Remote-first work is taking over the rich world – research hints at why • Hacker News Board

Re: Remote-first work is taking over the rich world – research hints at why

#481

Post by causehealth101 » Sat, Oct 30, 2021, 8:16 PM UTC

borski wrote: post #429

znpy wrote: post #420

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I just want to point out that reading rudeness in that comment is your own choice, my intent was really a suggestion. Rudeness here is in the eyes of those who call it that.

You responded to someone describing their experience with an aggressive “just do it and don’t bother people fine with wfh,” implying that the poster was somehow trying to encroach on your ability to WFH. They never said that. You even express your frustration directly in a sibling comment below. Pretending your comment wasn’t rude, especially after elsewhere expressing your explicit frustration, is only half-true at…

"Encroach on your ability to WFH" - you perfectly summed up the reason for the vitriol from remote-only people, IMO:

They are fearful that people with your stance will give companies a better argument for less remote-work. It's one thing when executives talk about it, because they're "not on the ground" and "just want control" or "don't understand individual contributors", but when peers like you support non-100% remote, it's a real worrisome prospect for them.

Re: Remote-first work is taking over the rich world – research hints at why

#482

Post by wirrbel » Sun, Oct 31, 2021, 9:22 AM UTC

znpy wrote: post #414

wirrbel wrote: post #410

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Stop bullshitting. As a parent the dynamics are totally different especially with Covid measures still in place. My child has not been to pre school for 4 weeks due to sickness and daycare group being closed because of Covid incident. And that must be like the 4th month within this year. It’s hard to maintain any routine in this ever changing emergency.

No you stop bullshitting. The problem you lament are due to covid, not due to wfh. And covid it's not an incident, its a f-ing global pandemic.

so what do you suggest, that the person you were replying to just stop the pandemic?

Re: Remote-first work is taking over the rich world – research hints at why

#483

Post by rajnathani » Sun, Oct 31, 2021, 11:06 AM UTC

lend000 wrote: post #169

Not mentioned enough on this topic: not all engineers are software engineers and not all software engineers never need to touch hardware. If you plan to work on/with web frameworks, advertisements, data science, or pure CS topics for your whole career, then there's probably no excuse to force you to come into the office 5 days a week. But good luck doing that as a software engineer at a company like SpaceX, Tesla, In…

This isn't true.

There are sibling comments here that mention the same, however, to add my own point here: I'm involved in a complex hardware plus software project which involves designing and doing a board bring-up for an Arm SoC Linux-based device. We need to visit the office only once in two to three weeks. For the board bring-up when we do not have the provision to provide the hardware to our software engineer yet, we have someone in the office connect the UART lines to it and have the typical VPN+SSH set up to perform the board bring-up for it.

Generally speaking, the engineers that are required for the labs would be electrical engineers and mechanical engineers. Also, even for these physical-based engineering disciplines, a lot of design is highly computer based thanks to great CAD, simulation, and future-looking generative design software from the likes of Autodesk, Ansys, etc. That being said, I personally feel that being in person really can help in the epiphany process for hardware-based projects.

Re: Remote-first work is taking over the rich world – research hints at why

#484

Post by borski » Sun, Oct 31, 2021, 4:53 PM UTC

causehealth101 wrote: post #481

borski wrote: post #429

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You responded to someone describing their experience with an aggressive “just do it and don’t bother people fine with wfh,” implying that the poster was somehow trying to encroach on your ability to WFH. They never said that. You even express your frustration directly in a sibling comment below. Pretending your comment wasn’t rude, especially after elsewhere expressing your explicit frustration, is only half-true at…

"Encroach on your ability to WFH" - you perfectly summed up the reason for the vitriol from remote-only people, IMO: They are fearful that people with your stance will give companies a better argument for less remote-work. It's one thing when executives talk about it, because they're "not on the ground" and "just want control" or "don't understand individual contributors", but when peers like you support non-100% rem…

Sure, but it’s also a worrisome prospect for those that have had serious issues with WFH for a company to decide to go all-remote. Still doesn’t give them the right to be assholes. :)

Re: Remote-first work is taking over the rich world – research hints at why

#485

Post by gaws » Mon, Nov 01, 2021, 11:41 PM UTC

evenhovercraft wrote: post #349

Very grateful that my employer has committed to remaining flexible with remote work. Full time in the office, hybrid, or full time remote. It’s up to the individual. Full time remote has done wonders for my health - instead of a 2 hour commute I get to exercise. Instead of coming home stressed, annoyed, and sitting in front of the TV, I go outside for a solid hour+ after I close my laptop. I travel more liberally now…

> Very grateful that my employer has committed to remaining flexible with remote work. Full time in the office, hybrid, or full time remote. It’s up to the individual.

imagine working for an employer that treats you like a human being.

Re: Remote-first work is taking over the rich world – research hints at why

#486

Post by maigret » Tue, Nov 02, 2021, 7:39 AM UTC

lmm wrote: post #158

EMM_386 wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Engineers on HN seem to be incapable of considering that the social aspect of work is important to most non-introvert non-engineers in an office and that a lot of "work" is forming bonds, developing relationships, and yes, "playing politics" to some extent. I do this all day in private Slack communications, 1-1 video conferences, and everything else. This "watercooler effect" myth may seem important to some, but I…

> This "watercooler effect" myth may seem important to some, but I know my team members closely because I am talking to them all day, whether we're staring at each other face to face or not. I already know their kids are in college, or the sports teams they are interested in, or the typical company rumor mill. That doesn't just happen. I'm glad your company/team has apparently figured it out; mine certainly hasn't.

Think about how you can make it happen directly around you, don't wait for "the company" to get it - be the agent that propagates it. If you spend the time and the energy to make it happen at least with your direct network, you'll create a competitive advantage for yourself, your team, and get a valuable set of skills.

Re: Remote-first work is taking over the rich world – research hints at why

#487

Post by sam0x17 » Fri, Nov 12, 2021, 4:41 PM UTC

tablespoon wrote: post #446

Sodman wrote: post #438

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Conversely, other people are annoyed with "selfish" people forcing what could otherwise be a productive in-person meeting to now need to include one person dialed in over zoom, perhaps without a video feed. Hope you weren't planning on collaborating using physical media such as whiteboard or post-it notes. Obviously we can do our best to reduce unnecessary meetings, but for those remaining necessary meetings, an in-p…

> Conversely, other people are annoyed with "selfish" people forcing what could otherwise be a productive in-person meeting to now need to include one person dialed in over zoom, perhaps without a video feed. That's actually a good point. Conference speakerphones are garbage, so once one needed person is remote, everyone has to dial in. The experience is really only workable if everyone is using a headset. > in-offic…

I find it hilarious that people think there is still justification for an expense as large as office real estate / office rent, when the non-biased peer-reviewed studies all show a 15-20% productivity gain from WFH anyway. So what, you want to spend way more to be less productive? Offices are dead. Wouldn't want to be whatever idiot apple exec just commissioned their new campus. Useless real estate. Dollar value of $0.