The cost of keeping Singapore squeaky clean • Hacker News Board

Re: The cost of keeping Singapore squeaky clean

#51

Post by kccqzy » Tue, Oct 30, 2018, 3:59 AM UTC

Sureai wrote: post #6

I am right now in Singapore for a visit and personally I don't have the feeling of a very clean city. There are some things that drive me crazy as a european. I went to a hawker with some Singaporeans and we got new disposable chopsticks for every dish. Wich means I ended up with three pairs of chopsticks. All plates were disposable. Either of plastic or styrofoam. Like in the article we didn't clean our trays, a cle…

Those trash ends up getting combusted to harvest their energy. After the energy content is extracted for electricity generation, the resulting ash is used to make new land.

Source: go visit Pulau Semakau where the waste-to-energy process takes place.

Re: The cost of keeping Singapore squeaky clean

#52

Post by vmlinuz » Tue, Oct 30, 2018, 4:03 AM UTC

philliphaydon wrote: post #43

p1mrx wrote: post #38

I once wandered around Singapore for a few days, and their infrastructure is mostly great, except that I never encountered a single drinking fountain. Not in the airport, train stations, shopping centers, food courts, public buildings... Does everyone buy/carry water every day, or how do they survive?

Singapore is (I think) the only country in Asia that you can drink water from a tap. But even so, people here still boil water before drinking it. So outside people will buy water even if a fountain was available.

The official line here in Hong Kong is that the mains water is clean and drinkable, but the plumbing between the mains and your tap may not be clean. The Water Supplies Department maintains a list[0] of residential and commercial buildings whose 'last-mile' water supply is regularly tested and found to be safe and clean.

Of course everyone still boils their water...

[0] https://www.wsd.gov.hk/en/core-businesses/water-quality/buil...

Re: The cost of keeping Singapore squeaky clean

#53

Post by jnaina » Tue, Oct 30, 2018, 4:04 AM UTC

tom_ wrote: post #13

maxxxxx wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

From what I have heard from people living there most people seem OK with it.

People that aren’t ok with it probably move away, or never move there in the first place. (But this is in principle self-balancing, so even if the people that live there are unrepresentative, perhaps it doesn’t matter.)

It's a full-on capitalistic, paternalistic, walled garden sort of society with some restrictions (strict gun and drug control, limited free speech, etc). If you want complete freedom (right to bear arms, shoot up drugs, spout any manner of speech, etc) Singapore is not for you. But if you are looking for safety, rule of law, good place to make money as a knowledge worker, and can tolerate some trade-offs in terms of freedom, it is a great place.

Re: The cost of keeping Singapore squeaky clean

#54

Post by sampo » Tue, Oct 30, 2018, 4:12 AM UTC

_0nac wrote: post #18

latch wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I lived in Singapore for a couple years and I can say that, at least as an expat, you hardly feel restrictions. Of the Singaporeans I know, locals from young to old, they all love it. Like all countries, it has its issues, but consider: - Freedom of religion particularly stands out - It has great and affordable health care - It's safe - Very easy to do business I could list more. Maybe freedom means something differe…

I suspect your sample size was heavily biased to your own social class. Singapore is ruthlessly capitalist, and can be a terrible place to be if you're poor or a foreign worker. One Straits Times (local Pravda) story I recall was about one of those old ladies who cleans up in hawker centres, earning on the order of S$100/month. This is way below a living wage, even in Singapore, and there's no state pension in Singap…

> Singapore is ruthlessly capitalist, and can be a terrible place to be if you're poor or a foreign worker.

Which Asian countries do you think have it better, in this respect, than Singapore?

Re: The cost of keeping Singapore squeaky clean

#55

Post by scythe » Tue, Oct 30, 2018, 4:15 AM UTC

>The aim wasn’t just to make the city more pleasant. A cleaner city, Lee Kuan Yew reasoned, would create a stronger economy.

