Apple will soon receive 'made in America' chips from TSMC's Arizona fab • Hacker News Board

Re: Apple will soon receive 'made in America' chips from TSMC's Arizona fab

#431

Post by brickfaced » Wed, Jan 15, 2025, 4:35 AM UTC

krapp wrote: post #348

TheGamerUncle wrote: post #336

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is kind of disingenuous and dishonest to say that there is no value or meaning on those Americans born in American soil, a nation should prioritize the people that live on it or well at least care for them and make them useful for nation building in the future. Canada has proven that importing punjabis for almost two decades and ignoring the local people is not effective. So yeah there is a meaningful difference a…

>Canada has proven that importing punjabis for almost two decades and ignoring the local people is not effective. Curious, that's what Americans once said about the Irish and the Italians and the Germans and the French and the Poles and the Chinese and Jews and Catholics and Muslims and so on and on ad nauseum. It's just a generational crab mentality born from xenophobia. Every new wave of immigrants decides they're…

This type of solipsistic kumbaya slop is running face-first into reality, fast. People are different. Groups of people are different. Nations of people can be very different. They differ in meaningful and important and obvious ways. You'll live to see these differences continue to manifest in ways that will doubtless surprise you.

And the Ellis Islanders were at least mostly Christian, white, European. They shared a common cultural, historical, religious, and racial frame with native-born Americans. They could and did meaningfully assimilate. Despite this, that wave of migrants almost broke us. Anarchy, terrorism, riots, organized crime, et cetera. The Johnson-Reed Act was passed in response in 1924 and it slowed immigration to a crawl until the 1960s.

Today we have immigrants who speak utterly alien tongues, with no shared history or civilized tradition, arriving at breakneck pace, and who barely learn English because they can scrape by with apps and translation services, who stay in the cultural bubble of their country of origin, who don't see an American culture worth assimilating to. Especially among so-called high skill immigrants, they pick up a US passport and immediately see me as a worse or lesser "American" than they are. That's nuts. The melting pot, if one ever existed, has broken down. What's happening now is something quite different, and it's not good for me or my fellow Americans.

Re: Apple will soon receive 'made in America' chips from TSMC's Arizona fab

#432

Post by brickfaced » Wed, Jan 15, 2025, 4:36 AM UTC

vikramkr wrote: post #365

brickfaced wrote: post #305

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The US didn't win World War 2, break the sound barrier, or put a man on the Moon only or primarily due to immigrant workers. We scoured the country's public school system for the sharpest young minds, sent them to institutions of higher learning with rigorous curricula, and found them positions in industry, government, or the military which made good use of their talent. Fetishizing the "nation of immigrants" narrati…

If you want to pick an era of technological progress to make that point maybe don't pick the one that involves America becoming a superpower by putting a bomb invented by Jewish refugees on a rocket build by ex Nazi scientists after a physics revolution where be basically got to go and take all of Germany's top talent lol

[flagged]

Re: Apple will soon receive 'made in America' chips from TSMC's Arizona fab

#433

Post by brickfaced » Wed, Jan 15, 2025, 4:39 AM UTC

mcphage wrote: post #415

brickfaced wrote: post #305

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The US didn't win World War 2, break the sound barrier, or put a man on the Moon only or primarily due to immigrant workers. We scoured the country's public school system for the sharpest young minds, sent them to institutions of higher learning with rigorous curricula, and found them positions in industry, government, or the military which made good use of their talent. Fetishizing the "nation of immigrants" narrati…

> Fetishizing the "nation of immigrants" narrative at the expensive of the native-born Americans who actually built most of this country's prosperity is, at best, ahistorical. Most of those native-born Americans were the children or grandchildren of immigrants.

What do you think a nation is? Is it a sports team or economic zone that hands out name tags to whoever steps off the boat with the right attitude? Or is it a specific group of people in a specific place with a shared language, lineage, culture, history, faith, and common destiny? I submit to you that it's the latter, and no empire nor state organized as the former can endure.

Re: Apple will soon receive 'made in America' chips from TSMC's Arizona fab

#434

Post by defrost » Wed, Jan 15, 2025, 4:43 AM UTC

brickfaced wrote: post #430

lostlogin wrote: post #374

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The US didn't win World War 2 The USSR would like a word.

The USSR never did pay us back for the massive, unprecedented, war-winning aid we delivered to them under Lend-Lease. Half a million trucks, thousands of tanks, tens of thousands of airplanes, millions of tons of food. And what did we get out of it? An implacable evil empire that sat like a boot on the neck of Eastern Europe for another 50 years after our "victory."

  A total of $50.1 billion (equivalent to $672 billion in 2023 when accounting for inflation) worth of supplies was shipped, or 17% of the total war expenditures of the U.S.

  In all, $31.4 billion went to the United Kingdom, $11.3 billion to the Soviet Union, $3.2 billion to France, $1.6 billion to China, and the remaining $2.6 billion to other Allies.

  Material delivered under the act was supplied at no cost, to be used until returned or destroyed.

  In practice, most equipment was destroyed, although some hardware (such as ships) was returned after the war.

  Supplies that arrived after the termination date were sold to the United Kingdom at a large discount for £1.075 billion, using long-term loans from the United States, which were finally repaid in 2006.

  Similarly, the Soviet Union repaid $722 million in 1971, with the remainder of the debt written off.

