Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

HERMES.md in commit messages causes requests to route to extra usage billing

github.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

451–460 of 568 posts

Re: HERMES.md in commit messages causes requests to route to extra usage billing

#451

Post by cwnyth »

jack_pp wrote: post #416
mothballed wrote: post #175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We all miss the old days of calling a real Filipino or Dominican slave-center where you got a script loop or suddenly the English runs out whenever it's time to ask for a refund.

In the good old days of 2011 when I started to learn C++ "for real" I did it using learncpp.com, google and "support" from freenode's #c++ where truly masterful wizards would help me with the most inane questions. I don't think anything I've ever found has come close to freenode's level of "support". In the old days where we didn't depend on services and everything was local even if you needed something truly arcane…

I truly miss those days. Programming forums from the turn of the millennium were very exciting places. I still have my account on Linux Forums from 2004, but it seems the rest are long gone. And no one will ever convince me that Discord is an adequate replacement for IRC.

Re: HERMES.md in commit messages causes requests to route to extra usage billing

#452

Post by ipaddr »

jorvi wrote: post #340
andybak wrote: post #327

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> was within a few months of an expiring warranty A few months inside or a few months outside? Because that seems to determine who's being unreasonable in this.

Oh, I meant within! I guess that is ambiguous, I figured within = inside, and outside = expired. I'll edit. Honestly what really egged me on was that I told them I might take them to small claims, and their response was sending a bunch of small claims cases they won.

No one sends you the cases they didn't win and they probably had a lot of court cases.

Re: HERMES.md in commit messages causes requests to route to extra usage billing

#453

Post by Animats »

kelnos wrote: post #398
Animats wrote: post #300

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If the business has a physical presence somewhere, it's not hard. In California, you can get an order to the Sheriff for a "till tap" or an "8 hour keeper". A till tap means a sheriff's deputy or two show up and take the money out of the cash register. A "keeper" means they stand next to the cashier all day and take in money as customers pay. There are fees for this, a few hundred dollars, and they're added to the ju…

How would that work for a company like Anthropic, where there's no physical store, no cashier, and no cash, even?

You go after their bank account, which is a slightly different procedure.

The main headache is finding their bank account. The best way to do this is to find someone they pay and seeing what source account was used.

Re: HERMES.md in commit messages causes requests to route to extra usage billing

#454

Post by pbhjpbhj »

Borealid wrote: post #426
tardedmeme wrote: post #408

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's certainly retaliation if you can't use something you already paid for.

A limited account is allowed access to all prior purchases. It can even download those purchases again (incurring costs on Valve's part without paying anything). I don't believe anything was rescinded in the situation being discussed; Valve just prevented the user from continuing to use their community/marketplace services. This makes sense because they were put into the bucket containing fraudulent or abusive user a…

Are you saying it's fine, iyo, for companies to use market position to work around consumer protection laws? I don't feel like Valve/Steam should be allowed to sell games they know are broken and then refuse refunds (they could also fix them!).

>can even download those

So what you're saying is I should find a fat juicy data pipe somewhere and download stuff from Steam until I fill /dev/null... ;oP

Seriously the. 15 minutes or so of support time will have cost more than the game did in this case, but it really is the principle. Stealing lots of small amounts from lots of people is still criminally dishonest.

Re: HERMES.md in commit messages causes requests to route to extra usage billing

#455

Post by fc417fc802 »

Borealid wrote: post #365
Cpoll wrote: post #188

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Being able to freely threaten reprisal against people exercising their rights circumvents those rights. Freedom of association applies to individuals; it's a non-sequiter here.

I think there's a line between retaliating against someone, and refusing to help them in the future. I do not believe that refusing to do business with an individual, where your business provides a non-life-critical service, is retaliation. A water company refusing to provide water to your home would be problematic. A luxury handbag store refusing to allow you to purchase more luxury handbags would not. Image as a hy…

> I do not believe that refusing to do business with an individual, where your business provides a non-life-critical service, is retaliation.

This isn't accurate. It might not threaten your life or pose any great hurdle to overcome but retaliation has nothing to do with that. If they did it in response to an action you took not to solve a problem but instead out of spite or to otherwise get back at you then it is retaliation.

That isn't the same as refusing to do business with someone who isn't productive to associate with. The two are entirely separate categories.

