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We haven't seen the worst of what gambling and prediction markets will do

derekthompson.org

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Re: We haven't seen the worst of what gambling and prediction markets will do

#431

Post by mquander »

mcmcmc wrote: post #132
bluetidepro wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I'm in senior leadership, and have made it clear that anyone who has worked on these products should not be hired. Can't say I agree with that specific take (and find it a bit naive to be honest), unless you're also not hiring anyone from companies like Amazon, Meta, and all the other tech companies that have also ruined/preyed on society in their own way just as much as any gambling app has.

I think the difference between the two is Amazon and Meta do provide some utility to balance it out, whereas gambling is purely a net negative on society. You can be young and naive enough to believe you're "making the world a better place" in big tech. You can't work on pure gambling products without being a scammer at heart; you know what you signed up for.

This comment would make more sense if it were before the new wave of prediction markets, which are high-profile gambling products clearly largely made and popularized by true believers who think they are making the world a better place.

Re: We haven't seen the worst of what gambling and prediction markets will do

#432

Post by FrustratedMonky »

blitzar wrote: post #62

Americans may be shocked to hear that in the rest of the world gambling has been a thing for centuries. We also have people under the age of 20 drinking alcohol. I am not suggesting in any way that gambling is good - but it wasnt invented last week in america

"Americans may be shocked to hear that in the rest of the world gambling has been a thing for centuries."

You've had online gambling for centuries? With phones, and apps?

Wherever you are from should really have tried selling this technology. While the US was still rolling out steam engines, you could have really cornered the cell phone market.

Re: We haven't seen the worst of what gambling and prediction markets will do

#433

Post by dang »

taurath wrote: post #94

The entire country seems built on taking advantage of people, from my vantage point right now. Whether it’s attention, drugs, or business/legal leverage, everyone is out for advantage and they’re not even pretending to care about people they affect.

We detached this subthread from https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=47535377.

Re: We haven't seen the worst of what gambling and prediction markets will do

#434

Post by dang »

amrocha wrote: post #420
JumpCrisscross wrote: post #357

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Nobody is going to attack the US if your government stopped trying to meddle in other countries affairs How did that work out for Ukraine? The idea that we live in a just world where everyone who has chaos rain down on them deserves it is so simply refuted even by a cursory glance at just modern history.

[flagged]

We've banned this account for repeatedly posting flamewar comments and ignoring our requests to stop.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

p.s. No, this is is not because of the account's political views; I haven't tracked them and don't know what they are. We just care about preserving this forum as a place for curious, respectful conversation, whatever one's views.

Re: We haven't seen the worst of what gambling and prediction markets will do

#435

Post by andsoitis »

CPLX wrote: post #421
WalterBright wrote: post #391

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It does both! No, it does not concentrate wealth. Wealth is not a fixed pie. In a free market, you get wealthy by creating wealth, not concentrating it. As for monopolies, competition is what prevents them.

Unregulated capitalism inevitably trends towards a mafia state with an oligarchic structure and concentrated monopolistic power. It’s just an empirical fact at this point. The engine that really drives innovation and wealth creation is regulated capitalism that preserves competitive markets by restraining anticompetitive behavior. If you’re ideologically attached to capitalism I have good news for you. That’s the app…

> Unregulated capitalism inevitably trends towards a mafia state with an oligarchic structure and concentrated monopolistic power. It’s just an empirical fact at this point.

Has there ever been a jurisdiction with unregulated capitalism? I'm unaware of any.

Even the most laissez-faire economies have had bedrock legal infrastructure: property rights enforcement, contract law, courts, which is regulation.

Maybe you’re thinking of anarcho-capitalism? But that has never worked at scale.

Re: We haven't seen the worst of what gambling and prediction markets will do

#436

Post by llmthrow0827 »

cam_l wrote: post #410
llmthrow0827 wrote: post #377

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The idea that prioritizing the good of society, rather than one's personal desires, is considered a "wild take" is just a reflection of the culture of narcissism you live in.

