Earlier quoted context omitted.
What they don't know is my charitable deductions. My charitable deductions greatly reduce my taxes. If I went with their automagical tax filing process I'd lose out on those deductions.
That could be automated too largely. In Austria charities submit this information to the government and it automatically gets added to your prefilled tax filings.
IRS Reforms Free File Program, Drops Agreement Not to Compete with TurboTax
471–480 of 489 posts
Re: IRS Reforms Free File Program, Drops Agreement Not to Compete with TurboTax
#472Earlier quoted context omitted.
Who your dependants are and what type of filing you are doing (single, married, married jointly)
“If your tax situation has changed in any of the following ways, please check the appropriate box(es) and mail this back to us or submit online; we’ll issue a revised estimate within 30 days and extend your review deadline accordingly.”
Re: IRS Reforms Free File Program, Drops Agreement Not to Compete with TurboTax
#473Earlier quoted context omitted.
Only if working with individuals. If I, as a consultant, work with a company, that company requires a W9 from me, and they have to report what they paid me. And I also report what I paid myself in salary and pay federal taxes from every paycheck I make out to myself. So at least for me, they know everything there is to know.
I sell stuff (software, so not really stuff). I certainly file my quarterly estimated taxes (state and federal), but until I file my annual return, the government has no idea how much I've actually earned, nor what my expenses were. Consequently, they're in no position to tell me what I owe them until I've filed my entire return. Perhaps what the commenter meant was "we should fill out forms detailing income + expens…
Re: IRS Reforms Free File Program, Drops Agreement Not to Compete with TurboTax
#474Earlier quoted context omitted.
> 1040EZ, if you even know what that is I think you buried the lead here. American public schools, part of the American government charged with teaching children and funded by taxes, don't teach kids how to pay taxes to the American government (maybe it sometimes happens, but it's certainly not standard.) It's ludicrous.
I'm not disagreeing with you, but how are schools supposed to teach kids how to pay taxes when it's such a convoluted specialty that requires college level education to learn?
Re: IRS Reforms Free File Program, Drops Agreement Not to Compete with TurboTax
#475Earlier quoted context omitted.
How is it fair that my taxes paid to the state of California, a US state, are much less deductible than my taxes paid to foreign governments? No cap on those. The idea is that taxes paid are not really income but rather my cost of doing business, nothing to do with who gets them. It’s like an expense for a business. No matter how high or who they go to they’re not taxed; they’re deducted against income. California ta…
Consider the people of California as a group, not as individuals, seen from the federal perspective. They should not be able to evade federal taxes by spending the money on themselves. Double taxation and beyond is the norm. You have sales tax, paid to a vendor that pays their own income tax, for goods that were imported with tariffs. Unless you voted against the California politicians, you should enjoy paying your t…
Nobody's evading anything. The federal, state and local governments together are your government. That's why you've always been able to deduct the local from your state and federal, and state from your federal. In fact I can't think of a country where that's not true, can you?
> Double taxation and beyond is the norm. You have sales tax, paid to a vendor that pays their own income tax, for goods that were imported with tariffs.
Not with income taxes. Historically not within the United States, and again, as you continue to refuse to address, not for taxes paid to foreign governments. The US has a huge network of no-double-taxation tax treaties with foreign governments because it's not fair to tax people on their taxes.
The IRS has a no-double-taxation treaty with Azerbaijan and yet it can't manage to sustain one with California? [1]
> Unless you voted against the California politicians, you should enjoy paying your taxes. Those politicians are why we can't cut expensive government programs at both the state and federal level, and why we must tax heavily to compensate.
California's top tier is 13.3%, the US federal is 37% + FICA. You can't tell me with a straight face that California's measly tax rate is the reason the US federal government has to charge 40% of both my income and my taxes.
I have no problem paying my fair share. I'm also a non-citizen so I can't vote.
[1] https://www.irs.gov/businesses/international-businesses/unit...
Re: IRS Reforms Free File Program, Drops Agreement Not to Compete with TurboTax
#476This USA tax thing has always baffled me... it is the exact definition of why we pay taxes: for the government to provide services that are common to the country´s citizens. There´s nothing more common than tax collection: rich, middle class or poor. Why wouldn't citizens demand a public tax filing process? Even in Mexico we have an automagical tax filing process that makes: a) The great majority of the population wh…
Re: IRS Reforms Free File Program, Drops Agreement Not to Compete with TurboTax
#477Earlier quoted context omitted.
1. This doesn't make any sense. The easiest way for the government to impose more taxes is to raise the percentages on the taxes they already collect. Private filing has nothing to do with it. 2. Americans don't have the lowest tax rates in the developed world. Mexico, Ireland, Chile, Turkey, and South Korea all have lower tax rates[1]. And in some cases the governments provide more services with less money because t…
> 1. This doesn't make any sense. The easiest way for the government to impose more taxes is to raise the percentages on the taxes they already collect. Private filing has nothing to do with it. To raise the percentage rates, politicians have to vote to raise those rates. Private filing means that everyone is very aware of how much they’re paying in taxes. It’s not just an invoice they receive listing how much was wi…
I'm not sure how you think private filing is related to manually filing your taxes. Yes, if taxes were just paying an invoice at the end of the year, that would make them less noticeable, but that's not a necessary component of private taxation. Adding up all your income and just calculating a simple percentage would create just as much awareness--probably more, because there's some clarity/transparency that is easier to understand.
