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China issues demolition order on world’s largest religious town in Tibet

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Re: China issues demolition order on world’s largest religious town in Tibet

#51

Post by jacquesm »

xiaoma wrote: post #50
jacquesm wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Cut off trade with China? That would definitely be an interesting experiment. I suspect prices would rise slightly and we'd find out just how dependent we really are. After a week or two there would be a joint statement of the leaders of the Western World that they have unanimously decided to support the Chinese action, in fact they'll come to help to cart rubble personally.

I'm not sure I follow your reasoning... are you implying that trade with China is more important for the entire western world than international trade with the all the west is to China? I could certainly see leaders in certain countries such as France who have been actively selling weaponry to China going "to help cart the rubble personally" but there's no way Obama or his next successor would do that.

> are you implying that trade with China is more important for the entire western world than international trade with the all the west is to China?

Yes, we are utterly co-dependent at this point in time.

Cutting trade with China would take a decade or more if it can be done at all at this stage.

Re: China issues demolition order on world’s largest religious town in Tibet

#52

Post by golergka »

gakada wrote: post #49
golergka wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If it's a choice between your human rights and someone else's life — obviously. Also, "fight back in a wrong way" is a very curious way to label brutal attacks targeting civilians that go on non-stop for the last hundred years — long before any of alleged grievances that you would be "fighting back" against even began.

The standard you are applying is pacifism: do not use violence even if violence is being used on you.

No. Use violence if it can lead to less net violence — this is my standard. Terror acts are a direct opposite of this.

Re: China issues demolition order on world’s largest religious town in Tibet

#53

Post by snnn »

sintaxi wrote: post #48
gumby wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

China is the colonial power; that's all the authority required. Note that China did the same to the Han majority as well, for example in the destruction of the Hutongs in the major cities such Beijing this century, not to mention the destruction of the temples 70 years ago during the communist revolution. When I read this context-free article all I could think of was Henry VIII's destruction and confiscation of the m…

Ah ok, thanks. What is China's motivation for removing these villages?

Avoid crowds.No crowds, No protests. Every year, more than 10k people are gathered at there on special days.

Re: China issues demolition order on world’s largest religious town in Tibet

#54

Post by snnn »

tremon wrote: post #14
mhuffman wrote: post #4

Wow! It is amazing that we do not consider this a human rights violation. Oh well, gotta keep them prices low at Walmart!

But we do consider this a human rights violation, we have been considering it for 30 years: https://www.hrw.org/news/2000/06/13/human-rights-violations-...

And the solution was recruiting Tibetan from their homeland to U.S. and get them trained by CIA, send them back for fighting? It sounds so similar with what ISIS is doing.

Re: China issues demolition order on world’s largest religious town in Tibet

#55

Post by douche »

dave2000 wrote: post #31
auganov wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn't that the nature of almost every conflict with an ethnic context? If there's no clear weaker and stronger you usually end up with two independent states. The way Tibet was Incorporated into China, the nature of the Tibetan resistance, the way China governs Tibet, the reason China wants Tibet, the reason China represses Tibetans are all very very different from what's happening in Judea and Samaria. The Israeli A…

No, it's perfectly meaningful to talk about Israel/Palestine - and by extension the US - when criticizing actions by China. Otherwise you end up with the same narrative you get in pretty much every media outlet in the world; whatever the US does is good, no terrorism or support for murderous dictators there (cough south america..cuba...saudi arabia..iran...iraq...indonesia etc etc etc ), and whatever China does is ba…

China and Tibet is more like what would have happened if the Arab Legion and the other Arab powers weren't so blindingly incompetent in 1947.

There's a long, long history of China controlling Tibet, back at least to the Tang dynasty. The ChiComs are nastier about it than most of the previous Chinese governments, but that's what you get when you refute the old mandate of heaven/chakravartin mashup of political legitimacy espoused by the old empire for ... what justification do the ChiComs give for their political legitimacy? Having the biggest boot and the willingness to murder millions and imprison more, I suppose.

Re: China issues demolition order on world’s largest religious town in Tibet

#56

Post by sebastianconcpt »

kweks wrote: post #29

I was there literally three days ago. The place is nothing short of breathtaking. Nestled at 4200km, it was a three day motorbike ride from Chengdu. Even at its foothills, you have no concept of the scale of the town hiding in the hills. This will truly be a tragic loss - the town is much more than the 'slum' it is represented as - it's arguably the most important Buddhist learning institution in the world.. Photos f…

Geez... thanks for sharing

Re: China issues demolition order on world’s largest religious town in Tibet

#57

Post by flubar »

bhouston wrote: post #20
mhuffman wrote: post #4

Wow! It is amazing that we do not consider this a human rights violation. Oh well, gotta keep them prices low at Walmart!

China : Tibet :: Israel : Palestine, they are analogous in many ways. The human rights groups talk about the problems, we recognize it is bad, the weaker ethnic community suffers and is oppressed, the more powerful ethnic group makes slow but steady progress in exerting its wishes, and no real changes are effected by the international community.

We need generalisations to make sense of the world around us, but they always come at a cost of accuracy. Sometimes, the loss of accuracy is so great that the generalization does more harm than good. I think trying to equate the causes and possible solutions of this situation with the Israel-Palestine situation is one such example.

Re: China issues demolition order on world’s largest religious town in Tibet

#58

Post by mac01021 »

kweks wrote: post #29

I was there literally three days ago. The place is nothing short of breathtaking. Nestled at 4200km, it was a three day motorbike ride from Chengdu. Even at its foothills, you have no concept of the scale of the town hiding in the hills. This will truly be a tragic loss - the town is much more than the 'slum' it is represented as - it's arguably the most important Buddhist learning institution in the world.. Photos f…

Assuming most of those little structures are inhabited, how does this city sustain itself? The land around it does not appear to be cultivated, and there does not appear to be much of a commercial area. That's a lot of people to feed.

Re: China issues demolition order on world’s largest religious town in Tibet

#59

Post by zyngaro »

yompers888 wrote: post #45
bhouston wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

China : Tibet :: Israel : Palestine, they are analogous in many ways. The human rights groups talk about the problems, we recognize it is bad, the weaker ethnic community suffers and is oppressed, the more powerful ethnic group makes slow but steady progress in exerting its wishes, and no real changes are effected by the international community.

Doesn't Tibet lack a certain penchant for poorly aimed rockets and human shields in a way that detracts from this analogy?

Sure and Tibetans are not packed in open air prisons and deprived of any rights whatsoever either.

Re: China issues demolition order on world’s largest religious town in Tibet

#60

Post by kweks »

mac01021 wrote: post #58
kweks wrote: post #29

I was there literally three days ago. The place is nothing short of breathtaking. Nestled at 4200km, it was a three day motorbike ride from Chengdu. Even at its foothills, you have no concept of the scale of the town hiding in the hills. This will truly be a tragic loss - the town is much more than the 'slum' it is represented as - it's arguably the most important Buddhist learning institution in the world.. Photos f…

Assuming most of those little structures are inhabited, how does this city sustain itself? The land around it does not appear to be cultivated, and there does not appear to be much of a commercial area. That's a lot of people to feed.

Whilst the town itself is built in the upper saddle of a hill, the valley itself is fecund and wide, with many farms.

I would assume that most supplies are brought in..

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