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One decade later, Minecraft world generation is interesting again

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Re: One decade later, Minecraft world generation is interesting again

#51

If you like voxel world generation, I strongly advise you to check out Veloren[1], it has a much much deeper worldgen that what Minecraft offers. [1]: https://veloren.net/ the game is still under development but it has been playable for more than a year now.

See also Minetest, which has several native map/terrain generators [1]. In addition, one can define other generators as mods using Lua [2]. Mods can define new biomes [4], place buildings [5], roads [3], etc.

If you add all that, though, you might there might be some glitches (roads passing through buildings..) but that's part of the fun.

[1] https://wiki.minetest.net/Map_generator

[2] https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=27374

[3] https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=18529

[4] https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=17096

[5] https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=13589

Re: One decade later, Minecraft world generation is interesting again

#52
post #19

One thing I always hoped, but that never happened: get people’s creations into the game. Randomly get vetted buildings as biomes. People have created insane things and it’s a shame they couldn’t have been integrated directly into the game. Even a few would have been cool. I guess one thing is that structures without life feels empty, so you’d have to generate random monsters or NPCs for each of them.

I think you could completely automate this by training a neural network on local neighborhoods to generate a voxel probability distribution for the center voxel, so a randomly initialized world would converge to a world that has pieces that resemble the worlds that the network was trained on. So in 1D you would take a sequence of voxels ABCDE, and the network would learn to predict C from A,B,D,E.

Similar idea without neural networks:

https://github.com/mxgmn/WaveFunctionCollapse

I'm surprised no one applied this idea to Minecraft yet. There's even a 3D version:

https://i.imgur.com/IEOsbIy.png

Re: One decade later, Minecraft world generation is interesting again

#53

Man. I really do want to like it, but this update is the first one that gives me the Microsoft-finally-took-over vibes. Traversal and with that exploration just became so much harder. The landscape is now riddled with holes that you either build scraggly bridges over, or lead to massive detours. The sides of bodies of water are much higher and steeper on average, making it impossible to see the landscape you're passi…

I'm no Microsoft apologist, but I believe you've misunderstood the intention and the effect of the changes.

Previously, the time-optimal strategy to acquire iron and diamonds was to dig a hole deep into the earth and then bore straight paths. This was exceptionally grindy (fans would say zen, detractors would say tedious), but effective.

With 1.18, the optimal strategy is now to enter a cave and find the resources there. The holes in the ground that you dislike are entry points to that system, where many resources are available -- though at the risk of encounters with monsters.

So the transition is from a static grind to the new system based on cave exploration and risk. It's more dynamic and engaging, directly the opposite of your claim here. You mention iron, claiming that progress is slower, but in actuality it's significantly easier to acquire useful amounts of iron now. Jump into any random cave and it's all over the place. Sure, there's a lot of relatively useless copper too, but no one is forcing you to mine it. Just skip what you don't need and you don't need to manage it in your inventory.

Likewise, the new topology with increased heights means that rivers are significantly more important for exploring. You point out that it makes it more difficult to go from one peak to the next, which is accurate (though in my opinion you overstate the difficulty), but regardless it is quite easy to make long journeys if you follow the rivers and low terrain.

So yeah it's harder to go directly in a straight line than it was in before, but now you're paying attention to the terrain in the world and adapting your gameplay as a result. It just requires different navigation techniques. Like it or not, you're absolutely not stuck at spawn.

Re: One decade later, Minecraft world generation is interesting again

#54

Man. I really do want to like it, but this update is the first one that gives me the Microsoft-finally-took-over vibes. Traversal and with that exploration just became so much harder. The landscape is now riddled with holes that you either build scraggly bridges over, or lead to massive detours. The sides of bodies of water are much higher and steeper on average, making it impossible to see the landscape you're passi…

I haven't tried but I believe I can't play Minecraft anymore because all players have been forced to convert their Mojang accounts, which is something I simply don't want to do. Funny how a company can just take away something you purchased and you have no recourse.

Re: One decade later, Minecraft world generation is interesting again

#55
post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

With the current launcher, you can actually pick which version/update to play, including old versions. For Java Edition, it lists versions all the way back to alpha as options.

This is so user-unhostile I wanna cry. Most companies just want the power to force antifeutures on the users nowadays.

The Microsoft acquisition of Minecraft is inexplicably one of the few big tech acquisitions that hasn't completely destroyed the product. It's impressive

Re: One decade later, Minecraft world generation is interesting again

#56
post #13

It's been a while since I've played Minecraft, so I can't speak to the newer terrain. But I always thought they could significantly improve the world gen. Perlin noise is cool, but why not try to fully simulate plate tectonics, weather patterns, drainage? It would go a long way if deserts were in the rainshadow of mountain ranges, islands corresponded to real volcanic activity, etc. I guess there is a limit to what y…

Doesn't the ultra-realistic mod terrafirmcraft already do exactly that?

Re: One decade later, Minecraft world generation is interesting again

#57
post #13

It's been a while since I've played Minecraft, so I can't speak to the newer terrain. But I always thought they could significantly improve the world gen. Perlin noise is cool, but why not try to fully simulate plate tectonics, weather patterns, drainage? It would go a long way if deserts were in the rainshadow of mountain ranges, islands corresponded to real volcanic activity, etc. I guess there is a limit to what y…

It is stunningly difficult to do something like this within procedural generation. Remember a given xyz coordinate has to generate given only the coordinate number itself and a seed. You couldn't do stuff like plate tectonics within an "infinite" world because that would require generating every block which is akin to generating every digit of pi

Re: One decade later, Minecraft world generation is interesting again

#58
post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Minecraft has supported cross platform multiplayer for a while now, so it would be really weird if they broke compatibility with PC like this.

Mimd you, there are two versions of Mimecraft. Java and Bedrock. Both support PC but only Bedrock supports other plattforms. Cross Plattform multiplayer therefore only works with bedrock. Java isn't compatible with bedrock servers and the other way around.

Although there are mods for the Java edition to allow Bedrock clients to connect to Java servers.

Re: One decade later, Minecraft world generation is interesting again

#59
post #16

The new terrain is great, but I have mostly exhausted my patience with Minecraft survival. I hope future releases will put some effort into reducing the grindyness. I know many things can be automated but they tend to rely on extremely arcane game mechanics rather than feeling like an intentional part of the game. Some elements of Factorio were inspired by Minecraft. I think Minecraft could now use some inspiration f…

Have you considered modded to get a little more Factorio in your minecraft? I'm playing the "Create: Above & Beyond" pack. There is grind, the pack gives you a goal (build rocket, go to moon), but how you get there is up to you and the automation isn't quite so arcane as vanilla, and doesn't rely on "magic blocks" (Where you plonk down a single block and it magically does all the things) instead relying on you making…

I honestly never understood the appeal of vanilla Minecraft. I only bought the game because of the mods! Mods like AE2 or Thermal Expansion is where the fun is at!

Re: One decade later, Minecraft world generation is interesting again

#60

> I have stopped in recent years since I find it dangerously addictive I forgot this, but that's actually why I stopped playing it. I was in uni around 2007-08 and realised it was using a serious amount of my time and energy. I just quit cold turkey back then. I've barely played any video games since this point, in fact. What I loved about Minecraft initially was the exploration. I got into it during the beta (I thin…

That's what the hardcore mode in Minecraft is for: if you die, the save is deleted.
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