451–460 of 561 posts
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I genuinely love my job and am excited about it and I still wouldn't do it for anywhere close to 996 hours
Awesome! Then you should avoid someplace that works 996 like the plague. Do you think there are 0 people in the world who are excited about long hours at work?
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If you were genuinely excited and cared about your startup, you'd do the right thing for it and get some sleep.
Nobody ever said they were genuinely excited and cared about their startup, they said they cared about 996.
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I don't understand what kind of job, except for some very, very fringe cases like a NASA active mission or an atomic threat, would require a person to pull all-nighters. And how is that productive in the long-term? It's not exactly easy to hire talent.
People who enforce 996 or whatever other schedule are treating the symptom and not the cause. What they really want is for all of their employees to be so in love with the work, so bought into the mission and so compelled by the vision that they want to work until late. Of course building a company that inspires that is actually very difficult (though is possible for sure) so it’s easier just to enforce a crazy and u…
There's a lot of grit-flavoured cool aid being sold by CEOs
Here's one that came up recently selling work as the answer to life:
https://joincolossus.com/article/the-amusement-park-for-engi...
And another saying that burnout only exists if the work is not inspiring:
A note of caution: everything is relative, and details are important. If you love what you do (artist, self-employed, etc.) a 996 culture can be considered a good thing as a certain amount of "good" stress allows us to feel self-actualized. As is a 996 culture that provides for work-life balance. For example, working from home with flex time for 12 hours where you get to take long breaks whenever you feel like it to…
Likely at least two reasons: - People simply disagree with you, especially this line: “Who cares if you’re still replying to emails at 7pm if you can do this, right?” That might work for you but I imagine it left a sour note for some because emailing involves entangling other people into your personal hustle. This can perpetuate “work for show” (especially if you have any power or influence). If you want to silently…
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Totally. The point is, this guy who's mission I dedicated a good portion of life to clearly doesn't think about me at all after the fact. I'm sure he's gratefuland values me. But if I was part of his story he'd remember my name.
As someone who's just terrible with names, I hate that this is how people interpret it. There are plenty of people who have had a big impact on my life whose names have slipped - and, plenty of inconsequential people whose names stuck for no good reason. It has very little to do with how much that person mattered to me. Not saying your overall point doesn't stand, but at least for some people remembering a name isn't…
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> and take all the upside And all of the risk. Encouraging anyone to start their own company is deeply irresponsible. Most startups fail. If you're needing encouragement to do it - if you're not already fully deluded that you're the special snowflake unique genius who will succeed where all others have failed - you shouldn't be doing it.
Yep as the corporate job is super stable nowadays. /s I speculate that most people here, have come under the receiving end of what "At Will" contact.
E.g. I'm from New Zealand, and at-will contracts are not legal for employees. A company can use contracts (employing a contractor) but contracts are effectively restricted to professional specialists. A company can use temping agencies but the agency takes a big commission on top of wages. A company that has to sack someone can often get hit with financial penalties through the employee rights protection laws.
A note of caution: everything is relative, and details are important. If you love what you do (artist, self-employed, etc.) a 996 culture can be considered a good thing as a certain amount of "good" stress allows us to feel self-actualized. As is a 996 culture that provides for work-life balance. For example, working from home with flex time for 12 hours where you get to take long breaks whenever you feel like it to…
If you want to work 996 and that is what makes you feel self-actualized - by all means, go for it, nobody is stopping you. May even allow you to get ahead of the pack (or maybe the quality of your work will suffer in your overworked state - big gamble!). For me, the big problem in your post is the "996 culture". That means the expectation is that everyone is pushing forward with a similar intensity. Now, perhaps you…
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Vacation and choice is a luxury the majority of the world does not have, you are making his point. The mentality they are saying is the mentality that has given you the luxury of vacation and choice. The west did not rise to its place without an incredible amount of suffering.
Almost all countries have mandatory vacations, by law. How is it a luxury? I'm not taking about trip to Maldives for a vacation. Just a paid rest from work.
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Awesome! Then you should avoid someplace that works 996 like the plague. Do you think there are 0 people in the world who are excited about long hours at work?
No, but should we normalize it and put it as a job requirement? Those who want to do it are free to do so at any company.
This is the same argument about how when a company is remote anyone is still free to go into the office.
The people who want to work 996 likely want to do it with other people who want to work 996.
A company whose team values 996 should put it as a job requirement to filter applicants.
In China, its birthplace, '996' always seen as practice of failed management. Because for at least half of the 72-hour workweek, most employee will mentally checkout (in Chinese we call this 摸鱼). Although middle managers know their subordinates are inefficient, they still impose working hour KPI on their team, so they can demonstrate their own value to upper management.
The Chinese government banned ‘996’ a few years ago. I also never understood how it differed from the popular “death march” project management style popularized by companies like Epic and Microsoft.
On paper, PRC employment law is pretty strong on employee side compared to USA.