Who makes the most reliable new cars? • Hacker News Board

Re: Who makes the most reliable new cars?

#471

Post by nickpeterson » Thu, Nov 30, 2023, 1:58 AM UTC

mplewis wrote: post #253

mkii wrote: post #225

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is it truly mysterious though? I find it interesting whenever HN has a strong fascination with all things related to "Japanese-ness". For example, there have been links to wikipedia pages of some Japanese term, and it will make front page with comments. I can't think of any other nation that has this kind of cultural representation on here. And yet, the myth of Japanese "uniqueness" is largely the product of Japanese…

Indeed! I recently learned about an aspect of this which is named and tied to national brand strategy: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cool_Japan

I feel like China could really gain by taking a page or two from this playbook.

Re: Who makes the most reliable new cars?

#472

Post by thsksbd » Thu, Nov 30, 2023, 1:59 AM UTC

giobox wrote: post #350

Syonyk wrote: post #196

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A standard hybrid (of the sort that a range of companies make, handwavingly a parallel hybrid with creep capability, which a PHEV is just a supersized version of) eliminates a huge swath of things that go wrong with ICEs. First and foremost, the transmission replaces the rather staggering pile of complexity of a modern automatic transmission, typically, with "a few motor/generators, some planetary gears, maybe a band…

> "First and foremost, the transmission replaces the rather staggering pile of complexity of a modern automatic transmission, typically, with "a few motor/generators, some planetary gears, maybe a band that only engages when a motor is already stopped, and some power electronics." Compared to the 9+ speed automatics, this is dramatically simpler. Quite a few hybrids don't even have a mechanical reverse gear, it's jus…

"There are very few PHEVs that aren't using the same automatic gearbox as the plain-ole ICE model."

Except the most popular hybrid, the prius, which admittedly does t have a non/hybrid counterpart because it was done from the ground up to avoid unnecessary legacy technology

Re: Who makes the most reliable new cars?

#473

Post by kyrra » Thu, Nov 30, 2023, 2:00 AM UTC

yaomtc wrote: post #231

sharkweek wrote: post #213

My 3rd Gen Toyota 4Runner is old enough to drink and outside of routine maintenance requires almost no thought. "It's time to get a new car" given that car safety has drastically improved and I have two younger kids in that thing a few times a week but I'm honestly having a really hard time giving it up, something so reliable and plainly functional. New cars with all their computers and smart technology only look lik…

> car safety has drastically improved Safety between cars, and within cars, has improved. However, due to the increasing size of the average vehicle on the road, among other factors, car safety for pedestrians/cyclists has decreased. https://www.npr.org/2023/06/26/1184034017/us-pedestrian-deat...

As a reminder, the increase of vehicle size has little to do with consumer choice but rather fuel efficiency standards.

https://www.resources.org/common-resources/how-much-do-regul...

Increasing fuel efficiency standards has outsized impact on the price of small cars, so fewer of them are made.

Re: Who makes the most reliable new cars?

#474

Post by hedgehog » Thu, Nov 30, 2023, 2:00 AM UTC

davidthewatson wrote: post #48

The paradox is that hybrids have MORE potential trouble areas than ICE but less reported trouble. All hail McLuhan.

I spent some time looking at this and it depends which hybrid, there is quite a bit of variation in drivetrains even within manufacturers. As sibling comment [1] describes the planetary gear arrangement in most Toyotas is quite simple compared to a normal automatic transmission, and the traction motor/generator replaces both the starter motor and alternator that a plain ICE engine would have. At the same time the hybrid system makes gentler use of the gas engine and brakes so even though they are mechanically near identical to the ICE model they will probably last a lot longer.

Re: Who makes the most reliable new cars?

#475

Post by riku_iki » Thu, Nov 30, 2023, 2:01 AM UTC

jancsika wrote: post #256

laurencerowe wrote: post #199

Note that these stats only account for reliability in the first three years: > Then the brand reliability score was calculated by averaging results from 2021 to 2023. As someone who usually buys ~10 year old cars and drives them into the ground I'm much more interested in long term reliability. It may correlate but these stats are not that!

