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The psychology behind ‘revenge bedtime procrastination’

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Re: The psychology behind ‘revenge bedtime procrastination’

#51
post #48

Sounds like they're just behaving like parents with young kids. I routinely stay up too late just to have some quiet, waking conscious alone time after a full day of work and time with the kids (which are now hopelessly intertwined).

>Sounds like they're just behaving like parents with young kids.

That was my thought as well. After the wife and kid (not so young now) get to bed is when I actually get quiet time to myself, which I need to unwind from the day.

It's actually gotten much worse due to WFH. My daily commute (via transit) provided some of that quiet time to gear up in the morning and unwind in the evening.

Re: The psychology behind ‘revenge bedtime procrastination’

#52

Of course, what's actually not good for you is having to work twelve hours a day. Leisure time isn't the problem.

Thank fuck some countries have had workers' revolutions that limit working hours and days - and make employers pay dearly for overtime. I mean there's workarounds like the gig economy, but for most people things are still pretty good.

Except for all the demanding jobs where you need to unofficially work outside your working hours... I live in one of those countries with a reasonable working hours limit, but I'm an academic, my partner is a doctor, both of us work "voluntarily" outside working hours. I need to prepare clases, request grants, and do research in a hypercompetitive environment where you need better CV than competitors. She needs to be up to date with the latest findings in medicine.

It does work for workers in many sectors, though. I'm not criticizing working hours regulations, far from it - just saying we should probably do more than that.

Re: The psychology behind ‘revenge bedtime procrastination’

#53
post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Quit - different job. Its a management/company culture thing. Burn out, find something healthy. The fact that most wont since they need the money tells us how nasty this is.

Yes, for many, their job is a matter of survival. There is something really horrific in how a society as technologically advanced and productive as ours has almost eliminated leisure time, rather than increased it.

Its interesting, we have developed several time saving inventions over the past 50 years, only to have that time we saved filled up with more work.

I was reading the book '168 Hours: You Have More Time Than You Think', and the author mentions how researchers in the past were predicting we would have so much free time in the future.

Re: The psychology behind ‘revenge bedtime procrastination’

#54
post #4
post #3

I'm also doing this, big time.. Between a full-time job, building a new home, renovating another and having a wife and kid, there's not any "me" time until past wife+kids bedtime. I only get energy from being alone and doing stuff on my computer, so I trade sleep for time every night.

Nothing beats having some time alone to work on your personal projects. Especially after wasting a full day working with enterprise code that was written by an offshore company six years ago.

You okay?

Re: The psychology behind ‘revenge bedtime procrastination’

#56
post #13

I follow a similar pattern, but a major component for me is anhedonia / depression. I don't have anything in my life that is fulfilling or exciting or fun. I delay going to bed, both hoping to suddenly feel that spark of excitement for something, and feeling reluctant to go to bed in this unsatisified state.

Tried stimulants?

Stimulants to work around depression seems like a recipe for more depression. A high is usually followed by a low, not to mention fucking up your brain long-term.

I would suggest seeking professional mental health help. I'd also suggest meditation and a bit of self discovery. If it wasn't 2020 I'd also suggest travelling, break the pattern find some perspective.

Life is too short, find some help, get to the root of your problem. Life lesson for me that I am still trying to embody is happiness is a choice. It's really true. When I dig deep I realize that I actually like to wallow in unhappiness, it gives me an identity. This is obviously not healthy but realizing that is the first, incredibly difficult step. Shaking myself out of a black hole spiral is so hard. But forcing yourself to go for a walk, see some friends, basically break out of whatever negative thoughts you have an choosing to do something positive is key.

You aren't alone feeling this way. Be kind to yourself.

Re: The psychology behind ‘revenge bedtime procrastination’

#57
It may raise eyebrows, but with the current WFH culture, I simply take naps during work time. If I feel tired, then it's in my and my employers' best interest for me to nap since I will be much more productive for the next few hours.

I've tested this also by not sleeping, and my code becomes worse and I need to rewrite a lot of it anyway.

In fairness, I do try to go to bed on time, but my issue is that I sometimes only sleep 5 to 6 hours. My body just won't sleep, so I make up for it during work time.

It is what it is.

Re: The psychology behind ‘revenge bedtime procrastination’

#58

That this is needed in one’s life is a sign that you are probably wasting your life.

School sets you up for this mindset. I don't think many people realize that there is more to a life than achieving or being productive. It's all good if that's what you actually enjoy, but if it's making you miserable you are indeed wasting your life. Knowing this should shake you awake, knowing you are miserable because of what you are currently doing should provoke a change, not seek some way to work with your misery.

Re: The psychology behind ‘revenge bedtime procrastination’

#59
post #21
post #5

No mention of how to get out of this unhealthy habit. I'm struggling with this myself. Some of my conclusions so far: * When I am sleep-deprived I am less productive. So I spend more time doing "work". Then I have less time for everything else I want to do (family, cooking, sport). So I take more time away from sleep. And the cycle repeats. Sleep deprivation is self-perpetuating. * What I do at night, when I am exhau…

I would recommend reading “Atomic habits” it’s a small and easy book to read. It has a lot of “aha” moments were stuff you already know click in your mind on how to develop good habits and remove bad habits, it provides good guidance.

I second this book.

I also think being sleep deprived destroys your willpower. So getting enough sleep for a few nights, perhaps on the weekend, and then trying to keep a streak going.

Additionally I’ve had a lot of success using a habit tracking app (I love way of life but habitica is also great and free).

I would also set an alarm every night.

Re: The psychology behind ‘revenge bedtime procrastination’

#60
post #8

Here’s how you fix this. Go to bed early and wake up earlier. I do honestly believe that young adults naturally stay up later though. I think there’s an evolutionary reason for it, basically to keep the nights watch and ward off predators.

I'm a night owl (sleep 12-8am) who occasionally experiences season-long hard constraints that force me into early bird schedules (sleep 8-4am). Whenever the temperatures get high and I don't have access to an air-conditioned gym, I have to get up for the daily temperature minimum, whatever it takes. Since this happens for an entire summer, it gives me the chance to adapt to the schedule and optimize around it.

The early bird schedule didn't reveal an untapped reserve of morning energy. It didn't shift my late night energy burst into the morning. In fact, it didn't shift the productivity burst at all -- it eliminated it. This wasn't for lack of sunlight and exercise; getting up early to run outside was the entire point. It wasn't for lack of cold showers, which were remarkably pleasant after suffering in the heat. It wasn't due to a poor diet, or meal scheduling, which I experimented with.

To hear the early birds talk about it, these exercises should have transformed me into a superior moral being of hyper-optimized productivity, overflowing with perfection in every aspect of spirituality and performance. That isn't what happened. Not in part, not in whole. The net effect was small and negative. I traded high-energy night hours for low-energy morning hours. It was worth it to access the daily temperature minimum, but I wasn't able to make the morning schedule work for me, despite having every intent and incentive to do so. When the constraint lifted, I moved back to my regular schedule and recaptured its benefits.

Night owls: try the early bird schedule, there are enough people who report benefits from switching that you owe it a solid try.

Early birds: tips and anecdotes are fine, but frame them in terms of what works for you. Cut the sanctimonious bullshit. It isn't helpful, it isn't appreciated, and it isn't appropriate.

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