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USB-C is about to go from 100W to 240W, enough to power beefier laptops

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Re: USB-C is about to go from 100W to 240W, enough to power beefier laptops

#481

Post by detaro »

TazeTSchnitzel wrote: post #480
Ekaros wrote: post #281

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wouldn't ATX power supply outputting USB-C make more sense? They have superior efficiency against your average power supplies...

I guess an ATX power supply accepting 240W USB-C, which is 12V, would only do a tiny bit of DC-to-DC conversion for 5V and 3.3V, passing through the rest as 12V. And an ATX12VO power supply taking in USB-C would do… nothing? Heh.

240W USB-C will be 48 V (the current limit is 5A as it is in the current up-to-100W spec, just the voltage max goes from 20 V to 48 V)

Re: USB-C is about to go from 100W to 240W, enough to power beefier laptops

#482

Post by ev1 »

texasbigdata wrote: post #381
ev1 wrote: post #156

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The most "fully featured" cable with a USB-C tip is often like <0.5m long.

And $40+. Buying a long one for a music recording interface (that sweet sweet I/O) was super painful. I guess it's cheaper now but in what world is a $50 cable to power an accessory reasonable in any way. Source: https://www.sweetwater.com/c1225--Thunderbolt_Cables

It's kind of funny when (pre-covid) at the office people would point out my dock TB/USBC connector and how thick it was.

It carries probably 100W+ for power, multiple 4K displays, ethernet, half a dozen USB3 ports... I'd rather it not be the thickness of a 5W charging cable.

Re: USB-C is about to go from 100W to 240W, enough to power beefier laptops

#483

Post by Dylan16807 »

Klinky wrote: post #415
Dylan16807 wrote: post #408

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That sounds like two markings, not too hard. Also there are no power ratings below 60W, and I don't think "no data" is a valid cable.

USB-PD supports 5, 9, 15 or 20v at between 0 - 5 amps. Higher power typically needs a thicker gauge wire. There are definitely "charge-only" cables being marketed. Two markings with each having multiple variations. You will have a dozen plus combinations, that will only get more complex.

> USB-PD supports 5, 9, 15 or 20v at between 0 - 5 amps. Higher power typically needs a thicker gauge wire.

Every voltage below 20 maxes out at 3 amps. As far as cables go, 60 is the minimum watts supported.

> There are definitely "charge-only" cables being marketed.

Are they valid though?

> Two markings with each having multiple variations. You will have a dozen plus combinations, that will only get more complex.

I don't really care how many combos there are. I won't need most of them. Most of the time I just want speed or power, sometimes I want both, and it's always a minimum requirement rather than anything specific.

Re: USB-C is about to go from 100W to 240W, enough to power beefier laptops

#484

Post by shepherdjerred »

asdff wrote: post #163
shepherdjerred wrote: post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For most users the M1 is fast enough that a nicer user experience (no fan noise) is more worthwhile than slightly better performance. My friend recently purchased a MacBook Air with M1. There's no fan at all. It's incredible. It's a block of metal that just works.

I think most users would at least appreciate the option. For example, windows has power settings where you can adjust the clock of the CPU to however you like when plugged in or unplugged. Consider also that gaming has never been a silent prospect, on a desktop, or a laptop, and especially a game console. The switch is silent, but gamers know nintendo is compromising on graphics fidelity compared to competitors to ma…

I think you're right, but it's not in Apple's ethos. As an example see the Apple Magic Wireless mouse that has its charging port on the bottom specifically because Jobs didn't want users to ever use it as a wired mouse.

Re: USB-C is about to go from 100W to 240W, enough to power beefier laptops

#485

Post by dzhiurgis »

chx wrote: post #330
dzhiurgis wrote: post #311

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But what does universal shape of connector has to do with? Power negotiation applies to USB-A just as it does with USB-C... (I think)

> Power negotiation applies to USB-A Nope it doesn't.

Which is why there's more fires with usb-a

Re: USB-C is about to go from 100W to 240W, enough to power beefier laptops

#486

Post by Klinky »

Dylan16807 wrote: post #483
Klinky wrote: post #415

Earlier quoted context omitted.

USB-PD supports 5, 9, 15 or 20v at between 0 - 5 amps. Higher power typically needs a thicker gauge wire. There are definitely "charge-only" cables being marketed. Two markings with each having multiple variations. You will have a dozen plus combinations, that will only get more complex.

> USB-PD supports 5, 9, 15 or 20v at between 0 - 5 amps. Higher power typically needs a thicker gauge wire. Every voltage below 20 maxes out at 3 amps. As far as cables go, 60 is the minimum watts supported. > There are definitely "charge-only" cables being marketed. Are they valid though? > Two markings with each having multiple variations. You will have a dozen plus combinations, that will only get more complex. I…

>Every voltage below 20 maxes out at 3 amps. As far as cables go, 60 is the minimum watts supported.

Perhaps for PD 2.0/3.0 but there is also legacy USB PD 1.0 and USB-C BC. During that era I believe 1.5A was minimum.

>Are they valid though?

Probably not, looks like USB 2.0 data is minimum required.

>I don't really care how many combos there are. I won't need most of them.

Just because you don't need specific combinations, doesn't mean you won't have to wade through all possible combinations to find the cable you're looking for.

Re: USB-C is about to go from 100W to 240W, enough to power beefier laptops

#487

Post by protomyth »

texaswhizzle wrote: post #456
protomyth wrote: post #349

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wait until you have to do tech support for someone who has a USB-C charging cable that doesn't work connecting their hard drive. Singular cable wasn't in the specs.

I’ll take that hypothetical problem over what we had in the past. A dozen different plugs, a dozen different cables, multiple required docks, incompatible charging bricks, proprietary plugs, and more. I have yet to come across an issue with USB-C either personally or externally. But maybe some day it will happen. And I still won’t care because it’s better than it used to be.

hypothetical problem

No, just another day in IT. I'm hoping they get their crap together eventually.

Re: USB-C is about to go from 100W to 240W, enough to power beefier laptops

#488

Post by sgtnoodle »

TheSpiceIsLife wrote: post #438
vokep wrote: post #302

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unless I'm mistaken, there is a license to call a port a USB port, though goods are commonly sold without that. In theory the solution is simple: only buy products that have the actual USB logo and ensure certification, and the USB-IF should retain the right to significantly fine any manufacturer advertising being to spec and using the logo who is in fact not. In practice, people aren't going to stop buying nintendo…

One solution could be to require different connectors for different protocols and power delivery. I'm beginning to suspect The Great Filter is Jony Ive's minimalist design influence: any sufficiently advanced culture will annihilate itself before it discovers interstellar travel when someone connects two devices together that aren't compatible with the equivalent of a One True Connector™ USB cable.

I like to imagine there's an alien species zipping around in FTL space ships, and the only difference from us is they picked one endianness and ran with it.

Re: USB-C is about to go from 100W to 240W, enough to power beefier laptops

#489

Post by TazeTSchnitzel »

detaro wrote: post #481
TazeTSchnitzel wrote: post #480

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I guess an ATX power supply accepting 240W USB-C, which is 12V, would only do a tiny bit of DC-to-DC conversion for 5V and 3.3V, passing through the rest as 12V. And an ATX12VO power supply taking in USB-C would do… nothing? Heh.

240W USB-C will be 48 V (the current limit is 5A as it is in the current up-to-100W spec, just the voltage max goes from 20 V to 48 V)

Ah sorry you're right, I don't know why I thought 12V.
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