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Amazon CEO's talks with U.S. officials triggered crackdown on Anthropic models

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Re: Amazon CEO's talks with U.S. officials triggered crackdown on Anthropic models

#461

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That’s a terrible way to create AI regulations If they actually cared about this issue we’d have predictable laws and regulatory bodies that let companies actually plan There’s a reason royal fiat doesn’t lead to healthy economies. It’s just confusing and chaotic. It’s not clear why anyone would invest in a new model now. Then the next administration comes in and instantly, by fiat, they decide to lift the ban. The m…

In a parallel universe where we have Biden (or Democratic Party) administration, how different do you think the regulations / approach would be for this fast moving and unpredictable technology?

It doesn’t really matter what party does it

The ideal case is a statutory agency with regulatory authority that sets very clear standards for what model capabilities can and cannot release. Those are set ahead of time and well known by frontier model providers.

Most normal regulations are managed through the administrative procedures act process. That’s a legal requirement that involves deliberation and public comment.

I’d argue you could pretty easily enumerate most capabilities that have been obvious concerns for a while. For example, cyber security.

This structure can last decades and reassure players they can operate in the market without rules changing suddenly without warning.

Some kind of sudden, temporary action like this export control tool is legally fragile. Even if sometimes necessary in exceptional cases. But if the administration sees this as a permanent way of working, they won’t be helping anyone (but maybe themselves through grift).

If the administration truly cares about functional regulation (which maybe they don’t) they need a sturdier legal structure that lasts past Trump. Not flimsy edicts that change with the wind

Re: Amazon CEO's talks with U.S. officials triggered crackdown on Anthropic models

#462

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You clearly missed the part about the divide between the political class and everyone else. Most people in the US are just trying to pay rent and maybe one day save up for a house by the time they are 40-50. If you don't see this you are either 1) making enough money you are part of the problem 2) don't actually live in the US so have a completely unmoored understanding of reality on the ground here

I obviously don’t live in the US. My entire point was that people say that care about school shootings and etc., but unless they do anything about it, those are just words. Given the voting record of the majority of the population, I tend to believe that an average American cares more about SPX. Which, honestly, is fine by me. Every nation and culture is different, freedom and etc. etc.. But it would be hard to convi…

We literally can't do anything dude, what are you advocating for? That we have an armed rebellion to legislate the people's laws under a workers tribunal?

I'm really curious what country you live in because it's one that's clearly not a democracy. Not saying it as an insult either, but surely even in countries run by authoritarians there is an understanding that leadership is sometimes completely divorced from the people?

I also personally have a hard time blaming voters for anything, in America we have two corporate powers that have been neglecting the material needs of workers for nearly 40 years now; when you have two corporate parties power tends to be unstable for any meaningful legislation which tends to only benefit the elites + corporations whereas workers require constant legislation to help them and guide the country to benefit them.

When you see very little material outcomes you will vote for more extreme candidates. I honestly believe this is the real lesson how fascism can flourish, and I think this is something that can easily be predicted with extreme accuracy too. You look at the Weimar Republic, it was one of the most advanced and democratic governments on Earth; yet it failed to stop the threat of Nazis, mostly due to the ineptitude of politicians that also rejected the material needs of a nation.

I know this is a huge tangent but I think it's useful to write, because I'm really curios on your upbringing. I'd think understanding power, corruption, and out of touch governments to be universal human experiences but maybe not. D:

Re: Amazon CEO's talks with U.S. officials triggered crackdown on Anthropic models

#463
post #71

I still am struggling to understand why they informed the government about something that is known to be an issue in every LLM. There is no LLM that cannot be jailbroken, so unless this means that we have reached the absolute maximum publicly accessible US made LLMs are allowed to operate at with GPT 5.5, this is not grounded in any sane regulation attempt. Does anyone know what limits Fable 5 has overstepped in the…

They literally asked for it. Two days ago Amodei wrote an essay urging the government to regulate them. He explicitly cited Mythos, as proof that frontier AI has acquired autonomous hacking capabilities that threaten critical infrastructure and national security. "Mythos Preview scrambled the global cybersecurity landscape. But its broader significance is that it proves beyond doubt that AI models are now tools of gl…

“This power must be scoped to the above four specific risks and there must be protective measures against political favoritism or arbitrary decisions.”