Again, it is kind of crazy to take polar opposite views on this. We mostly all grow up starting off with very few personal liberties and gaining them as we get older. We routinely take them away from people of they show they cannot be trusted with those liberties. At present that process is fairly blunt, but it could be more nuanced. And that doesn't have to mean micro judging every interaction like China's social cr…

It's not polar opposite views, I'm just saying that personal liberties are overrated not that they're inherently bad.

There are entire political schools of thought that put maximizing personal liberty above everything, and the trend in America has been to allow more vices at the cost a functioning society. Sports betting just being a recent example.

> And I think the best way of doing this is to put responsibility on the person or group causing the negative impact.

Agreed. There are people profiteering at the cost of society and they should be punished for it.

> What we need to do though is to value both society and personal liberty.

Also agreed. We are not really that far off in conclusions I believe.

Re: We haven't seen the worst of what gambling and prediction markets will do

#437

Post by dang »

mlmonkey wrote: post #191

I was reminded of this bizarre article: https://www.si.com/betting/2023/09/15/fake-indian-cricket-le...

Discussed a little bit here:

Creating a fake Indian cricket league - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37580599 - Sept 2023 (10 comments)

Re: We haven't seen the worst of what gambling and prediction markets will do

#438

Post by hunterpayne »

InsideOutSanta wrote: post #216
Chris2048 wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> made it clear that anyone who has worked on these products should not be hired As in, even a dev, HR, etc person having worked for an online gambling company? I feel this may be a slippery slope..

Everything is a slippery slope to somewhere. That doesn't mean you can't draw lines.

Doesn't mean it is wise to do so either. I promise you, 5 lines of your political beliefs and I can make you look like a hypocritical and ignorant a55hole to the world. And I can do so purely with data and various ethical guidelines.

I doubt you have though through most of your "beliefs" or learned of the policy consequences of many of your political positions. If you had, you wouldn't be such an absolutist. You still think you should be judge, jury and executioner over others? What are you, 6?

PS Your type of absolutist moralism has been the basis for most of humanities worst atrocities, stop it...you aren't more moral than other people.

Re: We haven't seen the worst of what gambling and prediction markets will do

#439

Post by joquarky »

senordevnyc wrote: post #387
UqWBcuFx6NV4r wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

Big “you can’t fire me, I quit!” vibes. I’m guessing the Venn diagram of “companies who won’t hire ex-faang” and “companies who can afford to hire ex-faang” is basically just two circles.

And none of them are actually hiring.

Re: We haven't seen the worst of what gambling and prediction markets will do

#440

Post by cortesoft »

llmthrow0827 wrote: post #377
cortesoft wrote: post #354

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Personal liberties being overrated is a wild take. I feel like this is one of those things that is easy to say when it isn't something you are interested in being infringed upon. I would be curious if you would feel the same way if people were trying to ban something you want to do.

The idea that prioritizing the good of society, rather than one's personal desires, is considered a "wild take" is just a reflection of the culture of narcissism you live in.

We probably could both be more nuanced with our statements.

What I hear when you say “the good of society” is that this means we would allow the majority to choose what is “for the good of society” and then enforce that on others.

You might not mean that. You are probably thinking of obvious “good” like not dying and not going bankrupt. But that is just what you are thinking of.

There are a lot of people who think other things are what is meant by “the good of society”. Lots of people think keeping trans people from having gender affirming surgery is “for the good of society”. Lots of people think requiring teaching the 10 commandments in school is “for the good of society”.

There are views like this on all sides. Some people think owning guns are for the good of society while some people thinking banning them is for the good of society. Some people think allowing people to eat meat harms society. Some people think gay marriage harms society.

So, do we allow all personal freedoms to be voted on by the populace? Or do we make the burden higher to infringe on individual freedoms?

Now, I do think we can place some limits when the damage far outweighs the cost of denying the freedom, but it has to really be worth it, because yes, individual freedom is very, very important.

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