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Microsoft has not stopped forcing Edge on Windows 11 users

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Re: Microsoft has not stopped forcing Edge on Windows 11 users

#451

Post by biogene »

foxylad wrote: post #60
biogene wrote: post #37

I don't care for edge for the most part, but there is actually one integration with edge that I have come to like. When I click on an email link inside outlook, edge opens the link, and also displays a sidebar which displays the email. Super handy IMO. Somehow we need to find a balance that allows vendors to tightly integrate their apps but prevent abusing this. MS is everyone's favorite whipping boy, but I fear what…

Sad you didn't see Linux as a better alternative to OSX. I credit it with making me at least 10% more productive over the twenty years I've used it, partly because it is stable and fast, but mostly because it isn't trying to sell me stuff while I work.

Sure, nobody can say you "can't do" something with Linux. But the "can't" is more meant as "can't easily do".

To give you an example - I have a small+fast SSD for my OS and a large+slow spinning disk for data storage. When I install software on Windows I sometimes point to the other drive. This task is easier to do on Windows. The last I looked at it, Linux had a solution, but it was very convoluted. I see computer hardware and software products as purely a means to an end, I will use whatever that gets the job done.

Each person only has a limited quota of things that they can give a lot of energy to, and for me F/OSS is not something that I particularly go out of my way to support. My 'things that I give a shit about' quota is filled to the brim with the work I'm doing in healthcare.

Re: Microsoft has not stopped forcing Edge on Windows 11 users

#452

Post by biogene »

l33t7332273 wrote: post #50
biogene wrote: post #37

I don't care for edge for the most part, but there is actually one integration with edge that I have come to like. When I click on an email link inside outlook, edge opens the link, and also displays a sidebar which displays the email. Super handy IMO. Somehow we need to find a balance that allows vendors to tightly integrate their apps but prevent abusing this. MS is everyone's favorite whipping boy, but I fear what…

Ubuntu is very usable for a desktop OS.

Yes, I'm sure it is. But for me, so is Windows and OSX.

Re: Microsoft has not stopped forcing Edge on Windows 11 users

#453

Post by aarong11 »

alkonaut wrote: post #310
ben0x539 wrote: post #285

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How is it more acceptable because it's a combination of two things? Lots of objectionable outcomes are a combination of multiple factors!

Because I accept both things on their own, and I accept that the combination of them follows naturally. Then I must (reluctantly) accept unfortunate outcome of the combination. I wouldn't say it's reasonable that browsers could never suggest they be made default, and I don't think it's reasonable that you can't have some OS function that wants to show e.g. a help section use the OS embedded browser.

Just because its 2 things you'd otherwise accept doesn't mean it isn't a dark pattern. Lots of dark patterns (like the setting up of privacy / data sharing settings on google) do similar things.

Re: Microsoft has not stopped forcing Edge on Windows 11 users

#454

Post by EMCymatics »

lacrimacida wrote: post #230

My wife’s laptop just upgraded itself to windows 11 pro form 10 pro unasked & unsolicited and all prefs were changed to microsoft traps including edge being the default. Dark patterns galore. Luckily I could revert back to the previous version.

Ick.

Re: Microsoft has not stopped forcing Edge on Windows 11 users

#456

Post by biogene »

anon-3988 wrote: post #117
smt88 wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My experience is the opposite. I spent 15 years on Linux desktops until finally switching to Windows for the sake of my producivity. I've seen promoted links in Win10/11, but never anything that harmed my productivity. Most importantly, the OS just fades into the background. I never think about it. Linux required almost-daily googling and opening up a terminal to fix or change something. It became maddening eventuall…

> Linux required almost-daily googling and opening up a terminal to fix or change something. It became maddening eventually. Really? What kind of things do you have to google for Linux to work these days? The opposite is true for me in Windows, I am not about to relearn how to use the Windows terminal.

I don't think Linux is as bad as people claim, but it isn't as good/easy to use as people claim either. One problem I see is that the distribution of software is tied to the package manager. If you install any complex (esp stuff that uses web+database+python,etc) app outside of this system, I've seen dependencies break when updating software. MariaDB/Laravel upgrades have been painful.

Re: Microsoft has not stopped forcing Edge on Windows 11 users

#457

Post by biogene »

Draiken wrote: post #339
squeaky-clean wrote: post #190

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's 2023 and I still can't get a Dell laptop with Linux pre-installed to sleep properly without crashing without editing things in the terminal and mucking about in the bios. Even giving up on that and disabling sleep on lid close requires using the terminal. Sure the Gnome Tweaks tool has a setting for that but it's not installed by default and check the comments here, it doesn't actually work. https://askubuntu.co…

Be mad at Dell, not Linux. Pretty much every sleep issue I've encountered in the wild is due to the hardware manufacturer's shitty implementation. The only reason some features "just work" with Windows is because they only care if it works with Windows. Ultimately it still sucks if it happens with your hardware, but you should direct your frustration to the right party. Maybe one day people will care enough and inter…

Its often the case that when apps crash (on any OS) due to bugs, its the OS that gets blamed by the user. It is easy to say "blame Dell", but you'd have to be familiar with the code-base to know whose fault it was.

Re: Microsoft has not stopped forcing Edge on Windows 11 users

#458

Post by Crontab »

babypuncher wrote: post #443
antiframe wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What happens when you press Win, type a query, then press enter, quickly? In Win 10 that opens a Bing search in Edge for me, no matter what settings I try. Very annoying when I type "(Win)chr(enter)" to open Chrome and get a search instead. If I do it slow it will sometimes work. I haven't tried it on Win 11 because that was what caused me to drop Windows altogether. (Everyone has their straw).

I disabled the ability to search the web through the start menu long before they started with the edge shenanigans. As far as I'm concerned that isn't the operating system's job, and the only things I should see when I search there are things actually on my computer.

I do the same thing with Apple's Spotlight.

Re: Microsoft has not stopped forcing Edge on Windows 11 users

#459

Post by gwbas1c »

josefresco wrote: post #406

I use Windows 10/11 daily. The number of times Edge was "forced on me": 0 The number of times Edge launched when I expected or wanted my default browser (Firefox): 0 The number of times my browser default was reset to Edge: 0 I just don't understand this outrage. I spend 90% of my time in Firefox/Chrome - I've only started using Edge lately to play with Bing "AI" Chat. I had to search for it!

Visual Studio uses Edge when you submit bugs. There's some kind of integration where Edge collects diagnostics.

The problem then comes when you get emailed back from Microsoft. Other browsers can't log in correctly to Visual Studio's bug discussion board.

Re: Microsoft has not stopped forcing Edge on Windows 11 users

#460

Post by yomlica8 »

mkl95 wrote: post #316

Windows 10 is just fine for my needs. Yet every weeks my system is kidnapped on startup by a menu full of dark patterns that tries to lure me into installing Windows 11. Not only is it hostile and deceitful, but it fails to explain the advantages of upgrading to 11, which makes it useless.

I'd just disable the TPM in bios. Although I wouldn't put it past Microsoft to force install it on unsupported hardware.
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