes so to speak and eat these sorts…

> You have to fertilize your microbes so to speak and eat these sorts of foods

[citation needed]. It seems unlikely that fermented foods are not consumed in urban areas at all. I’ve also no idea if other primates consume any fermented foods, but I’d guess probably not.

> People are becoming even lactose intolerant

Do any other primates drink milk after infancy? If not, that’s not really a valid concern in the context of the article.

Re: Modern city dwellers have lost about half their gut microbes

#59
post #2

Could this explain trends like increasing food allergies in countries where more and more people are becoming urban dwellers?

Quoted post unavailable.

Well of course it’s obvious that we’re not carnivorous our ancestors didn’t eat meat and always used to go to the pharmacy to get their iron and B vitamin supplements

Re: Modern city dwellers have lost about half their gut microbes

#60

About ten years ago my former PI (second author in the below paper) did quite a job on this in Burkina Faso, analyzing the composition of the gut in children living outside cities, in cities, and a comparison with European children. Obligatory disclaimer: I was working in his laboratory at the time, but I wasn't involved in that research. https://www.pnas.org/doi/10.1073/pnas.1005963107

What's a "former PI"?

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