Re: Amazon CEO's talks with U.S. officials triggered crackdown on Anthropic models

#464
post #71

I still am struggling to understand why they informed the government about something that is known to be an issue in every LLM. There is no LLM that cannot be jailbroken, so unless this means that we have reached the absolute maximum publicly accessible US made LLMs are allowed to operate at with GPT 5.5, this is not grounded in any sane regulation attempt. Does anyone know what limits Fable 5 has overstepped in the…

This is corporate Game of Thrones, nothing more. Amazon, maybe in alliance/deals with others as well saw an opportunity to hurt their rival. Or maybe they were instructed to report this by the WH themselves. Hegseth and the WH will happily take any excuse to hurt Anthropic after the confrontation with DOW, being the vindictive cronies they are.

Re: Amazon CEO's talks with U.S. officials triggered crackdown on Anthropic models

#465
post #71

I still am struggling to understand why they informed the government about something that is known to be an issue in every LLM. There is no LLM that cannot be jailbroken, so unless this means that we have reached the absolute maximum publicly accessible US made LLMs are allowed to operate at with GPT 5.5, this is not grounded in any sane regulation attempt. Does anyone know what limits Fable 5 has overstepped in the…

This is corporate Game of Thrones, nothing more. Amazon, maybe in alliance/deals with others as well saw an opportunity to hurt their rival. Or maybe they were instructed to report this by the WH themselves. Hegseth and the WH will happily take any excuse to hurt Anthropic after the confrontation with DOW, being the vindictive cronies they are.

I thought Amazon has a stake in Anthropic, and would want them to succeed.

Re: Amazon CEO's talks with U.S. officials triggered crackdown on Anthropic models

#466
post #402

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Cynically: this is an attempt to quash open source or discount model competition through regulatory capture.

I'm sure it's also a step towards requiring id and limiting access for us plebians to real power and keeping it for maintaining or growing power of those in charge. It's all an excuse to give us a Westworld season 3. Probably a better example out there..

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Re: Amazon CEO's talks with U.S. officials triggered crackdown on Anthropic models

#467
post #435

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Of course, Amazon wanted this to happen. They own 20% of Anthropic. Anthropic bleeds cash. They have to raise capital. There are only 2 ways: an IPO or follow-ons from existing investors. If the IPO gets delayed because of these restrictions, Anthropic will be forced to raise more capital from existing investors. And existing investors (Amazon) will end up owning more of Anthropic at a cheaper valuation.

Why would they have launched Fable on Bedrock if they knew they were going to be shutting it down a day later?

They would have no internally/externally defensible justification to stop the launch as they are partners/part-owners of Anthropic. They would have to let the rank-and-file keep moving on the Fable launch.

Re: Amazon CEO's talks with U.S. officials triggered crackdown on Anthropic models

#468

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Interesting point. Just a small correction, the Anthropic stake is higher. ($13B + another $20B option if they hit certain milestones, which I believe is almost guaranteed) So it's closer to $33B In any case, there is no reason for them to purposefully hurt Anthropic. I would say that this government "takedown" of Mythos is great free advertising. I mean, if you look at this, they said it's too risky to launch, we al…

You seem to assume rational actors. Bezos et. al. are definitely not that.

There are a number of CEOs that I would be willing to label as not being rational actors. Bezos would not typically make that list.

Re: Amazon CEO's talks with U.S. officials triggered crackdown on Anthropic models

#469

Just to put things in the right perspective to those who are not aware, Amazon heavily invests in Anthropic [0] and AWS is a partner on project Glasswing (Select companies that used Mythos to find critical vulnerabilities in major open source and critical infrastructure) [1] So I don't think there is anything sinister here, I would use Hanlon's razor [2] here... [0] https://www.anthropic.com/news/anthropic-amazon-com…

The commentary sounds like AWS really pushed this.

If you're bringing this sort of stuff to the government, it's because you want the government to act...

Re: Amazon CEO's talks with U.S. officials triggered crackdown on Anthropic models

#470

So I logged into the Claude Code and their fabled Fable 5 model is "not available". Because it's "so good" and "so dangerous" that I can't have it. Judging by the amount of bugs in CC, this model can't be all that good. But regardless, what is the point of paying to Anthropic if their models are not available to you? I am switching to GPT 5.5.

It's good. My brief exposure to it suggests it deserved a new product name.

I agree, I worked with it for a bit and it seemed better than Opus 4.8.

One thing that I would like to try is Pi code agent. People seems to like it. GPT allows you to use it on subscription, but Anthropic cut that off on Max subscription. One more incentive to try something new. Also, I feel that I rely on Anthropic too much and none of these guys could be trusted. Next step -> foray into the Chinese models (admittedly not as good). Hopefully, they will get good enough soon.

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