In fact, I'd argue that a complex filing process puts a focus on where money is coming from, rather than where it is going, which is arguably much more important to make transparent to people.
> I don’t think people would consider Chile and Mexico to be developed countries.
Any basis you could have for not considering Chile and Mexico to be developed countries applies to large sections of the US (incidentally, they tend to be the parts of the US with the lowest taxes). There's more poverty in the parts of Alabama and West Virginia that I've visited than the parts of Ecuador I've visited.
> You’re right that Ireland and South Korea are lower (depending on the year, Ireland cut taxes significantly recently). But they’re together with the US in the bottom band.
So the rest of your argument doesn't work, since it was based on your claim that we have the lowest taxes.
Re: IRS Reforms Free File Program, Drops Agreement Not to Compete with TurboTax
#478We need pre-filled tax forms. https://priceonomics.com/the-stanford-professor-who-fought-t...
If the government can pre-fill my tax form, why should I even have to file taxes to begin with? Just send me the pre-filled information each year and tell me I need to correct it if it's wrong. Otherwise, I shouldn't have to do anything.
1st of April every year we get our pre-filled tax form (digitally), which we have to look over. If we find it to be alright, we don't have to do anything (deadline the 30th of April) and the taxes have been filed. All financial institutions sends data to our tax office, so it's all there.
Re: IRS Reforms Free File Program, Drops Agreement Not to Compete with TurboTax
#479Earlier quoted context omitted.
You're not accounting for the marginal utility of money. The marginal utility of money decays exponentially with respect to income.
It probably does, but why is that relevant? I'm curious about these branching criticisms that come up, another fella above mentioned equal opportunity to earn higher income, you and a few others mention this marginal utility idea. I think these are valid concerns but lumped into taxation break what I think should be an application of the single responsibility principle ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Single_responsib…
Yes. And as part of that you have to decide how much each person is to contribute.
> We should have a simple tax formula strictly dedicated to funding the government where everyone has skin in the game
Yes.
> ..and contributes equally along some metric.
Yes, according to their means. The metric is contribution proportional to your ability to contribute and that folds in implicitly the idea that your "means" are non-linear with respect to marginal utility. Noblesse oblige. [1]
> The flat tax seems a dead simple reasonable metric and is unquestionably equal when focused on contributions.
No, it is not. Because 10% of 10K/yr income of someone working at burger king is an undue hardship whereas 10% of 1M/yr income of someone running a big company is no burden at all. 1K to someone making 10K may be the difference between sleeping in a bed and sleeping in the street, but 100K to someone making 1M, frankly, they wouldn't even notice it.
> Once we start trying to equalize along these other dimensions of marginal utility or equality of some other thing we're no longer focused on funding government but enacting some equality/justice endeavor.
No, we know how much we need to fund the government based on cost of policies enacted. That's not the job of the IRS, that's the job of the budget committee in congress. What the IRS is doing is figuring out how to apportion that burden among the population.
> Those I imagine probably also suffer from holding no simple formula to calculate their equalities against. Let such endeavors be handled by some other government agency dedicated to those causes, why drag the tax system into the mix and complicate things is what baffles me.
Again, the goal is to figure out how to apportion the burden, and that's done by indexing to marginal utility, bringing us back to where we began.
To be clear this isn't coming from someone looking to take from others, I'm in the top marginal income tax bracket, and I think it should be much higher than it is. IMO it should go back up to 70% as it was for much of the 1900s. [2]
[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Noblesse_oblige
[2] https://www.washingtonpost.com/us-policy/2019/02/27/top-tax-...
Re: IRS Reforms Free File Program, Drops Agreement Not to Compete with TurboTax
#480Earlier quoted context omitted.
Consider the people of California as a group, not as individuals, seen from the federal perspective. They should not be able to evade federal taxes by spending the money on themselves. Double taxation and beyond is the norm. You have sales tax, paid to a vendor that pays their own income tax, for goods that were imported with tariffs. Unless you voted against the California politicians, you should enjoy paying your t…
> Consider the people of California as a group, not as individuals, seen from the federal perspective. They should not be able to evade federal taxes by spending the money on themselves. Nobody's evading anything. The federal, state and local governments together are your government. That's why you've always been able to deduct the local from your state and federal, and state from your federal. In fact I can't think…
If I'm in Texas, my state income tax is $0. My federal tax rate will be higher without having state taxes to deduct. Part of this money goes to you, in California.
If you're in California, you get a reduced federal rate if you can deduct California taxes. The money from California taxes stays in California to benefit you. I do not benefit from your California taxes.
California would be getting money from you without paying federal taxes on it. The money then goes to you, via services provided by California. You're getting that money back in the form of superior services like better schools, homeless services, and roads. You're getting to spend that money in your state, free of federal taxes.
The deduction is thus a massive subsidy to states with high local taxes. It places a greater burden on states that are less wasteful, since nobody there gets to deduct state taxes. Such a deduction thus encourages wasteful local government.
As viewed from outside California, money owed to the federal government is staying in California to be spent for the benefit of people in California. That simply isn't fair.
If you are unhappy with the resulting high tax rate, you can leave the state or you can try to get the state to eliminate taxes.