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United removes first-class passenger to make room for 'higher-priority' traveler

latimes.com

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Re: United removes first-class passenger to make room for 'higher-priority' traveler

#441
post #429
post #389

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"massively late" This is a direct consequence of charging for checked bags. Now every flight takes twice as long to board and disembark because everyone is carrying as much carry on as they can and trying to stuff them into the overhead bins. Annoyingly, they usually start making announcements about gate-checking bags for free so they are not really reducing the costs and they're encouraging passengers to drag their…

I would happily go for check bag in for free, but sometimes Airlines take forever to get the bag on to the carousel. Its much faster to get in and out with your bag as a carry-on. I agree, One free bag check should be compulsory. They should also ensure that your bags arrive faster than you at the baggage carousel. May be one day with the advent of robots.

Its much faster to get in and out with your bag as a carry-on.

This is the reason I do carry-on only if I can get away with it. I want to keep my airport-time as low as reasonably possible. I also try to optimise my seating for this purpose rhen its something I can do (without paying for priority stuff). For example, on a recent flight, I was the 3rd person through the passport checks and the first person (as far as I could tell) leaving the secure area.

Re: United removes first-class passenger to make room for 'higher-priority' traveler

#442
post #427

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> "These cities are also 24/7, to a greater extent than any Western city, I would argue." Have you really been to NYC? Jazz, Blues, much other music, etc. No 24/365 Apple Store in Asia. # Apple Stores Tokyo = 4 # Apple Stores Shanghai = 7 # Apple Stores Seoul = 0 (Possible 1 in future) # Apple Stores NYC = 10 including the 24/365 store

OMG! you really like your Apple stores don't you? Apple stores say nothing about the vibrancy of the city. It basically states that the city mindlessly practices American consumerism that Apple needs 24/365 stores to keep up with demand. My experience of New York was tall buildings, narrow streets with garbage on the sidewalks, ridiculously expensive rents, homelessness on streets, lots of people walking around but v…

> "OMG! you really like your Apple stores don't you?"

Well, with a 24/365 store I sleep easier at night knowing that if I need another unit or in person assistance when on a tight deadline I can get one. :-)

Also, Apple products, Macs, iPhones, iPads, are the tools of choice for the creative industries (media, photo, fashion, software development, much engineering, ....) and so number of stores and a 24/365 store is an index of creativity and vibrancy.

A couple of years ago at the 24/365 store I was told by an Apple Genius Bar person that the sales volume of that store alone is nearly that of the Macy's on 34th which takes an entire city block and that Macy's is the largest store in America.

> "My experience of New York was tall buildings, narrow streets..."

Well, I guess it depends on one's frame of reference. For me, NYC has an energy of its people -- 40% were not even born in the US and have come to make their way in NYC/America. I am always meeting new nice people in coffee shops who are living in NYC and from all over the world. The UN Building is in NYC, but NYC is the UN in itself.

Did you check out the blues/jazz throughout the city but especially in Greenwich Village? The large assortment of museums? The delis with corned beef and pastrami?, other sorts of ethnic foods?

Perhaps if when you return to NYC you meet up with someone who knows the city and you'll feel better.

Re: United removes first-class passenger to make room for 'higher-priority' traveler

#443
post #399
post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The company I work at (in Norway) had planed to take all 70 employees to NYC this summer to celebrate a milestone reached. We just moved the whole thing to Paris instead as we had issues with all of the above, including employees that have visited "dangerous" countries. The thing that pushed everyone over was when our former prime minster was harassed[1] at the border for having been to a meeting in Iran. It says in…

US border guards don't even know what a prime minister is. There's no way they know about diplomatic passports. They have no idea about the laws they are supposed to enforce. They think they're supposed to enforce laws that don't exist. They are stupid idiots who exert their power randomly and wrongly. That's been my experience. Expecting anything else is unrealistic. What else do you expect from someone who probably…

Are you confusing Customs with the TSA? In general, customs agents are much better trained and there is a lot of former military. TSA on the other hand is as you a low requirement job as you described.

Re: United removes first-class passenger to make room for 'higher-priority' traveler

#444

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This has to be a joke. You can't seriously be toting the availability of a 24/365 store (even an Apple store!) as some sort of benefit.

A 24/365 Apple Store is a signal about how cool and new technologically vibrant NYC is ...we need it and use it 24/365. Repairs as well as purchases 24/365. Number of Apple Stores in Manhattan = 7 (incl. one 24/365) Number of Apple Stores in NYC 5 Boroughs = 10 Number of stores Paris (incl. La Defense) = 4 Number of stores London = 5 Number of stores Berlin = 1 Jazz/Blues/all kinds of music, a city open 24/7 full of…

NYC's vibrancy is largely a product of its environment, not proof of a better city. In the US, but for a few cities that mostly defeated planners'attempts to suburbanize them (NYC included), all our towns and cities are largely shit. The better ones have a couple of blocks of places worth being, but those are mostly choked in webs of car-dominated hellscape. If you want to go to a place that's decent, for most people, you have to drive. So why not drive into NYC and make a weekend of it? This NYC is very crowded because it's a shining beacon in a pile of disasters.

