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Leaked Emails: Norwegian Pressures Sales Team to Lie About Coronavirus

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Re: Leaked Emails: Norwegian Pressures Sales Team to Lie About Coronavirus

#51

Post by new2628 »

phonypc wrote: post #33
sonicxxg wrote: post #7

This recent coronavirus outbreak has been very enlightening, cause it gaves us more information on why cruises are a bad idea, and perfect for an epidemic. The same air is recirculating among all cabins. However, it does not explain why we haven't heard of flu outbreaks in cruises before this coronavirus. It seems cruises are perfect for the proliferation of any airborne virus.

Why would recirculated air be a concern on cruise ships? They're not airplanes. Also COVID-19 only seems to be airborne in the sense that you can get it from coughed/sneezed droplets directly from a sick person, not aerosols that can be widely distributed.

So how did 696 passengers on Diamond Princess become infected?

Re: Leaked Emails: Norwegian Pressures Sales Team to Lie About Coronavirus

#52

Post by sneak »

turbonoobie wrote: post #46
jacquesm wrote: post #36

That's borderline criminal. To blatantly lie about the risks - especially elderly passengers - people are taking should be actionable in some way. These emails will come back to haunt them if family of future casualties sues them. I sincerely hope they go out of business.

Borderline? How isn’t it criminal?

Disclaimer: I am not a lawyer and I am not your lawyer.

Salespeople lying, within certain limits, does not seem to be treated as fraud by most governments, caveat emptor and all.

If they tell you the alcohol on the cruise will be free and you sign a contract saying so, and then it actually isn’t and you have to pay more, that’s one thing. If they tell you it’s going to be sunny and warm when you’re taking a cruise to Alaska in winter, that’s a different thing.

Lying or deceiving during sales about things other than the product is a large part of a salesperson’s job, I believe (including but not limited to making the customer think the salesperson likes and respects them).

Re: Leaked Emails: Norwegian Pressures Sales Team to Lie About Coronavirus

#54

Post by new2628 »

lowercased wrote: post #16
sonicxxg wrote: post #7

This recent coronavirus outbreak has been very enlightening, cause it gaves us more information on why cruises are a bad idea, and perfect for an epidemic. The same air is recirculating among all cabins. However, it does not explain why we haven't heard of flu outbreaks in cruises before this coronavirus. It seems cruises are perfect for the proliferation of any airborne virus.

I've been on a whole 2 in my life, but enjoyed both trips quite a lot - especially when people get off at various ports and I have huge areas mostly to myself :). Understanding there's some potential for this sort of thing, but may take the risk again in the future.

For the locals in those ports though ...

Re: Leaked Emails: Norwegian Pressures Sales Team to Lie About Coronavirus

#55

Post by nothrabannosir »

joshklein wrote: post #44
nothrabannosir wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you’re really looking: Norway makes a significant chunk of money from oil exports, contributing to (and profiting from) what is arguably the greatest threat facing our civilisation today. Finland, on the other hand.. much respect :)

On the other hand, 98% of their domestic electricity is renewable (95% hydroelectric). If other nations followed Norway's lead by nationalizing their respective oil sectors, it could be an important step towards curbing consumption.

Unfortunately not. They sell most of it, and buy fossil fuels for 58% of their own energy consumption.

https://www.nve.no/energiforsyning/varedeklarasjon/nasjonal-...

Their politicians love touting that 98% green energy production but it’s incredibly misleading.

Sorry by the way I really don’t mean to take this conversation so off topic. It was meant half tongue in cheek :) every country has blind spots and this was about coronavirus and cruises, not global warming! And this is only their politicians; Norwegians are the most lovely people. Nothing against the country.

I’ll leave it here. Sorry again.

