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Its butterfly keyboard design has failed, but Apple has yet to admit its mistake

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Re: Its butterfly keyboard design has failed, but Apple has yet to admit its mistake

#451

Post by powvans »

dwaite wrote: post #414
alehul wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> whichever idiot thought putting the power plug at the bottom of the Magic Mouse was a good idea. For those not familiar with the Apple Mouse, the commenter means that the power plug is on the part that you’re supposed to have on the mousepad, meaning you can’t charge it while using it, at all. Easily the worst way to design a mouse, ever. I don’t understand how it was approved.

> Easily the worst way to design a mouse, ever. I don’t understand how it was approved. I do. It was on purpose. They do not want people using the wireless mouse as a wired mouse with a short, thick cord not designed for it. Which is totally what my parents would do.

That's easily solved by disabling the mouse when it's connected to the cable. If what you're asserting is true, at by disabling it they could have avoided this endless mocking.

Re: Its butterfly keyboard design has failed, but Apple has yet to admit its mistake

#452

Post by bdamm »

G4BB3R wrote: post #352
cmiles74 wrote: post #324

A co-worked of mine convinced the company to buy them a MacBook (the first the company has ever purchased) to replace their aging Dell laptop. They have been doing more and more work on the company's iOS app and the aging Mac mini the company had purchased needed to replaced anyway. After having the laptop for just over a year, they called me upset as the laptop would no longer power on. After some gentle interrogati…

I am sorry for what happened. But I just can't understand people who drink and eat at the same table with electronics. It is hard to happen, but eventually it will and will damage everything, so why doing that, this upsets me when I see people taking risks for nothing. Foods and drinks shouldn't stay outside kitchen.

Your kids are different from my kids then.

Re: Its butterfly keyboard design has failed, but Apple has yet to admit its mistake

#453

Post by i_am_proteus »

darkpuma wrote: post #429
dsfyu404ed wrote: post #396

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple has little motivation to fix durability issues. They've always been willing to prioritize elegance and form over durability anyway. This is a fine Italian motorcycle, not a Russian dirtbike, of course it has less tolerance for the user "using it wrong". Sure it would be nice if they made them more durable but that's just not the kind of product they are interested in making and it's working out well for them th…

> "These are fine Swiss rifles, not AKs." "Fine swiss rifles" are known for being expensive to manufacture, not for being fragile. Incidentally, why can I buy a fine Swiss watch that works 500 feet under the ocean, but not a fine "Swiss"(Cupertino) laptop that can withstand a few drops of tap water?

My fine Swiss rifle from 1896 still shoots straight. It's been only minimally maintained since it was rebuilt in 1931.

Re: Its butterfly keyboard design has failed, but Apple has yet to admit its mistake

#454

Post by chx »

npongratz wrote: post #437
camelNotation wrote: post #410

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not only are Thinkpad keyboards the most comfortable and satisfying on the market, you can literally pour water on them and it will drain out the bottom of the laptop without ever touching internal components. After using my Thinkpad for about six months, I can't go back. The keyboard is amazing, build quality is rock solid, screen is 4k with 100% RGB, and you can actually upgrade the thing. I buy a laptop because I…

I want to like Thinkpads for their hardware quality, but I cannot get over Lenovo stuffing malware into their systems, even after they got caught. How can I be put at ease?

That was IdeaPad, nothing to do with ThinkPad.

Re: Its butterfly keyboard design has failed, but Apple has yet to admit its mistake

#455

Post by microtonal »

droptablemain wrote: post #40
microtonal wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I tried, but I don't really feel much sympathy for someone who buys a product with a 40% premium that's effectively a status symbol masquerading as a piece of hardware. Oh come on, this is getting really old. A lot of people (most Mac users that I know) pay the 40% premium because they want macOS and the Mac application ecosystem. Sure, there are people that will buy it as a status symbol, but that's a crude over-gen…

I drive a 7-year old subcompact and you're telling me that the Mercedes S-Class is not that expensive because it's only $10k more than the BMW 7-Series. Those are two quite modestly-spec'd laptops with fairly high price tags. I bought a rebranded Clevo with pre-installed Ubuntu 4 years ago with an i7 and 16GB of RAM for around $1,000. Does it have cool features like an all-aluminium construction or a nifty touch-bar?…

Those are two quite modestly-spec'd laptops with fairly high price tags. I bought a rebranded Clevo with pre-installed Ubuntu 4 years ago with an i7 and 16GB of RAM for around $1,000.