Of course any business (including Steam) will attempt to argue that an instance of the former is actually the latter, and a difficult customer will attempt to argue that an instance of the latter is actually the former. Regardless, Steam (and most other businesses) behave in a clearly retaliatory manner regarding chargebacks. In cases where the company failing to respect the individual's legal rights is what led to the chargeback that shouldn't be permissible.

To frame it in the terms you used, any otherwise legal activity stemming directly from the company having violated an individual's legal rights should be treated in the same way that a protected class is.

Re: HERMES.md in commit messages causes requests to route to extra usage billing

#456

Post by njovin »

lavezzi wrote: post #430
quikoa wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe Anthropic is just testing the waters to see what they can get away with. Left unchallenged (court, charge back, whatever) why change course?

> Left unchallenged (court, charge back, whatever) why change course? They are trying to go public and will get absolutely bitchslapped by SOX.

By whom? Which regulatory body is not completely captured in this administration?

Re: HERMES.md in commit messages causes requests to route to extra usage billing

#457

Post by Borealid »

fc417fc802 wrote: post #455
Borealid wrote: post #365

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think there's a line between retaliating against someone, and refusing to help them in the future. I do not believe that refusing to do business with an individual, where your business provides a non-life-critical service, is retaliation. A water company refusing to provide water to your home would be problematic. A luxury handbag store refusing to allow you to purchase more luxury handbags would not. Image as a hy…

> I do not believe that refusing to do business with an individual, where your business provides a non-life-critical service, is retaliation. This isn't accurate. It might not threaten your life or pose any great hurdle to overcome but retaliation has nothing to do with that. If they did it in response to an action you took not to solve a problem but instead out of spite or to otherwise get back at you then it is ret…

I think someone exercising their legal rights, such as their right to enter a business open to the public and their right to free speech inside that establishment, in a way that harms the business should be something a business can "punish" by refusing to do business with that individual.

I do not think it would be good public policy to prohibit this. I also don't believe, in the United States at least, this conduct is currently legally prohibited.

I previously gave an example of a situation in which I think the correct resolution is for the business to, as you put it, retaliate against someone exercising their legal rights.

A second example of the same type of retaliation is a business denying future sales to an individual who repeatedly purchases and then returns physical merchandise. I think blacklisting that individual is both morally and legally sound.

For the record, I think the definition of "retaliation" needs to include a desire to harm the other party. If your only desire is self-protection, I do not believe it qualifies as retaliation.

Re: HERMES.md in commit messages causes requests to route to extra usage billing

#458

Post by encodedrose »

joshribakoff wrote: post #8

After i was triple billed in January, they acknowledged it but refused to provide a refund. I won those credit card disputes.

Is it too much to ask for a not-vibe-coded billing system? In my opinion, we need better systems to hold these companies accountable as I don't believe the $20/dispute they're paying means much given how common other customers are complaining about billing irregularities just in this thread alone.

Re: HERMES.md in commit messages causes requests to route to extra usage billing

#459

Post by solenoid0937 »

stefan_ wrote: post #371
csoups14 wrote: post #352

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Would imagine it's the simplest answer: they're flying by the seat of their pants, there's 1000 things happening every day that demand attention and there's not enough of it to go around. They toss their LLM at it, give it a cursory glance, and ship it. A quick glance at the Claude Code source code bears the result of this process out. The fundamental question is, if their model is so powerful, why do they keep fucki…

Hermes is one of these OpenClaw clones, so this was certainly intentional, not a model hallucinating something. I think the problem is clear. Anthropic saw their usage go up much more than their capacity could handle. There are a few tried and true solutions to this, like "increase the price" or "restrict signups so you can guarantee service to what you have already sold". Then there is the "large scale fraud" option…

Mind pointing out where exactly in the contract you were allowed to use OpenClaw?

Re: HERMES.md in commit messages causes requests to route to extra usage billing

#460

Post by solenoid0937 »

throwaway449933 wrote: post #48

Anthropic employee here (opinions are my own): the response " [...] However, I need to let you know that we are unable to issue compensation [...]" was, as you imagined, generated by Claude. I don't like it, but can't do much about it.

why are you posting on HN? It'll only get you hate, this crowd is rabid
Post reply on HN