Re: Leaked Emails: Norwegian Pressures Sales Team to Lie About Coronavirus

#56

Post by chungus_khan »

ryandrake wrote: post #47
jacquesm wrote: post #36

That's borderline criminal. To blatantly lie about the risks - especially elderly passengers - people are taking should be actionable in some way. These emails will come back to haunt them if family of future casualties sues them. I sincerely hope they go out of business.

Then again, who is stupid enough take medical advice from a vacation salesman? These customers have agency and are ultimately the decision makers. What this company is doing is unethical, but we all need to be responsible for the decisions we make. If I decide to go on a cruise right now, knowing what has been going on, it’s not the company’s fault if I get sick.

It's not really medical advice in the sense someone would normally think of it, it's vacation safety advice. While one should probably treat the words of any salesperson with extreme skepticism, a lot of people don't, and those most at risk (the elderly) use the official word of their cruise company as their main source of safety advice (usually of the form "get this vaccination" or "beware this part of town" or "this kind of tour operator on shore is a scam"). And regardless, salespeople are absolutely expected to be responsible for the claims they make, regardless of one's views on how much they should be trusted.

Re: Leaked Emails: Norwegian Pressures Sales Team to Lie About Coronavirus

#57

Post by speedgoose »

qayxc wrote: post #9
rado wrote: post #4

Miami New Times is unreadable: https://i.imgur.com/jBCtyvS.jpg

Just disable javascript - solves my readability problems with 9/10 websites.

It just breaks 9/10 non-news websites that don't have readability problems.

Re: Leaked Emails: Norwegian Pressures Sales Team to Lie About Coronavirus

#58

Post by barry-cotter »

new2628 wrote: post #51
phonypc wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why would recirculated air be a concern on cruise ships? They're not airplanes. Also COVID-19 only seems to be airborne in the sense that you can get it from coughed/sneezed droplets directly from a sick person, not aerosols that can be widely distributed.

So how did 696 passengers on Diamond Princess become infected?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2020_coronavirus_outbreak_on_c...

> Kentaro Iwata, an infectious diseases expert at Kobe University who visited the ship, strongly criticised the management of the situation in two widely circulated YouTube videos published on 18 February.[36][37][38][39] He called Diamond Princess a "COVID-19 mill".[40] He said that the areas possibly contaminated by the virus were not in any way separated from virus-free areas, there were numerous lapses in infection control measures, and that there was no professional in charge of infection prevention—the bureaucrats were in charge of everything.

Re: Leaked Emails: Norwegian Pressures Sales Team to Lie About Coronavirus

#59

Post by martinhath »

ericmay wrote: post #48
joshklein wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On the other hand, 98% of their domestic electricity is renewable (95% hydroelectric). If other nations followed Norway's lead by nationalizing their respective oil sectors, it could be an important step towards curbing consumption.

Well, then if 98% is already renewable, why keep pumping oil out of the ground and contributing to global warming? (Hint: money) I don't really think there's a way around this for Norwegians. If you're upset about climate change (and you should be) then you should also be honest that continuing to extract and sell oil is contributing to the problem. It's nice that Norway has a small, homogenous population in a countr…

You criticize Norway for continuing to pump up oil, which you attribute to greed, and then, in the same comment, point out that many other countries don't have the opportunities for renewable energy that Norway (allegedly) has. Do you not see a connection here?

> It's nice that Norway has a small, homogenous population in a country with low population density, great education

This all seems off-topic to me.

> But I think it's fair to point out what I perceive as a shortcoming that they currently have in the context of this discussion.

Considering this post is about an US based cruise ship lying about a virus, nothing in your comment is really appropriate for "the context of this discussion".

Re: Leaked Emails: Norwegian Pressures Sales Team to Lie About Coronavirus

#60

Post by wbl »

creaghpatr wrote: post #41
wbl wrote: post #28

Time for the health department to put some big red notices up on the office and the ships.

The CDC already called out cruises specifically https://wwwnc.cdc.gov/travel/page/covid-19-cruise-ship

Called out is not the same as walking over and saying "you're shut down".
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