>“These standards will keep morale high, sickness rate low, and so create the necessary social conditions for higher economic growth in industry and in tourism. [...]"

It's interesting that Singapore has, with this policy, become one of the very few unambiguously successful, unambiguously tropical countries. HK/Macao qualify, but historically had more support from their suzerains. Otherwise you've got, like, maybe Mauritius and Barbados. The desert oil nations would qualify, but their dryness prevents disease.

Re: The cost of keeping Singapore squeaky clean

#56

Post by sampo » Tue, Oct 30, 2018, 4:19 AM UTC

korantu wrote: post #50

echevil wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My guess is that it will be more sustainable than government that restrict much less freedoms - people carry guns, have drugs, piss on the streets, destroy public properties and do all kinds of creepy things and government can’t really do much about it. How is that more sustainable

The standard reply would be - if the government controls everything and gets corrupted - it has the power to corrupt everything. This is a worry - there is no feedback loop unless government makes sure it is. On the other hand, if current government really can't control who will be elected next, then there is less chance that current government abuses power. And having armed citizenry reduces chances of government go…

Do you think the other countries in the area are less corrupted than Singapore?

Re: The cost of keeping Singapore squeaky clean

#57

Post by latch » Tue, Oct 30, 2018, 4:22 AM UTC

philliphaydon wrote: post #43

p1mrx wrote: post #38

I once wandered around Singapore for a few days, and their infrastructure is mostly great, except that I never encountered a single drinking fountain. Not in the airport, train stations, shopping centers, food courts, public buildings... Does everyone buy/carry water every day, or how do they survive?

Singapore is (I think) the only country in Asia that you can drink water from a tap. But even so, people here still boil water before drinking it. So outside people will buy water even if a fountain was available.

Japan and South Korea tap water is safe...and I think it's commonly consumed in Japan. Koreans approach it like Singaporeans..some do, some boil.

Re: The cost of keeping Singapore squeaky clean

#58

Post by philliphaydon » Tue, Oct 30, 2018, 4:26 AM UTC

latch wrote: post #57

philliphaydon wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Singapore is (I think) the only country in Asia that you can drink water from a tap. But even so, people here still boil water before drinking it. So outside people will buy water even if a fountain was available.

Japan and South Korea tap water is safe...and I think it's commonly consumed in Japan. Koreans approach it like Singaporeans..some do, some boil.

I just googled and see Japan tape water is safe to drink. I've been by hotels in Tokyo, Kyoto, and Mt Fuji all told me not to drink the tap water. Hence I thought it wasn't drinkable. Good to know it is!

I've never been to South Korea, yet.

Re: The cost of keeping Singapore squeaky clean

#59

Post by Gigablah » Tue, Oct 30, 2018, 4:27 AM UTC

p1mrx wrote: post #38

I once wandered around Singapore for a few days, and their infrastructure is mostly great, except that I never encountered a single drinking fountain. Not in the airport, train stations, shopping centers, food courts, public buildings... Does everyone buy/carry water every day, or how do they survive?

There are drinking fountains in Changi Airport, you can find them at the piers. They’re rarer elsewhere (usually found at sports and recreation centers).

Re: The cost of keeping Singapore squeaky clean

#60

Post by jpatokal » Tue, Oct 30, 2018, 4:42 AM UTC

sampo wrote: post #54

_0nac wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I suspect your sample size was heavily biased to your own social class. Singapore is ruthlessly capitalist, and can be a terrible place to be if you're poor or a foreign worker. One Straits Times (local Pravda) story I recall was about one of those old ladies who cleans up in hawker centres, earning on the order of S$100/month. This is way below a living wage, even in Singapore, and there's no state pension in Singap…

> Singapore is ruthlessly capitalist, and can be a terrible place to be if you're poor or a foreign worker. Which Asian countries do you think have it better, in this respect, than Singapore?

Japan and Taiwan come to mind. What's kind of unique about Singapore in Asia is that it's very wealthy, yet its social safety net and worker protections are quite lacking.