Sure. I am just saying that there is no big markup for Apple compared to other vendors. If you want a laptop with the same specs, screen, trackpad, weight, and thinness as a MacBook Air, you are going to end up in the same price class as a MacBook Air.

I am not arguing for thin laptops, light laptops, Magic Trackpads, or whatever. Different people have different requirements. But a lot of people buy MacBooks based on their requirements and not for status.

I think there is at least one thing that we can agree on: the Touch Bar is completely unnecessary and a gimmick ;).

Re: Its butterfly keyboard design has failed, but Apple has yet to admit its mistake

#456

Post by jimmy1 »

Retra wrote: post #419
jimmy1 wrote: post #364

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm adding onto this -- I have a 2017 edition of the MBP for work, and I have a faulty keyboard. I hated it. "The touchbar is stupid", I proclaimed. I recently bought a 2018 edition for the wife because she has always expressed a desire of owning one of her own (my work always provided me with a mac). The keyboard is much improved. Additionally, watching a "normal" user interact with a Mac and a touchbar, versus me,…

I don't think people would be complaining nearly as much if they simply added the touchbar above the existing keys rather than replacing them. Or left the esc and power keys while putting the touchbar in between them. Lots of things they could have done.

The replacing the existing keys is a good point. I don't feel the pain of the ESC key since I remap caps lock to it, I always thought "Function" keys were relics of a bygone era, (and unergonomic to use), and the little black doodad functions just as well as a power button as any other one I have ever used.

Re: Its butterfly keyboard design has failed, but Apple has yet to admit its mistake

#457

Post by oehpr »

npongratz wrote: post #437
camelNotation wrote: post #410

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not only are Thinkpad keyboards the most comfortable and satisfying on the market, you can literally pour water on them and it will drain out the bottom of the laptop without ever touching internal components. After using my Thinkpad for about six months, I can't go back. The keyboard is amazing, build quality is rock solid, screen is 4k with 100% RGB, and you can actually upgrade the thing. I buy a laptop because I…

I want to like Thinkpads for their hardware quality, but I cannot get over Lenovo stuffing malware into their systems, even after they got caught. How can I be put at ease?

well, you can do what I do and wipe the OS. Though, that's a bit of a time investment.

Re: Its butterfly keyboard design has failed, but Apple has yet to admit its mistake

#458

Post by npongratz »

chx wrote: post #454
npongratz wrote: post #437

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I want to like Thinkpads for their hardware quality, but I cannot get over Lenovo stuffing malware into their systems, even after they got caught. How can I be put at ease?

That was IdeaPad, nothing to do with ThinkPad.

Good to know, thanks! Do both lines have completely different engineering and management leadership? That might put me at some ease.

Re: Its butterfly keyboard design has failed, but Apple has yet to admit its mistake

#459

Post by vernie »

tzakrajs wrote: post #393
martinpw wrote: post #348

The Benjamin Button review of improvements in older Macs compared with newer ones: https://blog.pinboard.in/2016/10/benjamin_button_reviews_the...

Guess this guy was pleased with his slower processor too.

The only substantial difference between my 2011 MBP and 2018 MBP for what I use it for (browsing the web, the lightest of computation) is that the 2018 model has really sharp edges that make me hate carrying it around. For my heavier workloads even the latest, top-of-the-line MBP is completely inadequate.

Re: Its butterfly keyboard design has failed, but Apple has yet to admit its mistake

#460

Post by microtonal »

tigershark wrote: post #159
microtonal wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Practically any laptop has a good keyboard compared to the first two generations of butterfly keyboards. I have suffered through a MacBook Pro with the second generation butterfly mechanism. Although I liked the feel of the pristine keyboard, pretty soon specks of dusts made keys get stuck/repeat regularly. I also had a can of compressed air to blow out the dust regularly. Between the broken keyboard and only 2 USB-C…

Be happy until also this keyboard starts failing.

We'll see whether the rubber seals keep out the dust permanently or just delays the speck of death. If the dust gets in it'll be a whole lot harder to remove with compressed air.
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