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Edward Snowden calls for spyware trade ban amid Pegasus revelations

theguardian.com

51–60 of 85 posts

Re: Edward Snowden calls for spyware trade ban amid Pegasus revelations

#51
post #22

Classifying such technology as military weapons would begin to address a number of international and national concerns with for-sale-malware (aka spyware). The use of such military weapons by civilians (or civilian police) against civilians become more obviously ban-able.

> The use of such military weapons by civilians (or civilian police) against civilians become more obviously ban-able.

Not sure it would stop the police part. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Militarization_of_police

Re: Edward Snowden calls for spyware trade ban amid Pegasus revelations

#52
post #45
post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> 20 years ago I discovered antivirus software did not detect spyware by design... Can you provide evidence to back up this statement? I'm not disputing your claim outright, I'd just like to see your evidence.

Obviously FOSS software is bug less and totally secure by "design" ...

Every single time I read about how safe and secure FOSS is, I think about this small issue: https://github.com/MrMEEE/bumblebee-Old-and-abbandoned/issue...

Yes, I know it's a decade old, but it's a great example of „open source is better/safer/whatever”.

Re: Edward Snowden calls for spyware trade ban amid Pegasus revelations

#53
post #2

I would like to point out that this kind of tech isn't only used by state sponsored operations. https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-50166147 Lone wolf creepers or quasi legal harassment companies have access to similar tools. https://www.nefariousjobsmain.com/the-works https://www.vice.com/en/article/ppmpe8/a-revenge-for-hire-bu... Although of course the state sponsored aspect of this is very real too, and the greate…

> Lone wolf creepers or quasi legal harassment companies have access to similar tools. I would take that for granted, as I do with any government, including mine. But thinking that you're more likely to be kept under surveillance by the same government -no matter the color- you fund with your taxes, than some private or foreign entity, makes this even more revolting. Makes one think if nationalism was invented as a t…

The collusion of leaders wrt to their personal business interests can make states seem like protection rackets…

Re: Edward Snowden calls for spyware trade ban amid Pegasus revelations

#54
post #52
post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Obviously FOSS software is bug less and totally secure by "design" ...

Every single time I read about how safe and secure FOSS is, I think about this small issue: https://github.com/MrMEEE/bumblebee-Old-and-abbandoned/issue... Yes, I know it's a decade old, but it's a great example of „open source is better/safer/whatever”.

what about this one[1] (no idea why I even remembered this one);

[1] https://securiteam.com/unixfocus/5hp0s1p75e/

Re: Edward Snowden calls for spyware trade ban amid Pegasus revelations

#55
post #22

Classifying such technology as military weapons would begin to address a number of international and national concerns with for-sale-malware (aka spyware). The use of such military weapons by civilians (or civilian police) against civilians become more obviously ban-able.

While I agree that the trade in these tools is reprehensible, I worry about creating a new class of software that is prohibited to possess or trade in. It wasn't so long ago that strong encryption was labelled a 'dual use technology', and moving it across national borders was non-trivial. How long will it take for pentesting tools and end-to-end encryption to be labelled 'military weapons' under such a scheme?

I worry, too. Regulators do hatchet jobs when it comes to software law. But slippery slopes aside, it's pretty clear that selling tools to take over phones en masse is a bad deal for free societies.

Here's what we will find next: military and political leaders' phones have also already been compromised by NSO Group tools. I feel confident it has happened at a higher rate than among journalists. Imagine both your favorite and your most hated political firebrands: how will their rhetoric sound when they realize they've been pwned by the opposition for the past year using COTS tools?

Re: Edward Snowden calls for spyware trade ban amid Pegasus revelations

#56

As the government that allows itself to use this spyware will always have an advantage over the government that does not, it will never be banned.

Like chemical weapons?

Chemical weapons were easily banned because they are almost entirely useless as long as you have access to conventional weapons. They are expensive to store, very inefficient for actually killing the opposition, easy to guard against, have a higher chance of turning back on you, and will slow your advance if you use them in an attack. They are at best a tool for terror or desperation.

Think about the Tokyo metro attacks and, not to minimize the tragedy, but how many more lives would have been lost if they had detonated similar quantities of explosives instead of spreading sarin gas - and that is inside a closed tube, with no protection whatsoever and with most victims receiving no medical care until many hours later, as hospitals were entirely unprepared for a gas attack.

Re: Edward Snowden calls for spyware trade ban amid Pegasus revelations

#57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We've got to get to them before microsoft and google do. Teach Linux in schools and about the importance of FLOSS. In my school in California it was all windows in the 1990's and 2000's.

> In my school in California it was all windows in the 1990's and 2000's. Yeah, it was that way even before that. Microsoft and Apple got into a "donation war" tryin'a get their corporate garbage into schools back when I was a kid. Looks like Microsoft largely won that war. Hard to fight multiple generations deep corporate brainwashing.

Eh, I mean, I grew up with Macs at home and school and have definitely seen the light of free/libre software. That said, it took a long time, and it was also largely because I have always been quite conscious of privacy (and to a lesser degree, security). It is still indeed an uphill battle for all the "I have nothing to hide" average people who just act like you're paranoid for even bringing up the subject of privacy.

Re: Edward Snowden calls for spyware trade ban amid Pegasus revelations

#58
post #52
post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Obviously FOSS software is bug less and totally secure by "design" ...

Every single time I read about how safe and secure FOSS is, I think about this small issue: https://github.com/MrMEEE/bumblebee-Old-and-abbandoned/issue... Yes, I know it's a decade old, but it's a great example of „open source is better/safer/whatever”.

haha wow, that's a rough one!

Re: Edward Snowden calls for spyware trade ban amid Pegasus revelations

#59
post #36
post #2

I would like to point out that this kind of tech isn't only used by state sponsored operations. https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-50166147 Lone wolf creepers or quasi legal harassment companies have access to similar tools. https://www.nefariousjobsmain.com/the-works https://www.vice.com/en/article/ppmpe8/a-revenge-for-hire-bu... Although of course the state sponsored aspect of this is very real too, and the greate…

How is parler kicked off its hosting but a site plainly advertising criminal acts for hire is up and has a US domain name?

I'd guess because it's total cosplay.

Edit: "Severe psychological warning, this package is only available for use on clients over 30 years of age."

...because a 26 year old can't handle getting a dildo in the mail?

Re: Edward Snowden calls for spyware trade ban amid Pegasus revelations

#60
post #22

Classifying such technology as military weapons would begin to address a number of international and national concerns with for-sale-malware (aka spyware). The use of such military weapons by civilians (or civilian police) against civilians become more obviously ban-able.

Calling it a weapon means it falls under 2nd Amendment.

Pretty hard sell that it's a "military" weapon when you can carry it around on a thumb drive.

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