> As someone who usually buys ~10 year old cars and drives them into the ground I'm much more interested in long term reliability. That's a much simpler list: 1: Toyota Corolla 2 to end: you're not really serious about running it into the ground. :)

I thought hybrid powertrains are simpler and more reliable in long run, so prius should be #1.

Re: Who makes the most reliable new cars?

#476

Post by artificialLimbs » Thu, Nov 30, 2023, 2:01 AM UTC

helij wrote: post #310

nerdponx wrote: post #267

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think that market has already developed. Look at prices for used cars from that time period.

They will outlaw them soon enough and good riddance. Whenever I drive behind one of these older cars they usually stink.

You might like to push the recirculate button/lever when that happens.

Re: Who makes the most reliable new cars?

#477

Post by Vecr » Thu, Nov 30, 2023, 2:01 AM UTC

Waterluvian wrote: post #450

Interesting to see Lexus, Toyota and Honda, Acura. Are they meaningfully different or just different badges of the same company?

Toyota is Lexus and Honda is Acura but they all are not the same company.

Re: Who makes the most reliable new cars?

#478

Post by thsksbd » Thu, Nov 30, 2023, 2:02 AM UTC

hintymad wrote: post #181

Toyota is amazing for making reliable cars but writing truly shitty code. IIRC, a lawsuit a few years ago about Toyota's faulty brake system revealed that Toyota engineers cramped tens of thousands of lines in a single file and the lines freely update hundreds of global variables. It's also interesting that Japanese companies follow ISO this and CMM that yet they develop slowly and produce shitty software services ev…

Is it bad though? One giant loop and conditional forward jumps is not that bad for control systems. I think Cormack had a take similar to that.

Re: Who makes the most reliable new cars?

#479

Post by bane » Thu, Nov 30, 2023, 2:02 AM UTC

SkyPuncher wrote: post #346

sharkweek wrote: post #213

My 3rd Gen Toyota 4Runner is old enough to drink and outside of routine maintenance requires almost no thought. "It's time to get a new car" given that car safety has drastically improved and I have two younger kids in that thing a few times a week but I'm honestly having a really hard time giving it up, something so reliable and plainly functional. New cars with all their computers and smart technology only look lik…

FWIW, the computers don’t tend to break. The things that do break are essentially the same as they were 20 years ago. The bells and whistles are mostly for creatures comfort. The mechanical components haven’t changed much. The only thing that I couldn’t fix on my own in my 2020 vs my 2006 was re-alignment of lane keep system after replacing the windshield.

One thing that years and years of looking at CR has attuned me to is that car electronics break all the time and are the reason why many brands have poor reliability scores even though the engines run, the lights turn on, and the doors open and close (most of the time).

German and American cars seem to have a very frustrating time with reliable electronics compared to Asian brands for some reason, and the problems persist year after year.

For especially electronic heavy brands, typically higher-end ones the problem can become particularly pronounced, the bottom ranked vehicles on this list are mostly high-end, expensive, and packed full of gear (except for a few). Electric vehicles and PHEVs have the biggest problems being almost entirely electronics.

Re: Who makes the most reliable new cars?

#480

Post by water9 » Thu, Nov 30, 2023, 2:03 AM UTC

twisteriffic wrote: post #470

water9 wrote: post #443

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s actually the capacitors that fail first because they have a liquid electrolyte

I have never seen an electrolytic capacitor fail in an automotive context, and I've owned my fair share of capacitor plague-era vehicles. I'd imagine it's a combination of preferring other types of capacitor for that environment and not buying the cheapest shit they can find in the markets that day like Dell did.

Yeah, it could also be a product of where you live. I live in the southwest us so it’s more area here and likely to dry them out faster. You’re definitely right about good quality not being as good as it used to be