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America's High School Graduates Look Like Other Countries' High School Dropouts

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Re: America's High School Graduates Look Like Other Countries' High School Dropouts

#51

Post by mikeyouse »

esaym wrote: post #32

I don't expect the public school system to teach my children anything. Hence why they won't be attending. Most of the schools I attended growing up were completely useless. Filthy, full of drugs and gangs. Sadly I even listened to some of my teachers more than I did my own parents (indoctrination) which I now see lead me down the wrong path. I don't expect the public school to teach my kids any kind of career skills…

Many public schools are just fine, if not excellent.. Something like 90% of my 300-student graduating class ended up in college, several dozen at Ivys or "near-Ivy" schools. We had intensive programming classes and maybe 15 or 20 AP options. This was just a random upper middle class district in the Midwest, we were rarely on the list of the 100-best schools in the state.

Re: America's High School Graduates Look Like Other Countries' High School Dropouts

#52

Post by epicureanideal »

esaym wrote: post #32

I don't expect the public school system to teach my children anything. Hence why they won't be attending. Most of the schools I attended growing up were completely useless. Filthy, full of drugs and gangs. Sadly I even listened to some of my teachers more than I did my own parents (indoctrination) which I now see lead me down the wrong path. I don't expect the public school to teach my kids any kind of career skills…

I have a similar plan. I'd like to hear more about yours. My email is in my profile temporarily. Please get in touch.

Re: America's High School Graduates Look Like Other Countries' High School Dropouts

#53

Post by mattmanser »

awakeasleep wrote: post #49
mattmanser wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You want your children to become programmers like you? Not one of the thousands of other jobs? You want to force them to be mini-esayms without their own minds? You don't want them to make friends, socialize, network with their peers? To explore their own wants and desires in the safety of a school without your constant disapproval? You want them to spend their 20s in counselling complaining about their bizarre dad w…

You're imagining a world where people go to college and find high paying jobs after following their dream without their parents holding them back. That is actually a marketing story, dangerous and unrealistic to believe. Esaym is talking about teaching his kids a real skill they can use. It certainly won't override their ability to learn and persue things- it'll actually make that possible . It'll enable them to make…

Wake-up call, we're a community of programmers and contrary to our echo-chamber, programming is 1 skill of the thousands which make money.

I know a range of different people, none of them are programmers. Do you think only programmers make money?

I am actually shocked and disgusted by his idea of parenting. He wants to isolate them from other children and teach them one skill instead of letting them learn a range and choose.

Re-read what he said, he wants to exclude them from school and get them to work on his business from the age of 13.

I don't expect the public school system to teach my children anything. Hence why they won't be attending.

I fully expect to start "outsourcing" my web dev work to my children when they are 13.

Re: America's High School Graduates Look Like Other Countries' High School Dropouts

#54

Post by s_m_t »

esaym wrote: post #32

I don't expect the public school system to teach my children anything. Hence why they won't be attending. Most of the schools I attended growing up were completely useless. Filthy, full of drugs and gangs. Sadly I even listened to some of my teachers more than I did my own parents (indoctrination) which I now see lead me down the wrong path. I don't expect the public school to teach my kids any kind of career skills…

Adopt me and I'll undercut your children for $50/hr.

Re: America's High School Graduates Look Like Other Countries' High School Dropouts

#55

Post by tryitnow »

esaym wrote: post #32

I don't expect the public school system to teach my children anything. Hence why they won't be attending. Most of the schools I attended growing up were completely useless. Filthy, full of drugs and gangs. Sadly I even listened to some of my teachers more than I did my own parents (indoctrination) which I now see lead me down the wrong path. I don't expect the public school to teach my kids any kind of career skills…

Why don't you just move to a nicer neighborhood that has nicer schools?

And have you managed 13 year olds?

I'm sure they will be well-incentivized at $60/hr., the question is whether you will have an incentive to put up with them.

Re: America's High School Graduates Look Like Other Countries' High School Dropouts

#56

Post by zemvpferreira »

s_m_t wrote: post #54
esaym wrote: post #32

I don't expect the public school system to teach my children anything. Hence why they won't be attending. Most of the schools I attended growing up were completely useless. Filthy, full of drugs and gangs. Sadly I even listened to some of my teachers more than I did my own parents (indoctrination) which I now see lead me down the wrong path. I don't expect the public school to teach my kids any kind of career skills…

Adopt me and I'll undercut your children for $50/hr.