By comparison, every place you can reach within an hour or two of Paris probably is a place worth being. (This was my experience in Madrid, and I'm extrapolating here for Paris.) That's a lot less pressure forcing people into the city center, because people can enjoy themselves much closer to where they live.

You take 24 hour Apple stores as a sign of vibrancy. I'd sooner look at the density of independent bakeries.

As to your subway comment, your conclusion is absurd. It seems likely to me that the savings from having fewer redundant tracks (which would be needed to facilitate maintenance in a 24 hour system) would more than offset the small demand for middle-of-the-night trips that can't wait until the next morning.

Re: United removes first-class passenger to make room for 'higher-priority' traveler

#445
post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The company I work at (in Norway) had planed to take all 70 employees to NYC this summer to celebrate a milestone reached. We just moved the whole thing to Paris instead as we had issues with all of the above, including employees that have visited "dangerous" countries. The thing that pushed everyone over was when our former prime minster was harassed[1] at the border for having been to a meeting in Iran. It says in…

Well, I'm very sorry your employees missed out on visiting NYC. As a NYC resident and as someone who has been to Paris many times, Paris is very nice. But people that come to NYC have a much greater experience. In the past month I met both an Italian who came here for the first time and an Israeli and both of them were so happy to be here. I think your employer should schedule a trip to NYC for these 70 employees --…

NYC was easily the worst part about visiting the Greater New England area, but to each their own. I mean sure it's interesting to see that world-famous city and spend a week in it. But that first breath of fresh air in a week, as we stepped out of the train in Beacon, that was really nice too (not the only thing I didn't like about NYC, compared to the surrounding area, actually I only noticed it as I stepped out, after a week).

Re: United removes first-class passenger to make room for 'higher-priority' traveler

#446

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If US airport security was run according to Israeli standards, all international flights would have to go through one of two airports, on the east and west coasts, each of which would have to be larger than ORD, JFK, LAX, DFW, and ATL combined. The special school required to train the screeners would effectively be the largest college in the world. International tourism both in and out would shrink dramatically, as t…

Well, I respectfully disagree with your assessment. First, I don't understand the two airport thing. Second, the Israelis do a security check on people before they board the (El-Al) planes -- like a day in advance or more. Also, we have plenty of veterans who fought in Iraq, Afghanistan, etc. who have real combat experience that we could pay more money for at TSA and train and staff appropriately. We could have air m…

What percentage of international passenger flights to or from Israel do not go through Ben Gurion? Part of the Israeli security strategy is to route most potential threats through the same focused security apparatus. On a land border, that means building a wall (or "security fence") and moving the travelers through fewer gates. On a sea border, that means watching the whole thing closely and only allowing traffic through a few authorized harbor ports. For the air border, it means routing most travelers through one airport (viz. Ben Gurion).

The US couldn't route everyone through one airport. It's too big. So put one on each coast. That was just a pinch of hyperbole. The US could not practically do that. But neither could it install Ben Gurion levels of security in all of its international airports, because even with all the combat vets, there are too few Americans would would have the capability, competence, composure, and willingness to take the job. And for those who would, the cost of training would be enormous. Just one airport, like O'Hare, which served 78 million passengers last year, had more than 4 times the volume of Ben Gurion's 18 million. And you would have to increase security for every single international airport, or it wouldn't work.

Americans have a different mindset than Israelis. The nation was born from resistance to arbitrary and capricious colonial restrictions, and has never been surrounded by enemies on all sides. Our history has led many of us to deeply distrust our own corrupt governments and police. Here, "security guard" is a low-prestige job for losers, as embodied in the "mall cop" archetype. You might be able to install increased security in Boston or NYC, where recent history instills a greater sense of insecurity, but it is only a short drive away from the state whose motto is "live free or die", home to libertarian festivals where an amalgamation of activist goals is to one day openly carry firearms, while openly vaporizing marijuana, jaywalking topless to request public records, while recording police in the act of not hassling anyone.

The last time I traveled for work (to New Hampshire, actually) I got to witness the American airport security procedure for checking a firearm. My co-worker apparently never went anywhere without it. And that's a typical American thing. An incredibly large number of us are almost constantly armed. Legally. You can't stop someone 3 miles out from the airport at a checkpoint and say the car can't proceed with a weapon in it. The NRA would take that all the way to the Supreme Court and win.

Even the ineffectual security theater they put on in airports now induces hordes of Americans to prefer ground transport, rather than put up with it. And not only are Americans obsessed with their own freedom, but we are also a nation of bargain hunters. This is the country that gave Wal-Mart to the world, and exported many of its own manufacturing jobs to other countries. If we had to pay more for air travel just to get expensive real security instead of cheap placebo, the airlines would simply go bankrupt [more often than they already do].

