Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

China's $1T Plan to Shake Up the Economic Order

nytimes.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

51–60 of 198 posts

Re: China's $1T Plan to Shake Up the Economic Order

#51

Post by fcanesin »

aaron-lebo wrote: post #45
thablackbull wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Those two aren't mutually exclusive. America is an incredibly protectionist country as well if you aren't aware. http://www.eulerhermes.com/economic-research/publications/Pa... In the past 3 years, America has introduced far more protectionist measures than other countries.

Is there any other source than that chart? I was looking for a supporting document to explain those figures but there's nothing apparently on that link besides that chart, which looks impressive but without context is as good as meaningless. edit: So Googling this, I came across this article, which agrees with the trends, but also notes: But the vast majority of the actions — 89 of the 145 — came in the form of anti-…

You can look at every request for retaliation and amendment on the WTO here: https://www.wto.org/english/tratop_e/dispu_e/dispu_status_e....

For example the US lost on subsidies for cotton and music intellectual properties infringement:

https://www.wto.org/english/tratop_e/dispu_e/cases_e/ds160_e...

https://www.wto.org/english/tratop_e/dispu_e/cases_e/ds267_e...

Re: China's $1T Plan to Shake Up the Economic Order

#52

Post by mrb »

"a difficult three-hour drive over potholed roles from the capital"

s/roles/roads/

Incidentally I have done this three-hour drive. Horrible indeed. The potholes limit your speed to 20-30 mph. I kept thinking on the way "what would really be the cost to repave a ~100-mile 2-lane road?" And "how high on this country's priority list would this be?"

Re: China's $1T Plan to Shake Up the Economic Order

#53

Post by matt_wulfeck »

propman wrote: post #48
thablackbull wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Those two aren't mutually exclusive. America is an incredibly protectionist country as well if you aren't aware. http://www.eulerhermes.com/economic-research/publications/Pa... In the past 3 years, America has introduced far more protectionist measures than other countries.

LOL nothing compared to China. China partners with startups, steals their IP and then escapes back to the homeland and no course of legal action. They get all the access to the West's markets and then give almost no access to their own. Their companies are all backed by the government and it's rigged in their favor. They cheat constantly, check out the EU scandal where they smuggle goods into London don't pay equal t…

China doesn't even allow its own citizens to read about things like the Tiananmen square massacre. If they could censor the rest of the world they would.

Even their citizens abroad will tow their party's line [0]

0. http://www.latimes.com/local/california/la-essential-educati...

Re: China's $1T Plan to Shake Up the Economic Order

#54

Post by kcanini »

nostromo wrote: post #22
hemantv wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

without IP these high margin American technology is copyable, which China has already shown they can do that.

American technology companies don't rely on IP restrictions as much as they used to. You couldn't copy Facebook, Google, Apple, or Amazon's products and services effectively on a global scale even if they had no IP restrictions. And China is the second largest market for American movies, which absolutely require IP law to function. So I think this concern is overstated.

China has shown that they are very adept at copying American high-tech innovation.

* Facebook: WeChat/Weibo

* Google: Baidu

* Apple: already being made in China, clones everywhere

* Amazon: Alibaba

Re: China's $1T Plan to Shake Up the Economic Order

#55

Post by chvid »

thablackbull wrote: post #26
Animats wrote: post #21

The "Belt and Road" scheme is well known. The first container freight train from Yiwu, China to Barking, England, arrived January 15, 2017. Coast to coast travel time: two weeks.[1] Conveniently, China uses a 4' 8.5" track gauge, unlike Russian metric gauge, so they can move freight cars all the way without a gauge change. Soon, of course, heavier rails, longer trains, faster trains, more trains, better gradients, mo…

To add to that, the SCMP newspaper just released a visual a couple days ago explaining various projects. The five main projects of the Belt and Road Initiative http://multimedia.scmp.com/news/china/article/One-Belt-One-R...

This is a very vice visual - thank you for that.

