Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Five Levels of Hype

johannesklingebiel.de

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

51–60 of 106 posts

Re: Five Levels of Hype

#51

Post by elefanten »

zepto wrote: post #38
eric_cc wrote: post #34

> Examples here are (again) the cryptocurrency scene which has been pretty good at othering critics as “no-coiners” or lately with the phrase “have fun staying poor”. I’m somebody that spends a good deal of time thinking deeply on cryptocurrencies and the implications to society. I believe they a positive, revolutionary step in the right direction of human liberty. And I’ll gladly acknowledge that it’s still speculat…

Crypto is different because the scumbags are motivated by the currencies themselves .

I suppose this was supposed to sound like a snappy argument? It’s a bland, impactless statement. Even if scumbags are infatuated with something, it can still have legitimate and beneficial uses / users.

And the comment’s wrong too… the scumbags probably want to cash their gains out to traditional currencies, they’re least likely to be in it as technology true believers.

Re: Five Levels of Hype

#52

Post by jollybean »

yakattak wrote: post #2

I prefer Gartner’s Hype Cycle[1] way of displaying this. This post seems pretty inspired by it but the removal of the graph really makes it harder to grok quickly. Still, the trend seems to be: 1. New technology, over promises 2. Marketing latches onto the overpromise and bolsters it, regardless of lack of research 3. Companies built around the technology fail, until a few find the niche the technology fits into. Mak…

There are many products, indeed, entire categories, that never come out of the 'trough of disillusionment'.

Re: Five Levels of Hype

#53

Post by jollybean »

password54321 wrote: post #42
ryandrake wrote: post #7

Kind of similar to this Conspiracy Levels chart that was making the rounds a few months ago[1], including the crucial “departure from reality” tipping point, and the “XYZ as your group identity” level. No doubt promoters of major conspiracies have studied marketing, as they are are adept at generating belief and hype out of nothing. 1: https://m.imgur.com/XY5PAvd

Covid coming from a lab is 'leaving science"? Well I'm glad whoever made that chart has it all figured out.

Yes, they need to update that list.

Jamie Metzel [1] makes a very rational case that the Lab Leak theory is very likely. Check out is interview with Lex. It's more than 4 hours long (!), but worth a listen.

[1] https://jamiemetzl.com/origins-of-sars-cov-2/

Re: Five Levels of Hype

#54

Post by zepto »

elefanten wrote: post #51
zepto wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Crypto is different because the scumbags are motivated by the currencies themselves .

I suppose this was supposed to sound like a snappy argument? It’s a bland, impactless statement. Even if scumbags are infatuated with something, it can still have legitimate and beneficial uses / users. And the comment’s wrong too… the scumbags probably want to cash their gains out to traditional currencies, they’re least likely to be in it as technology true believers.

> Even if scumbags are infatuated with something,

Nobody is taking about infatuation except you.

Obviously the comment is talking about the incentive for people to try to drive the value of their holdings up.

The scumbags are the ones who do this dishonestly.

> And the comment’s wrong too… the scumbags probably want to cash their gains out to traditional currencies, they’re least likely to be in it as technology true believers.

No. Anyone can be a scumbag. It has nothing to do with being in it for a quick buck or being a true believer or not. It’s simply about what methods one is willing to use.

So yes, Hodlers, and crypto-utopians can be scumbags too.

Re: Five Levels of Hype

#55

Post by danielmarkbruce »

Wronnay wrote: post #43
Retric wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> There is no proof That’s an odd requirement. There is no proof Intel will ever put out a faster chip. There is in general no proof for any new technology because it hasn’t been built yet. Narrow city streets aren’t vastly different than normal city streets, and people used to constantly say sure operating on highways is easy, show me self driving cars inside cities. I think people underestimate how long self drivin…

I agree with your comment, but I understood the author's level 2 as something which can be realized with existing technology. Meaning there is already a prototype. There is no prototype for complete full driving, including very difficult situations - so I see that as level 3.

How would one build a prototype for "complete full driving" ?

Re: Five Levels of Hype

#56

Post by ricardobeat »

elefanten wrote: post #51
zepto wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Crypto is different because the scumbags are motivated by the currencies themselves .

I suppose this was supposed to sound like a snappy argument? It’s a bland, impactless statement. Even if scumbags are infatuated with something, it can still have legitimate and beneficial uses / users. And the comment’s wrong too… the scumbags probably want to cash their gains out to traditional currencies, they’re least likely to be in it as technology true believers.

I think what he was trying to say is that saying "crypto attracts scumbags" puts the onus purely on consumers of the tech, when in fact a lot of the scummy behavior, hype and fraud is planned and encouraged by the people implementing the technology, not only their users. That's a significant departure from "any other movement".

Re: Five Levels of Hype

#57

Post by Comevius »

eric_cc wrote: post #34

> Examples here are (again) the cryptocurrency scene which has been pretty good at othering critics as “no-coiners” or lately with the phrase “have fun staying poor”. I’m somebody that spends a good deal of time thinking deeply on cryptocurrencies and the implications to society. I believe they a positive, revolutionary step in the right direction of human liberty. And I’ll gladly acknowledge that it’s still speculat…

Crypto is not practical or fair by design. It needs a steady supply of greater fools to operate, and the only future it's capable of creating is one where everything is monetized, corporatized and the wealthy is in charge, with no recourse for the rest of us.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YQ_xWvX1n9g

Re: Five Levels of Hype

#59

Post by sepiasaucer »

eric_cc wrote: post #34

> Examples here are (again) the cryptocurrency scene which has been pretty good at othering critics as “no-coiners” or lately with the phrase “have fun staying poor”. I’m somebody that spends a good deal of time thinking deeply on cryptocurrencies and the implications to society. I believe they a positive, revolutionary step in the right direction of human liberty. And I’ll gladly acknowledge that it’s still speculat…

IMO the technology blockchain has only demonstrated success in 1 application which is cryptocurrency. Cryptocurrency has only demonstrated success in 2 applications: speculative investment and illegal online purchases. I would include NFT’s under the speculative investment category.

These applications are obviously problematic for 3 main reasons: it wastes enormous amounts of energy, the investment is often at the expense of less tech/financial savvy people, and most people don’t want it to be easier for criminals to conduct financial transactions.

IMO, it is not a few bad apples spoiling the bunch. It is a bunch of bad apples with a few good apples mixed in. Even if your motivations in working in this space are good (not simply for your own technical stimulation/amusement), you are trading off furthering/enabling real world harm now against optimistic speculation about future positive outcomes.

Re: Five Levels of Hype

#60

Post by tarsinge »

Comevius wrote: post #57
eric_cc wrote: post #34

> Examples here are (again) the cryptocurrency scene which has been pretty good at othering critics as “no-coiners” or lately with the phrase “have fun staying poor”. I’m somebody that spends a good deal of time thinking deeply on cryptocurrencies and the implications to society. I believe they a positive, revolutionary step in the right direction of human liberty. And I’ll gladly acknowledge that it’s still speculat…

Crypto is not practical or fair by design. It needs a steady supply of greater fools to operate, and the only future it's capable of creating is one where everything is monetized, corporatized and the wealthy is in charge, with no recourse for the rest of us. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YQ_xWvX1n9g

I really did not like that video. There are some interesting ideas but the tone is insufferable for me, not a fan of superficial punchlines and logical fallacies wrapped as deep thoughts, no matter if I agree or not with the point.
Post reply on HN