So if you try to say "arrive 3 hours before departure or strip search" in most US airports, you will have a lot of empty terminals. For one, adding 3 hours to a flight between, for instance, Los Angeles and San Francisco is making that 3 hours in an airport plus an hour in the air plus another 30 minutes for luggage and ground transport versus just getting onto I-5 and driving for 6 hours. From Chicago to Louisville, to name a flight recently in the news, that would be a 5 hour drive compared to 4.5 hours between airports. Hell, last time I flew on my own dime, I drove two hours, to reach another airport with cheaper fares. The local airport actually runs ads on television, begging people not to do that.

Re: United removes first-class passenger to make room for 'higher-priority' traveler

#447

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This has to be a joke. You can't seriously be toting the availability of a 24/365 store (even an Apple store!) as some sort of benefit.

A 24/365 Apple Store is a signal about how cool and new technologically vibrant NYC is ...we need it and use it 24/365. Repairs as well as purchases 24/365. Number of Apple Stores in Manhattan = 7 (incl. one 24/365) Number of Apple Stores in NYC 5 Boroughs = 10 Number of stores Paris (incl. La Defense) = 4 Number of stores London = 5 Number of stores Berlin = 1 Jazz/Blues/all kinds of music, a city open 24/7 full of…

In all fairness, if you'd close your subways for part of the night, how will you keep your schizophrenic people out of sight? (sorry I mean, homeless, yes that's the root of their issues, obviously, the mumbling, drooling, rocking back and forth, all side-effects of homelessness clearly)

Ah, such memories of my visit to that vibrant city ...

Re: United removes first-class passenger to make room for 'higher-priority' traveler

#448
post #427

Earlier quoted context omitted.

OMG! you really like your Apple stores don't you? Apple stores say nothing about the vibrancy of the city. It basically states that the city mindlessly practices American consumerism that Apple needs 24/365 stores to keep up with demand. My experience of New York was tall buildings, narrow streets with garbage on the sidewalks, ridiculously expensive rents, homelessness on streets, lots of people walking around but v…

> "OMG! you really like your Apple stores don't you?" Well, with a 24/365 store I sleep easier at night knowing that if I need another unit or in person assistance when on a tight deadline I can get one. :-) Also, Apple products, Macs, iPhones, iPads, are the tools of choice for the creative industries (media, photo, fashion, software development, much engineering, ....) and so number of stores and a 24/365 store is…

Sounds like you like NYC a lot because it does many things the way they do it in NYC, way more than any other place that is NYC.

Which is a bit circular if you're trying to convince anyone else, but as a personal opinion that works fine (I'm serious, you like this sort of thing, good for you. Not so good for the homeless, which you just rather blatantly ignored--ouch--but hey there's probably worse places in the world so ehm yeah! good for you!).

Apple is not nearly as popular in Europe as it is in the US. Software development and engineering, definitely not. Graphics design, sure, but I feel that'll change soon. Sound design / music producing, I'd say about 50/50, but they'll just use both a Windows machine and a Mac in their studio because they like to have the best tools (and VSTs) of both.

> Well, with a 24/365 store I sleep easier at night knowing that if I need another unit or in person assistance when on a tight deadline I can get one. :-)

Not having tight deadlines at night so frequently that I'd need a 24/7 store is what'd make me sleep easier, personally.

Re: United removes first-class passenger to make room for 'higher-priority' traveler

#449
post #306

Earlier quoted context omitted.

AFAIK JetBlue doesn't overbook.

https://www.transportation.gov/sites/dot.gov/files/docs/reso... JetBlue overbooks 3x more than United does. See page 33.

No. JetBlue doesn't overbook. Starting in Q3-4 of 2016 JetBlue starting having fleet issues with the A321s and many times had to swap in a A320 (with ~50 fewer seats) due to mechanical issues with the newer A321s, which resulted in a massive spike in involuntary denied boardings. You can definitely argue that if you get bumped from your flight the cause doesn't matter much, but JetBlue apparently does NOT overbook at all... Which I respect.

Re: United removes first-class passenger to make room for 'higher-priority' traveler

#450

Been flying for 25 years, 1.5 million miles total, most of that on United. US airlines have been through hell over the last 16 years. Bankruptcies, union battles, fierce competition, and not to mention, the real threat that someone could blow up or intentionally crash the plane they're flying, all contributed to a mentality that the employees have to stick together to survive. The end result is that US airline employ…

> US airlines have been through hell over the last 16 years. Bankruptcies, union battles, fierce competition, and not to mention, the real threat that someone could blow up or intentionally crash the plane they're flying, all contributed to a mentality that the employees have to stick together to survive. So you say US market is more competitive than European and have more strikes than European airlines and less risk…

I said nothing about European airlines.

But I've wondered how much worse it would have been here if Ryan Air or Easy Jet had moved in.

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