I'm overseas and happy to do it for only $40/hour if I can be adopted remotely.

Re: America's High School Graduates Look Like Other Countries' High School Dropouts

#57

Post by EvanPlaice »

chatmasta wrote: post #36
hn9780470248775 wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It's the top of the bell curve that matters. I think that this attitude has gotten us into a pretty big mess.

You can't force somebody to learn.

But you can sure as hell discourage/demotivate them by standardizing all classes into a game of 'guess the question', all work into mechanical problem solving, and all tests into multiple-choice bubble filling.

The first class where I experienced true critical thinking was 10th grade English. By a teacher who was ejected the next semester for giving the school jocks a hard time when they acted up in class.

I had the luck and very good fortune to get out of public school and attend a boarding school on a fully funded scholarship.

In my earlier years I went from Minnesota where they were experimenting with teaching algebra to 4th grade students who tested high on intelligence assessments, and where we were practicing basic physics in Science class in 6th grade.

To Colorado, where my school didn't even teach Science and we spent most of the day screwing around and playing card games. Middle school was light on content and dominated by a culture of bullying/bullies. High school was all about 'getting into college' and bullying was replaced with popularity contests and jocks.

Ironically, I took all useful classes where I learned skills that I've used a lot since. Metal Shop, Wood Shop, Graphic Arts, and Computer Programming. All of the shop, graphics, architecture classes were on the chopping block despite the school having 5 baseball teams 3 softball teams, the 3 usual football teams, a state-winning marching band, and many teams for various other sports including tennis, volleyball, soccer, basketball, etc...

Re: America's High School Graduates Look Like Other Countries' High School Dropouts

#58

Post by chejazi »

esaym wrote: post #32

I don't expect the public school system to teach my children anything. Hence why they won't be attending. Most of the schools I attended growing up were completely useless. Filthy, full of drugs and gangs. Sadly I even listened to some of my teachers more than I did my own parents (indoctrination) which I now see lead me down the wrong path. I don't expect the public school to teach my kids any kind of career skills…

Public schools aren't the greatest when it comes to accelerating social mobility - a lot of my graduating class is still in my hometown. If you can afford it, a private school will put you on a more focused track to success.

Still, plenty of people make it through and go on to achieve great things. Plus, they are grounded in the realities of what is commonly referred to as the 99%

Re: America's High School Graduates Look Like Other Countries' High School Dropouts

#59

Post by icebraining »

Houshalter wrote: post #39
Cookingboy wrote: post #12

And in this age of information and technology, many of these people are voting to decide the next leader of the only superpower left on Earth. This may sound grossly elitist, but democracy can be super scary sometimes.

Democracy is a really shitty form of government. It prevents tyrants, and it prevents a single party from holding power for too long. Which are great benefits over, e.g. monarchies. But the average voter isn't informed enough to really understand all the issues. So who wins isn't really correlated with who is best or who is right. In my ideal form of government, the representatives would not be elected, but randomly…

That reminds of this excerpt:

“For the last century, almost all top political appointments [on the planet Earth] had been made by random computer selection from the pool of individuals who had the necessary qualifications. It had taken the human race several thousand years to realize that there were some jobs that should never be given to the people who volunteered for them, especially if they showed too much enthusiasm. As one shrewed political commentator had remarked: “We want a President who has to be carried screaming and kicking into the White House — but will then do the best job he possibly can, so that he’ll get time off for good behavior.”

― Arthur C. Clarke, Imperial Earth

Re: America's High School Graduates Look Like Other Countries' High School Dropouts

#60

Post by 2muchcoffeeman »

mattmanser wrote: post #53
awakeasleep wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're imagining a world where people go to college and find high paying jobs after following their dream without their parents holding them back. That is actually a marketing story, dangerous and unrealistic to believe. Esaym is talking about teaching his kids a real skill they can use. It certainly won't override their ability to learn and persue things- it'll actually make that possible . It'll enable them to make…

Wake-up call, we're a community of programmers and contrary to our echo-chamber, programming is 1 skill of the thousands which make money. I know a range of different people, none of them are programmers. Do you think only programmers make money? I am actually shocked and disgusted by his idea of parenting. He wants to isolate them from other children and teach them one skill instead of letting them learn a range and…

Well, if the US school system is that bad, I'd expect rather extreme solutions to emerge. His plan could be perfectly rational for his situation.
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