~ https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lend-Lease

Re: Apple will soon receive 'made in America' chips from TSMC's Arizona fab

#435

Post by otabdeveloper4 » Wed, Jan 15, 2025, 5:06 AM UTC

tivert wrote: post #118

otabdeveloper4 wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you owned a small business you'd be singing a very different tune.

> If you owned a small business you'd be singing a very different tune. The problem with advertising is that a little bit done honestly is actually good and fine. What we actually have way, way too much, and it's often dishonest and manipulative. It's a similar thing with finance. It's necessary, but way too many talented people are spending their energies on it. Black and white thinking doesn't really capture the si…

Maybe 1 percent of Google's headcount is actually working on ad technology. There isn't some brain drain problem where people are doing ads instead of curing cancer.

Re: Apple will soon receive 'made in America' chips from TSMC's Arizona fab

#436

Post by tcmart14 » Wed, Jan 15, 2025, 5:48 AM UTC

brickfaced wrote: post #429

tcmart14 wrote: post #343

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We literally put a man on the moon because we acquired Werner Von Braun and used his plans... I mean, we probably would have eventually done it, but the timeline likely would have been different and the soviets might have beaten us to the moon, but the time line we are in, we had a space program as successful as it was because we acquired German scientists who were already thinking about these problems a even a decad…

1,200 men of the same ethnic and religious background of the median American, brought over in a one-time arrangement in the wake of the most destructive war ever fought, versus 100,000 Indian H1B visas granted annually. That's just India, not counting other countries or visa types. Okay. Sure. Totally the same. We couldn't have made it back to the Moon without a million indentured IT workers.

I really have no clue what you're trying to say. You presented as a bad historical example for your argument, landing on the moon. I showed how that was a flawed example and now you're talking about a people from India in IT and the Artemis program and an accomplishment of it that hasn't even happened yet. Looks like your trying to pick an argument of H1B visas with my comment that had no mention of it.

Re: Apple will soon receive 'made in America' chips from TSMC's Arizona fab

#437

Post by dh2022 » Wed, Jan 15, 2025, 5:54 AM UTC

adamc wrote: post #310

audunw wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But they don’t have energy independence or food security yet, which is kind of a hard requirement for an invasion. There’s not enough rail lines and gas pipelines from Russia to feed them with significant quantities of fossil fuels. Imagine how bad Russias invasion of Ukraine would’ve been without energy independence and food security. The invasion of Taiwan is an order of magnitude more difficult, and Taiwan now has…

I would expect an invasion to prompt the US navy to put up a blockade, disrupting China's oil supplies and generally making it very hard to keep their economy going. Admittedly, Trump is a wild card; he's random enough that it is hard to be sure what would happen. I do not think China could survive a blockade.

Huh? China will get all the energy it needs from Russia. Plus China is the leader in renewables production.

Re: Apple will soon receive 'made in America' chips from TSMC's Arizona fab

#438

Post by lostlogin » Wed, Jan 15, 2025, 6:14 AM UTC

brickfaced wrote: post #430

lostlogin wrote: post #374

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The US didn't win World War 2 The USSR would like a word.

The USSR never did pay us back for the massive, unprecedented, war-winning aid we delivered to them under Lend-Lease. Half a million trucks, thousands of tanks, tens of thousands of airplanes, millions of tons of food. And what did we get out of it? An implacable evil empire that sat like a boot on the neck of Eastern Europe for another 50 years after our "victory."

This is all correct. It’s also hard to believe that any other country could have sustained the casualties the USSR took and it saved lives for the other allies by diverting troops to the Eastern Front. The US had nearly 500k deaths, the USSR (post war borders) had something like 26 million.

Both sides needed each other. From a US perspective, trading money for lives likely seemed worth it.

The USSR was an objectively terrible regime, and most the Russian governments that have followed on from it have been too. Underestimating the deaths Russian leadership is willing to tolerate has proven unwise a few too many times.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_War_II_casualties

Re: Apple will soon receive 'made in America' chips from TSMC's Arizona fab

#439

Post by anonzzzies » Wed, Jan 15, 2025, 6:33 AM UTC

threeseed wrote: post #334

adamtaylor_13 wrote: post #320

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A business’s viability outside of advertising doesn’t change the morality of advertising. Regardless of which side of the camp you fall on, you can’t argue that ads are “good” just because some businesses need them to survive. In fact, I’d wager if a business NEEDS ads to survive, it’s probably a net negative on society as a whole. I won’t die on that hill, but that’s my hunch.

Your entire premise is ridiculous. Advertising is nothing more than bringing attention to your product to your target customer. And without this so called immoral behaviour I fail to see how any business works.

That's when you call any type of promotion advertising, in that case, sure, there is some innocent advertising. People here are (obviously) talking about 'modern' advertising which is what google/fb etc are doing which is just plain bad for everyone except for Google shareholders (I would imagine, besides money, it's not even good for the people working on it as it must do your head in to be a brilliant engineer and then working on tech so miserable and foul as that).

Re: Apple will soon receive 'made in America' chips from TSMC's Arizona fab

#440

Post by ttul » Wed, Jan 15, 2025, 6:59 AM UTC

coconut08 wrote: post #57

ttul wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Given that there may be a 25% chance that China invades Taiwan by 2030, having the ability to package SOTA chips in the US by 2027 seems "soon enough".

where did you get that number from

Metaculus - this is the median prediction.