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Ageless Linux – Software for humans of indeterminate age

agelesslinux.org

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Re: Ageless Linux – Software for humans of indeterminate age

#421

Post by Jolter »

muyuu wrote: post #393
ab_testing wrote: post #255

Why are Linux operating system providers taking it upon themselves to comply with the California law especially if they are not selling anything. Since it is just a downloadable piece of software then it is up to California state to set up a firewall to protect themselves from such harmful software. Let's say I am a generic linux developer who develops variants of Debian Linux while sitting in my basement in any part…

because the laws are coming with massive fines and penalties that will apply to people not even selling anything unless you can confidently dodge American law enforcement, which is a big ask unless you are solidly anonymous somehow, then you are forced to react in some way

I think you’re replying to someone based outside of California.

Re: Ageless Linux – Software for humans of indeterminate age

#422

Post by Jolter »

izacus wrote: post #372
ab_testing wrote: post #255

Why are Linux operating system providers taking it upon themselves to comply with the California law especially if they are not selling anything. Since it is just a downloadable piece of software then it is up to California state to set up a firewall to protect themselves from such harmful software. Let's say I am a generic linux developer who develops variants of Debian Linux while sitting in my basement in any part…

Because despite the screeching, having good parental controls standardized across distros and OSS software is an idea that benefits Linux as a whole.

Do you think the mechanisms required by this law, as described in the linked article, constitute ”good parental control”?

Re: Ageless Linux – Software for humans of indeterminate age

#424

Post by 28304283409234 »

nextos wrote: post #14

Something remarkable and unsettling is how the age verification debate has popped up almost simultaneously in the US, UK, and EU. With the same logical fallacies. Pretty telling about how transnational lobbies and their interests work. Controlling what children do online is a solved problem: Parenting and parental control applications.

Because the effects on our children is popping up simultaneously. Because globalization. Because every teenager is influenced by the likes of Andrew Tate and series like Adolescence. Either directly or indirectly.

This is what we wanted. We wanted a connected world. Be careful what you wish for.

Re: Ageless Linux – Software for humans of indeterminate age

#425

Post by zelphirkalt »

sophrosyne42 wrote: post #78
softwaredoug wrote: post #23

The problem is we’re regulating individual behavior by adding to the surveillance apparatus. We should be regulating the companies and dismantling the surveillance that makes the apps addictive to kids. It’s a way of socializing the losses, this time you lose civil liberties and they get to keep acting unrestricted

Regulating the companies also socializes the costs of implementing age verification measures. The correct solution that does not do this is to put liability on the parents.

All while these companies employ thousands of people whose only job it is to bypass parent's controls and find a way to get children hooked anyway? A mere slight imbalance, I would say ...

Re: Ageless Linux – Software for humans of indeterminate age

#426

Post by tstrimple »

drnick1 wrote: post #398
tstrimple wrote: post #364

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Looks like you're yet another person speaking out of their ass. There is no age attestation in the California bill. You specify an age at account creation that sites and apps must query. And they cannot fall back on other methods like uploading your drivers license to websites which is rapidly becoming a thing in red states. There is no verification. Just a system that enables your OS to respond to age queries and pr…

> You specify an age at account creation that sites and apps must query. The Internet has been a free place for 30+ years and I don't see a reason to change that. I grew up with the ability to access all kinds of content on the Internet, in an unrestricted manner, and it is sad to see that decision makers now want to take this away from younger generations. We must absolutely resist any attempt at profiling Internet…

You grew up without parental oversight. I did too. This is an attempt to give parents the tools to manage what their children see on the internet. I disagree with that parental oversight probably far, far more than you do. I think it should be a crime when a parent indoctrinates their child into a religion. But this is a counter to far worse laws like requiring you to upload your photo ID to websites to get access. This explicitly forbids that sort of privacy violating situation.

Re: Ageless Linux – Software for humans of indeterminate age

#427

Post by enoint »

28304283409234 wrote: post #424
nextos wrote: post #14

Something remarkable and unsettling is how the age verification debate has popped up almost simultaneously in the US, UK, and EU. With the same logical fallacies. Pretty telling about how transnational lobbies and their interests work. Controlling what children do online is a solved problem: Parenting and parental control applications.

Because the effects on our children is popping up simultaneously. Because globalization. Because every teenager is influenced by the likes of Andrew Tate and series like Adolescence. Either directly or indirectly. This is what we wanted. We wanted a connected world. Be careful what you wish for.

That isn’t the cause of this phenomenon.

Re: Ageless Linux – Software for humans of indeterminate age

#428

Post by irusensei »

Anyone ever heard about the story of how Phill Zimmerman made an absolute clown of the US federal government by publishing the source code of PGP as a book?

History of computing and open source is full of clever subversiveness. If back in the past hackers had the same attitude crying about complying otherwise fines we would have nothing today.

Re: Ageless Linux – Software for humans of indeterminate age

#429

Post by jacquesm »

tstrimple wrote: post #426
drnick1 wrote: post #398

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> You specify an age at account creation that sites and apps must query. The Internet has been a free place for 30+ years and I don't see a reason to change that. I grew up with the ability to access all kinds of content on the Internet, in an unrestricted manner, and it is sad to see that decision makers now want to take this away from younger generations. We must absolutely resist any attempt at profiling Internet…

You grew up without parental oversight. I did too. This is an attempt to give parents the tools to manage what their children see on the internet. I disagree with that parental oversight probably far, far more than you do. I think it should be a crime when a parent indoctrinates their child into a religion. But this is a counter to far worse laws like requiring you to upload your photo ID to websites to get access. T…

> This is an attempt to give parents the tools to manage what their children see on the internet.

You're just gullible.

There is no website that I've ever uploaded my driving license or other ID to, the only place that I need that for is my bank and that's about a real world relationship, not about an online one.

Any website that wants me to verify my age is going to have to do without me, that's just none of their business. What children see on the internet is not going to change because of this, any parent that wants to modify their kids' behavior is going to have to do some actual parenting rather than to rely on gatekeeping technology because kids are far more capable than their parents when it comes to circumventing such restrictions.

Re: Ageless Linux – Software for humans of indeterminate age

#430

Post by enoint »

zelphirkalt wrote: post #420
gmueckl wrote: post #335

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am not a lawyer. Still, my two cents are: You didn't geobock the download or prompt for then user's address first in your scenario. So it may constitute export because it would be reasonable to assume that you clearly intended to make it available worldwide. Phil Zimmerman was investigated for illegaly exporting munitions because he made PGP available via FTP. The case was settled, so I don't know whether this argu…

Maybe some investigation worked this way, but to me it seems obvious twisting of supposed intention. If I don't geoblock, it is not necessarily because I want the thing to arrive somewhere. It can simply be, that I don't care who downloads it, or I don't want to waste my time with crazy laws, that I might not even know about. If Kiribati decides to have a new law, I probably won't even ever hear about it. Suddenly, m…

If you gate access behind a Terms of Service, any violation is potentially a felony in USA. Any human who later litigated would have clicked Accept, or subverted your popup like a hacker.
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