Re: China's $1T Plan to Shake Up the Economic Order

#56

Post by Cyph0n »

thablackbull wrote: post #26
Animats wrote: post #21

The "Belt and Road" scheme is well known. The first container freight train from Yiwu, China to Barking, England, arrived January 15, 2017. Coast to coast travel time: two weeks.[1] Conveniently, China uses a 4' 8.5" track gauge, unlike Russian metric gauge, so they can move freight cars all the way without a gauge change. Soon, of course, heavier rails, longer trains, faster trains, more trains, better gradients, mo…

To add to that, the SCMP newspaper just released a visual a couple days ago explaining various projects. The five main projects of the Belt and Road Initiative http://multimedia.scmp.com/news/china/article/One-Belt-One-R...

What an absolutely amazing project! The interactive explanation is pretty slick as well.

Re: China's $1T Plan to Shake Up the Economic Order

#57

Post by mschuster91 »

lumberjack wrote: post #50
chvid wrote: post #8

Bravo China. Instead of overspending on military conquer the world thru trade and investment.

I'm not sure this is all that much better for the countries that end up with their critical infrastructure in Chinese hands.

If any country ever has problems with relationship to China going way south, they can go the Chavez route and nationalize it.

Re: China's $1T Plan to Shake Up the Economic Order

#58

Post by Cyph0n »

Kholo wrote: post #11

I found this talk with Niall Ferguson and Samantha Power pretty fascinating about the US - China power balance changing. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=8yghOc-lMIM Just one mindblowing fact from the talk - China has poured more concrete in the last two years than the US in the last hundred.

Thank you for the link; Harvard Kennedy School talks and guest lectures are almost always a fascinating watch.

Shameless plug: the former president of Tunisia (my country) was invited for a talk there around a month ago[1].

[1]: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q1aviBRogZY

Re: China's $1T Plan to Shake Up the Economic Order

#59

Post by icantdrive55 »

propman wrote: post #48
thablackbull wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Those two aren't mutually exclusive. America is an incredibly protectionist country as well if you aren't aware. http://www.eulerhermes.com/economic-research/publications/Pa... In the past 3 years, America has introduced far more protectionist measures than other countries.

LOL nothing compared to China. China partners with startups, steals their IP and then escapes back to the homeland and no course of legal action. They get all the access to the West's markets and then give almost no access to their own. Their companies are all backed by the government and it's rigged in their favor. They cheat constantly, check out the EU scandal where they smuggle goods into London don't pay equal t…

"Oh--Yea, here's are land. Just make a phone call when you get home!"

Is it any wonder why people fell into Trump's blather?

I do give China credit. The government literally subsidizes (I believe) part of business shipping. The only reason Alibaba, or the the cousin something express hasen't decimated many of our markets is it takes over a month to ship.

Re: China's $1T Plan to Shake Up the Economic Order

#60

Post by petra »

Animats wrote: post #21

The "Belt and Road" scheme is well known. The first container freight train from Yiwu, China to Barking, England, arrived January 15, 2017. Coast to coast travel time: two weeks.[1] Conveniently, China uses a 4' 8.5" track gauge, unlike Russian metric gauge, so they can move freight cars all the way without a gauge change. Soon, of course, heavier rails, longer trains, faster trains, more trains, better gradients, mo…

With that timetable,compared to sea shipping we're talking about 3-5x faster time, but the cost will be about double - $8K-10K/container. But of course that saves money in warehousing and financing. So financially, today it makes sense for the more expensive goods, at $1.5M per container. And it's best because there's not a lot of capacity vs sea routes.

But i wonder: could those prices, with more/better trains etc, become close to sea shipping, such that aliexpress, which is extremely cheap but uses very slow sea shipping, start using rail ?

Because at those timelines, even if using a local fulfillment center, the storage period is very short, so the cost becomes quite low, and without lots of trouble, suddenly aliexpress can offer much cheaper goods than Amazon, all across Europe, with fast shipping. Heck, they may not even need to build warehouses, using uber like warehouse model(i.e. flexe).

Post reply on HN